Road Racing Tires - Opinion Request

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Hello,

I have a road bike with 700 X 28 tires.

I need new tires, what are u recommending for thin racing
type tires. I go cycling on Sundays with a club about 100 km
both flats and hills. I know there are allot of tire
companies out there, so I could use a hand before I order
them or go looking for them.

Thank you

Churchill wrote:
> Hello,
>
> I have a road bike with 700 X 28 tires.
>
> I need new tires, what are u recommending for thin racing
> type tires. I go cycling on Sundays with a club about 100
> km both flats and hills. I know there are allot of tire
> companies out there, so I could use a hand before I order
> them or go looking for them.
>
> Thank you
>
>

I'm 6'2" ~175lb and ride 23's at 120 psi. Prefer Michilin
Hi-Lite's or Carbons, avging 1000 miles per puncture
(knock wood) When I rode on Hutchinson Carbon Comps I got
a flat almost every time out, as I've been informed, due
to my higher weight. They apparently serve riders ~140 lb
much better.

"Churchill" <yes@yes.com> writes:

> Hello,
>
> I have a road bike with 700 X 28 tires.
>
> I need new tires, what are u recommending for thin racing
> type tires. I go cycling on Sundays with a club about 100
> km both flats and hills. I know there are allot of tire
> companies out there, so I could use a hand before I order
> them or go looking for them.
>
> Thank you
>
You will not go far wrong with Michelin Pro-Race. I use glue
ons myself, but Michelin, whether glued or wired on, are
exceptional value for money.

--
le Vent a Dos. Davey Crockett http://petition.eurolinux.org (http://petition.eurolinux.org/)
; http://members.rogers.com/sixday/sixday.html Please
address all replies to the list

On Wed, 30 Jun 2004 20:54:58 -0400, "Churchill" <yes@yes.com> wrote:

>Hello,
>
>I have a road bike with 700 X 28 tires.
>
>I need new tires, what are u recommending for thin racing
>type tires. I go cycling on Sundays with a club about 100
>km both flats and hills. I know there are allot of tire
>companies out there, so I could use a hand before I order
>them or go looking for them.
>
>Thank you

On Wed, 30 Jun 2004 20:54:58 -0400, "Churchill" <yes@yes.com> wrote:

>Hello,
>
>I have a road bike with 700 X 28 tires.
>
>I need new tires, what are u recommending for thin racing
>type tires. I go cycling on Sundays with a club about 100
>km both flats and hills. I know there are allot of tire
>companies out there, so I could use a hand before I order
>them or go looking for them.
>
>Thank you
>

If you are keeping up with the club rides, why do you want
to change? What don't you like about the present tires (what
*are* the present tires?)? What are you expecting to get out
of thin tires?

http://www.roadbikereview.com/Tires-
Clincher/PLS_2489crx.aspx

I really like Vredestein Fortezzas. Right now I have 23mm,
but the next set will be 25mm.

"Richard Adams" <ackthpt@concentric.net> wrote in message
news:cbvpid$suj@dispatch.concentric.net...
> Churchill wrote:
> > Hello,
> >
> > I have a road bike with 700 X 28 tires.
> >
> > I need new tires, what are u recommending for thin
> > racing type tires. I
go
> > cycling on Sundays with a club about 100 km both flats
> > and hills. I
know
> > there are allot of tire companies out there, so I could
> > use a hand
before I
> > order them or go looking for them.
> >
> > Thank you
> >
> >
>
> I'm 6'2" ~175lb and ride 23's at 120 psi. Prefer Michilin
> Hi-Lite's or Carbons, avging 1000 miles per puncture
> (knock wood) When I rode on Hutchinson Carbon Comps I got
> a flat almost every time out, as I've been informed, due
> to my higher weight. They apparently serve riders ~140 lb
> much better.

What would be the difference between 23's and 28's ??

What does the 700 stand for ??

700 X 28

Thanks

On Wed, 30 Jun 2004 22:20:51 -0400, "Churchill" <yes@yes.com> wrote:

>
>What does the 700 stand for ??
>

http://www.sheldonbrown.com/tires.html

"Dan Daniel" <ddandan.remove@pacbell.net> wrote in message
news:1rt6e0lfifhgat5nfod6l3ntbqq61891ou@4ax.com...
> On Wed, 30 Jun 2004 20:54:58 -0400, "Churchill"
> <yes@yes.com> wrote:
>
> >Hello,
> >
> >I have a road bike with 700 X 28 tires.
> >
> >I need new tires, what are u recommending for thin racing
> >type tires. I
go
> >cycling on Sundays with a club about 100 km both flats
> >and hills. I know there are allot of tire companies out
> >there, so I could use a hand before
I
> >order them or go looking for them.
> >
> >Thank you
> >
>
> If you are keeping up with the club rides, why do you want
> to change? What don't you like about the present tires
> (what *are* the present tires?)? What are you expecting to
> get out of thin tires?
>
> http://www.roadbikereview.com/Tires-
> Clincher/PLS_2489crx.aspx
>
> I really like Vredestein Fortezzas. Right now I have 23mm,
> but the next set will be 25mm.

