700X23 vs 700x25?
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Just got some new Mavic wheels and in the process of that, I also got some new tires. I used to ride with 700x23, but I mistakenly bought 700x25? They look a smidge bigger, is there any really noticable difference between the two? BTW, road bike
Just got some new Mavic wheels and in the process of that, I also got some new tires. I used to ride with 700x23, but I mistakenly bought 700x25? They look a smidge bigger, is there any really noticable difference between the two? BTW, road bikeA 700x25 tire weighs more than an equivalent 700x23, but that is offset by the fact that you can run about 5 PSI less (maybe, more), and the "ride" will be better.
You will probably have to adjust your computer for the slightly larger tire circumference ...
FWIW -- my observation is that some 700x23 have as large a circumference as some 700x25 tires ... in that vein, Continentals seem larger & Michelins seem smaller, so you will want to actually measure the actual circumference of your new tires for the data you input into your bike's computer.
Just got some new Mavic wheels and in the process of that, I also got some new tires. I used to ride with 700x23, but I mistakenly bought 700x25?
I'd like to know the answer to this too. My wife's bike came with 23 and mine came with 25. I wondered immediately if I should in future switch mine down to 23 and if my rim would even take that (bontrager select).
I'd like to know the answer to this too. My wife's bike came with 23 and mine came with 25. I wondered immediately if I should in future switch mine down to 23 and if my rim would even take that (bontrager select).I know someone who puts 700x32 tires on his MAVIC MA-40 rims (622-15) ...
It seems from experience the 25's soak up the road a bit more because of their size?
I prefer 25s to 23s because at my weight (190+lbs) I think they are actually faster... and they ride better. You are really limited in good tires available in that size, but Michelen P2R and Vredestein Tricomps are two that perfrom really well. Since you already have them, just try em out. They will ride better and be better on wet/rough roads even if you are on the light side.
It seems from experience the 25's soak up the road a bit more because of their size?While the "mass" of the larger tire may make the ride a little better, with the larger tire, you can-and-should inflate the tire to a slightly (whatever THAT means ... figure 5+ PSI) lower tire pressure than you would use with the slightly smaller tire to achieve the same tire contact patch on the ground.
So, the end result is more potential cushioning by the air in the tire ... of course, if you were to pump up a 700x25 to the same PSI as a 700x23, then pneumatic benefits (for want of a better description) would be lessened ...
While the "mass" of the larger tire may make the ride a little better, with the larger tire, you can-and-should inflate the tire to a slightly (whatever THAT means ... figure 5+ PSI) lower tire pressure than you would use with the slightly smaller tire to achieve the same tire contact patch on the ground.
So, the end result is more potential cushioning by the air in the tire ... of course, if you were to pump up a 700x25 to the same PSI as a 700x23, then pneumatic benefits (for want of a better description) would be lessened ...
Mass has nothing to do with a better ride... a larger tire with the same PSI will have the same contact area as a smaller tire with with same same pressure(think about what pressure means), the only difference is that the smaller tire will have a more oval contact patch, resulting in the tire having greater case deflection... so with a smaller tire you have used a larger %sidewall deflection just for static load, and you had less to begin with. Make sense? This is also what gives a larger tire lower Rolling Resistance for non perfect road surfaces, amplified the larger (heavier) the rider is.
Ah I found the article that explains it better than I could do...
http://www.rouesartisanales.com/article-1503651.html
Mass has nothing to do with a better ride... a larger tire with the same PSI will have the same contact area as a smaller tire with with same same pressure(think about what pressure means), the only difference is that the smaller tire will have a more oval contact patch, resulting in the tire having greater case deflection... so with a smaller tire you have used a larger %sidewall deflection just for static load, and you had less to begin with. Make sense? This is also what gives a larger tire lower Rolling Resistance for non perfect road surfaces, amplified the larger (heavier) the rider is.What?
I didn't say that mass was a key factor, I said it "may make the ride a little better" ... FWIW, there is inertial mass ...
Sorry, but you either chose not to understand what I was saying or ... well, I knew I could ferret out someone who knew less than I do. You are wrong to suggest that it has "nothing to do with a better ride" ... it just has very little to do with a better ride ... hence, it may make the ride a little better; but, it is the lower PSI that you can use which is the beneficial ingredient to making a larger tire ride better ... yes, yes, the thread count matters, too; but, that is another issue. We should all have tires with silk casings ... etc.
YOU can go the your public library and look up an article in BICYCLYING magazine from the early 80s about tire size & PSI -- it explains tire pressure & contact patch a little BETTER (more extensively) than the link you provided ...
The bottom line is that you can run a lower PSI in a larger tire and have the same contact patch as you would with a smaller tire at a higher PSI ... OBVIOUSLY, puh-leeze don't go to extremes, you can have so much or so little air in two tires of different sizes that meaningful comparisons can't be made.
A person would be ill-advised to run the same PSI in a larger tire as a smaller tire ... but, if YOU want to do so, that is your prerogative.
What?
I didn't say that mass was a key factor, I said it "may make the ride a little better" ... FWIW, there is inertial mass ...
Sorry, but you either chose not to understand what I was saying or ... well, I knew I could ferret out someone who knew less than I do. You are wrong to suggest that it has "nothing to do with a better ride" ... it just has very little to do with a better ride ... hence, it may make the ride a little better; but, it is the lower PSI that you can use which is the beneficial ingredient to making a larger tire ride better ... yes, yes, the thread count matters, too; but, that is another issue. We should all have tires with silk casings ... etc..
