Tragedy - Andrei Kivilev (Cofidis)

[Trealaw Boy]

Andrei Kivilev (Cofidis) died of head injuries after crashing during the second stage of Paris-Nice.

More at http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/?id=2003/mar03/mar12news2

[Wafflycathcsdir]

That is so very, very sad.

Sympathies to his family, friends and team mates.

helen s

~~~~~~~~~~
Flush out that intestinal parasite and/or the waste product before sending a reply!

Any speeliong mistake$ aR the resiult of my cats sitting on the keyboaRRRDdd
~~~~~~~~~~

[Dan Gregory]

Very sad indeed. I feared the worst from the way he was motionless on the road. - With deepest
sympathy for all Dan "wafflycathcsdirtycatlitter" <wafflycathcs@aol.comtapeworm> wrote in message
news:20030312054510.10316.00000115@mb-ck.aol.com...
> That is so very, very sad.
>
> Sympathies to his family, friends and team mates.
>
> helen s
>
>
> ~~~~~~~~~~
> Flush out that intestinal parasite and/or the waste product before sending
a
> reply!
>
> Any speeliong mistake$ aR the resiult of my cats sitting on the
keyboaRRRDdd
> ~~~~~~~~~~

[John B]

Trealaw Boy wrote:

> Andrei Kivilev (Cofidis) died of head injuries after crashing during the second stage of
> Paris-Nice.
>
> More at http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/?id=2003/mar03/mar12news2

This news is awful.

It was specifically Andrei's riding in the 2001 Tour, when he finished 4th that made my son a fan of
cofidis and indeed cycle racing. Since then he has followed Kivilev and Millar's results closely.
Only the other day he was asking for a Cofidis jersey for his birthday to be like his heroes - and
he rarely goes out without his Cofidis hat.

I'm dreading my son finding out - he's just 10.

Sometimes, just sometimes, life sucks big time. This is one of those times.

Prayers and thoughts go out to Andrei's family.

John B

[Terry]

"Dan Gregory" <dangregory@palaver.freeserve.co.uk> wrote in message
news:b4n3t7$qh$1@news8.svr.pol.co.uk...
> Very sad indeed. I feared the worst from the way he was motionless on the road. - With deepest
> sympathy for all Dan "wafflycathcsdirtycatlitter" <wafflycathcs@aol.comtapeworm> wrote in
message
> news:20030312054510.10316.00000115@mb-ck.aol.com...
> > That is so very, very sad.
> >
> > Sympathies to his family, friends and team mates.
> >
> > helen s
> >
> >
> > ~~~~~~~~~~
> > Flush out that intestinal parasite and/or the waste product before
sending
> a
> > reply!
> >
> > Any speeliong mistake$ aR the resiult of my cats sitting on the
> keyboaRRRDdd
> > ~~~~~~~~~~
>
>

He didn't look good did he, a real shame! :-(

--

---
"I hardly think a nation that eats frogs and would go to bed with the kitchen sink if it put on a
tutu is in any position to preach couthness" Blackadder III

[Andyp]

The BBC article stated he was not wearing a helmet. I hope this was not a contributory factor.

--
"Wisest are they that know they do not know." Socrates "If more of us valued food and cheer and song
above hoarded gold, it would be a merrier world" JRR Toliken, The Hobbit

[John B]

andyp wrote:

> The BBC article stated he was not wearing a helmet. I hope this was not a contributory factor.

Even if it were held up as a case for compulsory helmet wearing, they are _already necessary_ in
similar circumstances in the UK, ie massed-start racing.

So I'm afraid no need for a h*lm*t thread.

John B

[Elyob]

"andyp" <andyp@NOMAIL.COM> wrote in message news:b4nk9d$61d$1@news.icl.se...
> The BBC article stated he was not wearing a helmet. I hope this was not a contributory factor.
>

It also says "Cofidis team doctor Jean-Jacques Menuet confirmed that a helmet would probably have
saved Kivilev's life and called for the authorities to bring in stiffer safety measures". However,
all the cyclists know the risks of their trade. This is not the first, nor last, death in
competetive cycling.

Condolences to his family.

[John B]

elyob wrote:

> "andyp" <andyp@NOMAIL.COM> wrote in message news:b4nk9d$61d$1@news.icl.se...
> > The BBC article stated he was not wearing a helmet. I hope this was not a contributory factor.
> >
>
> It also says "Cofidis team doctor Jean-Jacques Menuet confirmed that a helmet would probably have
> saved Kivilev's life and called for the authorities to bring in stiffer safety measures".

In the UK helmets are _already_ compulsory for massed start cycle racing.

John B

[Msa]

Please, let's not turn this into a helmet wars thread.

--
Mark
______________________________________

"Just ask yourself: What would Scooby Doo?"

[Terry]

"MSA" <onyerbikemark@yahoo.co.uk> wrote in message news:b4nt8o$gc1$1@sparta.btinternet.com...
> Please, let's not turn this into a helmet wars thread.
>

Here here!

