Question on mountain bikes
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A few days ago, I asked a question about why road bikes
weren't often seen with mudguards, and I got the quite
reasonable reply that roadies want to go as fast as
possible, and mudguards slowed them down.
It got me to thinking about why *mountain bikes* weren't
often seen with mudguards - and I'm talking about *real*
mudguards, not those bits of plastic that are attached to
the seat post. I don't think the speed argument holds
here, and besides MTB riders would *benefit* from guards
since they have to go across all sorts of muddy terrain.
So - why not?
--
Akin
aknak at aksoto dot idps dot co dot uk
On Sat, 29 May 2004 12:46:44 +0100, Wild Wind wrote:
> A few days ago, I asked a question about why road bikes
> weren't often seen with mudguards, and I got the quite
> reasonable reply that roadies want to go as fast as
> possible, and mudguards slowed them down.
>
> It got me to thinking about why *mountain bikes* weren't
> often seen with mudguards - and I'm talking about *real*
> mudguards, not those bits of plastic that are attached to
> the seat post. I don't think the speed argument holds
> here, and besides MTB riders would *benefit* from guards
> since they have to go across all sorts of muddy terrain.
> So - why not?
At least...
1) Stuff can get caught between the wheels and the
mudguards, which slows you down.
2) If your front mudguard gets caught up in your wheel, you
can get thrown over the handlebars. This is more likely
on a mountain-bike because of the amount of abuse they
get, and because of the amount of branches etc... that
might be on the tracks.
On the other hand, when I was about 12 I got mud in both
eyes at once, steered off the road, somersaulted over the
handlebars and landed flat on my back. Ouch!
AC
Wild Wind wrote:
> A few days ago, I asked a question about why road bikes
> weren't often seen with mudguards, and I got the quite
> reasonable reply that roadies want to go as fast as
> possible, and mudguards slowed them down.
And also get in the way of wheel changing/checking and add
unnecessary complication.
> It got me to thinking about why *mountain bikes* weren't
> often seen with mudguards - and I'm talking about *real*
> mudguards, not those bits of plastic that are attached to
> the seat post. I don't think the speed argument holds
> here, and besides MTB riders would *benefit* from guards
> since they have to go across all sorts of muddy terrain.
> So - why not?
AC has given the reasons serious off-roaders prefer not to
use them. Manufacturers also save money. In fact that's the
main reason MTBs sold for every-day road use don' have them,
coupled with the fact that young/trendy people think they
look "uncool" so marketing is easier without them.
~PB
"Wild Wind" <nobody@blackhole.com> wrote in message
news:2hrbj9Fg2sinU1@uni-berlin.de...
> It got me to thinking about why *mountain bikes* weren't
> often seen with mudguards - and I'm talking about *real*
> mudguards, not those bits of plastic that are attached to
> the seat post. I don't think the speed argument holds
> here, and besides MTB riders would *benefit* from guards
> since they have to go across all sorts of muddy terrain.
> So - why not?
Also they get sold without them fitted and people can't
be bothered to buy and fit them after they've bought
their new bike.
--
Simon Mason Anlaby East Yorkshire. 53°44'N 0°26'W
http://www.simonmason.karoo.net (http://www.simonmason.karoo.net/)
in message <2hrbj9Fg2sinU1@uni-berlin.de>, Wild Wind
('nobody@blackhole.com') wrote:
> A few days ago, I asked a question about why road bikes
> weren't often seen with mudguards, and I got the quite
> reasonable reply that roadies want to go as fast as
> possible, and mudguards slowed them down.
>
> It got me to thinking about why *mountain bikes* weren't
> often seen with mudguards - and I'm talking about *real*
> mudguards, not those bits of plastic that are attached to
> the seat post. I don't think the speed argument holds
> here, and besides MTB riders would *benefit* from guards
> since they have to go across all sorts of muddy terrain.
> So - why not?
Is it not obvious?
No, I suppose not.
Because, if you're dealing with large amounts of mud,
mudguards clog up and you can't cycle. The reason for the
bits of plastic attached to the seatpost is that they do
deflect a surprisingly large proportion of the mud and you
don't get home with a brown stripe up your back, without
clogging up. The things that go under your downtube are
useless. I haven't tried the things that go under the fork
crown (actually, it's thirty years since I've had any
mudguards on any of my bikes, but I haven't tried them on
anyone else's bikes either). After all, if you're going
mountain biking in muddy weather you're going to get
seriously muddy anyway, and the difference a mudguard would
make isn't worth the harassment.