Hi,

I was on my second set of 700 X 28 and they needed to be
replaced. I picked up my bike today and they had 700 X 28
Continental GatorSkins. I noticed they were a little wider
than my previous 700 X 28s, so I thought I would ask here on
the newsgroup.

Subsequent to my first post, I have gone to three
websites, Continental, Michelin and the one you posted
above. I believe I should have gone with the 23mm or
perhaps the 25mm's.

Oh well, it is to late to change now, perhaps next year.

Is there a significant difference between these sizes for
Sunday club cyclists ? Would I notice 'significant' less
drag and more force ?

Cordially

Stick with the wider tyres. They will be substantially more
comfortable on any sort of bumpy road and very little
slower. They will also, on the average, last longer.

Nick

"Churchill" <yes@yes.com> wrote in message
news:KbLEc.186138$207.1406557@news20.bellglobal.com...
>
> I was on my second set of 700 X 28 and they needed to be
> replaced. I
picked
> up my bike today and they had 700 X 28 Continental
> GatorSkins. I noticed they were a little wider than my
> previous 700 X 28s, so I thought I would ask here on the
> newsgroup.
>
> Subsequent to my first post, I have gone to three
> websites, Continental, Michelin and the one you posted
> above. I believe I should have gone with the 23mm or
> perhaps the 25mm's.
>
> Oh well, it is to late to change now, perhaps next year.
>
> Is there a significant difference between these sizes for
> Sunday club cyclists ? Would I notice 'significant' less
> drag and more force ?
>
> Cordially

On Wed, 30 Jun 2004 23:10:14 -0400, "Churchill" <yes@yes.com> wrote:

>
>I was on my second set of 700 X 28 and they needed to be
>replaced. I picked up my bike today and they had 700 X 28
>Continental GatorSkins. I noticed they were a little wider
>than my previous 700 X 28s, so I thought I would ask here
>on the newsgroup.
>

Suggestion- maybe repost with a more specific subject line?

>Subsequent to my first post, I have gone to three
>websites, Continental, Michelin and the one you posted
>above. I believe I should have gone with the 23mm or
>perhaps the 25mm's.
>

Again I'll ask- what makes you think this? What have you
been hearing or reading to make you think that 23s are the
way to go?

There are a lot of equipment things in the bike world that
seemed to be based primarily on either 'that's what everyone
else uses' or 'that's what professional racers use.'
Sometimes these are great answers- let others do the user
testing and I can benefit from their experience without
spending tons of money. And sometimes they are horrible
answers, as idiotic as looking at a FoxNews call-in 'poll'
to decide what you should think about an issue.

>Oh well, it is to late to change now, perhaps next year.
>

If you can afford it, nothing wrong with having more than
one set of tires. An idea- ask someone on your club ride if
they have an old set of 23s that you could try. Many regular
bikers develop a collection of tires that are near the end
of their life but they can't bring themselves to throw them
out. Or ask at the bike shop- people will come in to get new
tires put on and not care about the old ones, and some of
them are in fine shape. They might sell you some used ones
for a few bucks apiece.

>Is there a significant difference between these sizes for
>Sunday club cyclists ? Would I notice 'significant' less
>drag and more force ?
>
>Cordially

What do you consider significant? To some people four
seconds over a 30 mile time trial is significant. To some
people flat tires are the biggest drag going and a fatter
tire can reduce them.

I'm not a racer and not up on all the aerodynamic and
rolling resistance issues. Somewhere there must be tests and
solid info on these kind of questions; again, maybe a more
specific subject line will draw out more technically
sophisticated people.

On Wed, 30 Jun 2004 21:46:57 -0700, Dan Daniel
<ddandan.remove@pacbell.net> wrote:
>I'm not a racer and not up on all the aerodynamic and
>rolling resistance issues. Somewhere there must be tests
>and solid info on these kind of questions

There are tests, although I don't know the addresses to give
you a link, off the top of my head. However, the result is
that, for a given tire construction and a given pressure,
and all else being equal, a _wider_ tire has _less_ rolling
resistance than a narrower tire.

Of course, often all else is NOT equal -- you may look at a
28 that's good for 90 psi and a 23 that's good for 145 psi,
and if you intend to inflate to the rated max, then the 23
will probably have less RR.