---
This is the worst moment of my entire life. I've spent my last penny on a cat-skin windcheater, I've
just broken a priceless turnip and now I'm about to be viciously slaughtered by a naked Tunisian
sock merchant. Blackadder III

[Elyob]

"Terry" <kona@notarealemailaddress.co.uk> wrote in message news:b4ntee$aao$1@helle.btinternet.com...
> "MSA" <onyerbikemark@yahoo.co.uk> wrote in message news:b4nt8o$gc1$1@sparta.btinternet.com...
> > Please, let's not turn this into a helmet wars thread.
> >
>
>
> Here here!
>

Exactly ....

[Ewoud Dronkert]

On Wed, 12 Mar 2003 18:14:38 +0000 (UTC), Terry wrote:
>> Please, let's not turn this into a helmet wars thread.
>
>Here here!

What, you want the helmet war somewhere else?!

[Mr_rolfi]

Jean Marie le Blanc said on Eurosport today they must now make the decision on helmets for the
riders. As sad as this all is, it must be left at the riders discretion. David Duffield and Sean
Kelly were careful not to bang on about the helmet theme. We all know the risks.

--

cheers,

Dave Rollinson

> Even if it were held up as a case for compulsory helmet wearing, they are _already necessary_ in
> similar circumstances in the UK, ie massed-start racing.
>
> So I'm afraid no need for a h*lm*t thread.
>
> John B

[Elyob]

"Ewoud Dronkert" <nospam@invalid.info> wrote in message
news:tp6v6vk2qbih5gi220o5ll989lcajitm9b@news.xs4all.nl... On Wed, 12 Mar 2003 18:14:38 +0000 (UTC),
Terry wrote:
>> Please, let's not turn this into a helmet wars thread.

>What, you want the helmet war somewhere else?!

This just isn't the thread for flippancy IMO ...

[Ewoud Dronkert]

On Thu, 13 Mar 2003 00:22:38 GMT, elyob wrote:
>This just isn't the thread for flippancy IMO ...

Maybe you're right, on the other hand; which thread ever is?

It is a tragedy that Kivilev died, and my sympathies go to his family, but it was also just an
unfortunate accident for which no-one was to blame or *maybe* he himself. A lot of people die every
day, a few of them are cyclists, life goes on. I did not know the poor man and odds are no-one else
here did. If you do feel touched by his death, act upon it. Maybe from now on you'd like to always
wear a helmet, or maybe you want to pay your respects to Andre=EF and leave a message for his
friends at http://www.cofidis.fr/credit/loisir/loi_cyc_messages_01

E.

[Andyp]

"mr_rolfi" <mr_rolfi@lineone.net> wrote in message
news:3e6fad42_2@mk-nntp-1.news.uk.worldonline.com...
> Jean Marie le Blanc said on Eurosport today they must now make the
decision
> on helmets for the riders. As sad as this all is, it must be left at the riders discretion. David
> Duffield and Sean Kelly were careful not to bang
on
> about the helmet theme. We all know the risks.
>
"We all know this risks" is not good enough. I do not believe that seat belt wearing nor crash
helmet (on motorbikes) would be the "norm" today if they were not made compulsory. Knowing the risks
is something but it is never the dead who have to pick up the pieces or have to try and explain how
a preventative death occur.

It was not by intent when I posted my initial response to start a helmet thread, on the other hand
why not. If tragic events like this are not used as a catalyst for debate what can?

AndyP

[Toby Barrett]

"andyp" <andyp@NOMAIL.COM> wrote in news:b4poiq$25lc$1@news.icl.se:
> "We all know this risks" is not good enough. I do not believe that seat belt wearing nor crash
> helmet (on motorbikes) would be the "norm" today if they were not made compulsory.

Indeed they were made compulsory amid claims that the law would dramatically reduce the death rate
on the roads.

This did not happen. There's lots of documentation on this, type "seat-belt legislation effect" into
Google for example. Robert Davis' "Death on the Streets" contains a good summary of this.

We should be aware of this before calling for other "safety" measures to be made compulsory.

Toby

[John B]

andyp wrote:

> "mr_rolfi" <mr_rolfi@lineone.net> wrote in message
> news:3e6fad42_2@mk-nntp-1.news.uk.worldonline.com...
> > Jean Marie le Blanc said on Eurosport today they must now make the
> decision
> > on helmets for the riders. As sad as this all is, it must be left at the riders discretion.
> > David Duffield and Sean Kelly were careful not to bang
> on
> > about the helmet theme. We all know the risks.
> >
> "We all know this risks" is not good enough. I do not believe that seat belt wearing nor crash
> helmet (on motorbikes) would be the "norm" today if they were not made compulsory. Knowing the
> risks is something but it is never the dead who have to pick up the pieces or have to try and
> explain how a preventative death occur.
>
> It was not by intent when I posted my initial response to start a helmet thread, on the other hand
> why not. If tragic events like this are not used as a catalyst for debate what can?
>

Well as this is a UK ng and cycle helmets are *already* compulsory for massed start racing here,
what point would you like to make?

John B

[David E. Belche]

John B <jpb.design@removevirgin.net> wrote in message news:<3E707E37.444CECD@removevirgin.net>...
>
> Well as this is a UK ng and cycle helmets are *already* compulsory for massed start racing here

Hard-shell ones at that, too - the old "leather hairnet" ones are a no-no.

David E. Belcher

Dept. of Chemistry, University of York