--
simon@jasmine.org.uk (Simon Brooke)
http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/
The trouble with Simon is that he only opens his
mouth to change feet. ;; of me, by a 'friend'
> >
> > It got me to thinking about why *mountain bikes* weren't
> > often seen with mudguards - and I'm talking about *real*
> > mudguards, not those bits of plastic that are attached
> > to the seat post. I don't think the speed argument holds
> > here, and besides MTB riders would *benefit* from guards
> > since they have to go across all sorts of muddy terrain.
> > So - why not?
You've nearly answered your own question...
Muddy terrain can quickly enlarge a tyre's girth to the
extent that it will fill the gap between the tyre and the
mudgard causing an amazing amount of drag and damage to the
mudgard as it gets dragged forwards.
*Real* mudguards for mountain bikes are those the get
affixed to the seat post and down tube of the frame giving
ample clearance for mud and gunge.
Another poster has pointed out the increased likelihood of
getting the mudgard stays snagged.
In article <2hrg0gFgf1c6U1@uni-berlin.de>,
pclemantine{remove_fruit} @biggs.tc says...
> It got me to thinking about why *mountain bikes* weren't
> > often seen with mudguards - and I'm talking about *real*
> > mudguards, not those bits of plastic that are attached
> > to the seat post. I don't think the speed argument holds
> > here, and besides MTB riders would *benefit* from guards
> > since they have to go across all sorts of muddy terrain.
> > So - why not?
>
A lot of cyclists think they look uncool. Also, with so
many variations of front and rear suspension it would
be difficult to manufacture a pair that would be
universal fitting.
--
Mark (MSA) This post is packaged by intellectual weight, not
volume. Some settling of contents may have occurred during
transmission
Simon Brooke wrote:
> The things that go under your downtube are useless. I
> haven't tried the things that go under the fork crown
> (actually, it's thirty years since I've had any mudguards
> on any of my bikes, but I haven't tried them on anyone
> else's bikes either). After all, if you're going mountain
> biking in muddy weather you're going to get seriously
> muddy anyway, and the difference a mudguard would make
> isn't worth the harassment.
The things under your fork crown work quite well and I
disagree about not worth it in muddy weather. Crudguards
as they are called do keep a significant amount of mud
and water off you which can make a big difference if its
cold and wet.
Tony
"Simon Brooke" <simon@jasmine.org.uk> wrote in message
news:4lano1-i5e.ln1@gododdin.internal.jasmine.org.uk...
> in message <2hrbj9Fg2sinU1@uni-berlin.de>, Wild Wind
> ('nobody@blackhole.com') wrote:
>
> > A few days ago, I asked a question about why road bikes
> > weren't often seen with mudguards, and I got the quite
> > reasonable reply that roadies want to go as fast as
> > possible, and mudguards slowed them down.
> >
> > It got me to thinking about why *mountain bikes* weren't
> > often seen with mudguards - and I'm talking about *real*
> > mudguards, not those bits of plastic that are attached
> > to the seat post. I don't think the speed argument holds
> > here, and besides MTB riders would *benefit* from guards
> > since they have to go across all sorts of muddy terrain.
> > So - why not?
I believe that it's mostly down to fashion. On the continent
it's common to see serious MTBers riding bikes wearing
guards during the non-summer seasons.
> Because, if you're dealing with large amounts of mud,
> mudguards clog up and you can't cycle.
In Cambridgeshire, the FORKS clog up and you can't cycle.
Guess why there are a lot of brick kilns about?
> The reason for the bits of plastic attached to the
> seatpost is that they do deflect a surprisingly large
> proportion of the mud and you don't get home with a brown
> stripe up your back, without clogging up.
Amen brother Simon.
> The things that go under your downtube are useless.
Totally. They only stop stuff that would have stuck to
your downtube.
> I haven't tried the things that go under the fork crown
> (actually, it's thirty years since I've had any mudguards
> on any of my bikes, but I haven't tried them on anyone
> else's bikes either). After all, if you're going mountain
> biking in muddy weather you're going to get seriously
> muddy anyway, and the difference a mudguard would make
> isn't worth the harassment.