OTOH, if you're looking at a 28 and a 23 in the same brand
and model of tire, both with the same casing and pressure
rating, and again you intend to run at the same pressure
regardless of tire, the 28 will have less RR.

RR (at least in slick tires) comes from the casing having
to deform to allow the contact patch. Since, at 100 psi, a
tire with 100 pounds on it will have a nominal 1 square
inch contact patch, a tire with inch-wide tread will have
an inch of it's sidewall required to flex, while a tire
with a half inch wide tread will require two inches of it's
sidewall to flex.

You can read all day about it with groups.google.com.
Realistically, if you've been happy/comfortable with your
existing tires, I'd say stick with them.
--
Rick Onanian

Rick Onanian wrote:

> Dan Daniel wrote:
> >I'm not a racer and not up on all the aerodynamic and
> >rolling resistance issues. Somewhere there must be tests
> >and solid info on these kind of questions
>
> There are tests, although I don't know the addresses to
> give you a link, off the top of my head.

http://bike.terrymorse.com/rolres.html

--
terry morse Palo Alto, CA http://bike.terrymorse.com/

"Churchill" <yes@yes.com> wrote in message news:<mcJEc.185604$207.1360680@news20.bellglobal.com>...
> Hello,
>
> I have a road bike with 700 X 28 tires.
>
> I need new tires, what are u recommending for thin racing
> type tires. I go cycling on Sundays with a club about 100
> km both flats and hills. I know there are allot of tire
> companies out there, so I could use a hand before I order
> them or go looking for them.

Fred: 700x28 (or even 25) Cool: 700x23 (or 21 if you are
140lbs or smaller)

You're welcome. Ken
>
> Thank you

K. J. Papai wrote:
> "Churchill" <yes@yes.com> wrote in message
> news:<mcJEc.185604$207.1360680@news20.bellglobal.com>...
>> Hello,
>>
>> I have a road bike with 700 X 28 tires.
>>
>> I need new tires, what are u recommending for thin racing
>> type tires. I go cycling on Sundays with a club about 100
>> km both flats and hills. I know there are allot of tire
>> companies out there, so I could use a hand before I order
>> them or go looking for them.
>
> Fred: 700x28 (or even 25) Cool: 700x23 (or 21 if you are
> 140lbs or smaller)

Fab???

Bill "have some uninstalled Veloflex Pave *22*s so must be
REALLY cool" S.

"Dan Daniel" <ddandan.remove@pacbell.net> wrote in message
news:0du6e0tgsik5pqlqajvvj5rpjjof1ald48@4ax.com...
: On Wed, 30 Jun 2004 22:20:51 -0400, "Churchill"
: <yes@yes.com> wrote:
:
:
: >
: >What does the 700 stand for ??
: >
:
: http://www.sheldonbrown.com/tires.html

On the subject of sizing: Vittoria sew-ups, Corsa EVO-CX,
which fit a normal 700c wheel, we see: 21-28". What do these
last numbers mean?

David

"K. J. Papai" <ken@kenpapai.com> wrote in message
news:6100cab2.0407010742.5aaed415@posting.google.com
> "Churchill" <yes@yes.com> wrote in message
> news:<mcJEc.185604$207.1360680@news20.bellglobal.com>...
>> Hello,
>>
>> I have a road bike with 700 X 28 tires.
>>
>> I need new tires, what are u recommending for thin racing
>> type tires. I go cycling on Sundays with a club about 100
>> km both flats and hills. I know there are allot of tire
>> companies out there, so I could use a hand before I order
>> them or go looking for them.
>
> Fred: 700x28 (or even 25) Cool: 700x23 (or 21 if you are
> 140lbs or smaller)
>
> You're welcome.

For what? You've rolled up a whole heap of assumptions into
that one offensive little package. Thus far the OP hasn't
given a single viable reason why he should go to 23s from
his current 28s and neither have you.

--

A: Top-posters.
B: What is the most annoying thing on Usenet?

"Churchill" <yes@yes.com> wrote in message
news:ItKEc.185656$207.1386659@news20.bellglobal.com

[...]

> What would be the difference between 23's and 28's ??

5mm. Avocet make a good slick in a 700x28 (I run their
700x32), see
http://www.avocet.com/tirepages/carbon12_specs.html. Few
manufacturers do, most racers use 23s, maybe 20s or 25s.
But you'll find 28s more comfortable to ride than the
narrower ones.

--

A: Top-posters.
B: What is the most annoying thing on Usenet?

"LAN Support" <someone@nowhere.au> wrote in message
news:40e38ede$0$89111$c30e37c6@lon-reader.news.telstra.net...
> Stick with the wider tyres. They will be substantially
> more comfortable on any sort of bumpy road and very little
> slower. They will also, on the average, last longer.
>
> Nick

25s are plenty wide and are much easier to find in
performance models.

>
> "Churchill" <yes@yes.com> wrote in message
> news:KbLEc.186138$207.1406557@news20.bellglobal.com...
> >
> > I was on my second set of 700 X 28 and they needed to be
> > replaced. I
> picked
> > up my bike today and they had 700 X 28 Continental
> > GatorSkins. I
noticed
> > they were a little wider than my previous 700 X 28s, so
> > I thought I
would
> > ask here on the newsgroup.
> >
> > Subsequent to my first post, I have gone to three
> > websites, Continental, Michelin and the one you posted
> > above. I believe I should have gone
with
> > the 23mm or perhaps the 25mm's.
> >
> > Oh well, it is to late to change now, perhaps next year.
> >
> > Is there a significant difference between these sizes
> > for Sunday club cyclists ? Would I notice 'significant'
> > less drag and more force ?
> >
> > Cordially
> >
>

"K. J. Papai" <ken@kenpapai.com> wrote in message
news:6100cab2.0407010742.5aaed415@posting.google.com...
> "Churchill" <yes@yes.com> wrote in message
news:<mcJEc.185604$207.1360680@news20.bellglobal.com>...
> > Hello,
> >
> > I have a road bike with 700 X 28 tires.
> >
> > I need new tires, what are u recommending for thin
> > racing type tires. I
go
> > cycling on Sundays with a club about 100 km both flats
> > and hills. I
know
> > there are allot of tire companies out there, so I could
> > use a hand
before I
> > order them or go looking for them.
>
> Fred: 700x28 (or even 25) Cool: 700x23 (or 21 if you are
> 140lbs or smaller)
>
> You're welcome. Ken
> >
> > Thank you

Fred: Among other things, thinks tire sizes are *somehow*
related to "coolness".

BTW, you would probably be better off using 25s for training
but I guess you are a bit too stupid to understand that. Are
you not closer to 200 pounds than you are to 150? Sheesh, go
and look at what some of the pros use for Flanders and
Roubaix. I guess some of those guys including some past
winners are "Freds", huh? I guess you can ise your "cool"
23s if you never ride over rough pavement. I thought you
lived in San Francisco? I used to be based there and I did
most of my rides in Marin or down south to the Santa Cruz
mountain range, and I had to go over some really crap
pavement. I used 23s because at that time high performance
25s were not available (and I was 159 - 163). I ran them at
about 95 psi on long rides and I wish I could have gone a
bit lower. Those 25s that are now available would have been
perfect and I would not have had to keep trying different
sadlles looking for one that would take the sting out of my
Klein Quantum II on those long days. BTW, the pavement in
California is like glass compared to many European roads and
lots of other places in the US.

The first time I tried a 25, it was from a reboxed GP3000
that was supposed to contain a 23. I did not notice until I
got it mounted and it barely looked any different. What was
different though was the comfort I got from running it at 90
psi over some of that crap pavement in the Santa Cruz
mountains and the surrounding areas. Now THAT is what is
*cool*, things that work right.

On Thu, 1 Jul 2004 09:20:28 -0700, "David Auker" <DavAuk@Hevanet.com>
wrote:

>
>"Dan Daniel" <ddandan.remove@pacbell.net> wrote in message
>news:0du6e0tgsik5pqlqajvvj5rpjjof1ald48@4ax.com...
>: On Wed, 30 Jun 2004 22:20:51 -0400, "Churchill"
>: <yes@yes.com> wrote:
>:
>:
>: >
>: >What does the 700 stand for ??
>: >
>:
>: http://www.sheldonbrown.com/tires.html
>
>
>
>On the subject of sizing: Vittoria sew-ups, Corsa EVO-CX,
>which fit a normal 700c wheel, we see: 21-28". What do
>these last numbers mean?
>
>David
>

Got me.... The only place that I have seen two number
used is in Wilderness Trail Bike's tires- from Sheldon
Brown's site-

"The GMS uses a two-number system: the first number is the
width of the casing, and the second number is the width of
the tread, both in millimeters. These measurements are taken
on a rim which is 20mm wide at the bead-capturing point,
with a tire inflated to 60psi and maintained for 24 hours."

Scroll to the bottom.... http://www.sheldonbrown.com/tire-
sizing.html

which is probably a better link for the OP's question
anyway. Maybe Vittoria is adopting this system, or has their
own variation on it? Have you gone to the Vittoria site to
see if they explain their numbering system?