No, the front guards that mount under the fork crown really
stop A LOT of mud and don't clog easily.
They especially stop the worst parts of the mud, which is
the bits that fly forward and upwards off the front wheel
and are stopped by air resistance to allow your mouth to
catch up when you are going quickly.
--
-- M.
"Tony Raven" <junk@raven-family.com> wrote in message
news:2hscpaFgj34cU1@uni-berlin.de...
> Simon Brooke wrote:
> > The things that go under your downtube are useless. I
> > haven't tried the things that go under the fork crown
> > (actually, it's thirty years since I've had any
> > mudguards on any of my bikes, but I haven't tried them
> > on anyone else's bikes either). After all, if you're
> > going mountain biking in muddy weather you're going to
> > get seriously muddy anyway, and the difference a
> > mudguard would make isn't worth the harassment.
>
> The things under your fork crown work quite well and I
> disagree about not worth it in muddy weather. Crudguards
> as they are called do keep a significant amount of mud and
> water off you which can make a big difference if its cold
> and wet.
Damn! I just agreed with you AGAIN!
:-)
--
-- M.
Mark South wrote:
>
> In Cambridgeshire, the FORKS clog up and you can't cycle.
> Guess why there are a lot of brick kilns about?
>
Tell me about it. One of the main reasons for switching to
disk brakes was because the V's trapped the mud and helped
the clogging. Had an instance once where the mud stopped the
brake arms moving together. Fortunately the mud also caused
enough drag to slow me down and stop me.
BTW I think its not the mud but the subtle blend of mud and
dried grass to bind it all together.
Tony
"Tony Raven" <junk@raven-family.com> wrote in message
news:2hscpaFgj34cU1@uni-berlin.de...
>> The things under your fork crown work quite well and I
>> disagree about not
> worth it in muddy weather. Crudguards as they are called
> do keep a significant amount of mud and water off you
> which can make a big
difference if
I fitted the steerer tube type last winter and am very
impressed. The DT type are great for keeping flung dung from
hitting the riders face, not pleasant, but the fuller ones
give protection to the riders jacket which means it doesn't
need washing so often and with the finnicky nature of
laundering good quality jackets this is quite a plus point.
I started using a rear Crud Guard years ago and it was
perceived as very uncool, so what, my shorts and saddles
have all benefitted from not being ground away by wet grit
as well as increasing my comfort.
--
Regards, Pete
Mark South wrote:
>
> Damn! I just agreed with you AGAIN!
>
> :-)
No you didn't
Tony ;-)
"Tony Raven" <junk@raven-family.com> wrote in message
news:2hsf4iFgpd34U1@uni-berlin.de...
> Mark South wrote:
> >
> > In Cambridgeshire, the FORKS clog up and you can't
> > cycle. Guess why there are a lot of brick kilns about?
> >
> Tell me about it. One of the main reasons for switching to
> disk brakes was because the V's trapped the mud and helped
> the clogging. Had an instance once where the mud stopped
> the brake arms moving together. Fortunately the mud also
> caused enough drag to slow me down and stop me.
Clearly I do not need to tell you about it!
> BTW I think its not the mud but the subtle blend of mud
> and dried grass to bind it all together.
The grass may help. If one wants brick bicycle wheels one
only has to shove them in the kiln after a few miles on the
bridleway.
One January I carried my 20 lb MTB the last 2 miles home.
The wheels would no longer turn at all. And the bike + mud
weighed 40 lbs when I got home and weighed it.
--
Mark South: World Citizen, Net Denizen
Mark South wrote:
>
> The grass may help. If one wants brick bicycle wheels one
> only has to shove them in the kiln after a few miles on
> the bridleway.
>
The local term is, I believe, "mud polos"
Tony
PS A small pointing trowel in the toolkit is useful if you
need to excavate your wheels and forks on a ride.
in message <2hsf4iFgpd34U1@uni-berlin.de>, Tony Raven
('junk@raven-family.com') wrote:
> BTW I think its not the mud but the subtle blend of mud
> and dried grass to bind it all together.
AKA 'daub', very popular for building houses in that part of
the world.
--
simon@jasmine.org.uk (Simon Brooke)
http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/ "The result is a language
that... not even its mother could love. Like the camel,
Common Lisp is a horse designed by committee. Camels do have
their uses." ;; Scott Fahlman, 7 March 1995
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