Wow dude you seem even more lame and nonsensical when you get defensive. You know the mass of the tire has nothing to do with how it "rides", just give it up.
YOU can go the your public library and look up an article in BICYCLYING magazine from the early 80s about tire size & PSI -- it explains tire pressure & contact patch a little BETTER (more extensively) than the link you provided ...
Sorry I didn’t have a link to “80’s article in Bicycling magazine at Public Library” handy. Hopefully someone else appreciated the fact that I spent time to google it visually illustrating what I was trying to say even if you are a **** about it.
The bottom line is that you can run a lower PSI in a larger tire and have the same contact patch as you would with a smaller tire at a higher PSI ... OBVIOUSLY, puh-leeze don't go to extremes, you can have so much or so little air in two tires of different sizes that meaningful comparisons can't be made. .
Ummm just stop for a second and tell me, roughly, what is the contact area of a bicycle tire at 100PSI under a bike/rider combo that weighs 200lbs, evenly distributed between front and rear? Calculate for both a 700*23 and a 700*25. OK I won’t keep you in suspense (I did take algebra in 8th grade before dropping out), it is 1square inch for both sizes (and a 700*18, 20, 28 etc.). Wow pressure is a crazy concept eh?
A person would be ill-advised to run the same PSI in a larger tire as a smaller tire ... but, if YOU want to do so, that is your prerogative.
Look again at the pretty picture from the rudimentary link I sent and this time see if you can figure out why/how you can run lower pressures in larger tires without an increase in rolling resistance and achieve a better ride despite a LARGER contact patch (that pesky pressure concept again).
Remember arguing on the internet is like competing in the special Olympics. Besides, my intention is not to engage in a nerd war (you will surely win) but to inform the OP that the 25s are probably just as “fast” as the 23s unless you are really light, or are a fast TTer on a smooth course.
For overall riding IMO the 25 is often a better choice, and this is from my perspective as a racer, from a recreational cyclist perspective a 23 just makes no sense to me unless you have perfect roads every where you ride. But don't take my word for it, I know less than Alfeng.
Wow dude you seem even more lame and nonsensical when you get defensive. You know the mass of the tire has nothing to do with how it "rides", just give it up.
Sorry I didn’t have a link to “80’s article in Bicycling magazine at Public Library” handy. Hopefully someone else appreciated the fact that I spent time to google it visually illustrating what I was trying to say even if you are a **** about it.
For overall riding IMO the 25 is often a better choice, and this is from my perspective as a racer, from a recreational cyclist perspective a 23 just makes no sense to me unless you have perfect roads every where you ride. But don't take my word for it, I know less than Alfeng.Again, you show your decision to misread what I wrote ...
When your Visa expires, you should probably go "home" and then you can educate the unwashed masses in-person.:)
This topic has been done to death.
Wider = less rolling resitance
Narrower = better aerodynamics
Unless you are racing, just use the tyres you brought. The difference between 23 and 25 isn't a hell of a lot.
Just got some new Mavic wheels and in the process of that, I also got some new tires. I used to ride with 700x23, but I mistakenly bought 700x25? They look a smidge bigger, is there any really noticable difference between the two? BTW, road bike
You got them,you tell us.
This topic has been done to death.
Wider = less rolling resitance
Narrower = better aerodynamics
Unless you are racing, just use the tyres you brought. The difference between 23 and 25 isn't a hell of a lot.
That's what I think too. Take a metric ruler and see the difference between 23 and 25 millimeters. I think that lots of folks make a bigger deal out of this than it merits.
so after all that; is there a noticable difference in the ride of each? can the average rider pick a difference between the two when riding them?
This topic has been done to death.
Wider = less rolling resitance
Narrower = better aerodynamics
Unless you are racing, just use the tyres you brought. The difference between 23 and 25 isn't a hell of a lot.
To complicate matters further, I recently bought and installed a pair of Specialized Roubaix Pro tires, which are labeled 700 23/25. That is, they have a 23 tread mounted on a 25 casing. Inflation is 115, similar to the Vittoria Rubinos 700x23s they replaced. They ride much better on rough pavement, and handle just as well as the Rubinos. No downside yet that I can see, though flat resistance and durability can't be known this early.
Damn, I thought my new ride with 23's would mean I had a lower rolling resistance to the 28's on the other bike.. okay so the 23's are more aerodynamic? they say 115-125psi on the tire, so I've been doing 120.
Again, you show your decision to misread what I wrote ...
You have repeatedly claimed in this thread tire mass "may make the ride a little better" and a larger tire will have the same contact patch at a lower PSI. Not much room to misread that no matter what I decide.
When your Visa expires, you should probably go "home" and then you can educate the unwashed masses in-person.:)
OK, I see if I want to avoid racial and ethnic slams towards myself I need to refrain from correcting technical errors in a technical forum, especially basic ones. Nice. :(
Damn, I thought my new ride with 23's would mean I had a lower rolling resistance to the 28's on the other bike.. okay so the 23's are more aerodynamic? they say 115-125psi on the tire, so I've been doing 120.
There is a lot more to rolling resistance than just the size... the tire casing and tread composition is more important. Do a search for "rolling resistance" and you will find many threads, including tests of tires with the lowest rolling resistance (based on roller tests).
FWIW when I was younger, I began using 700*20 Conti GPs pumped up to 160 psi because some other guys on the team I was racing for told me how fast they were... "when you are behind someone you can just coast they are so fast". I got them and they sure felt fast. I felt every wurm turd on the road, reinforcing my believe that they were fast (like a steel wheel on a steel track). Yeah they were dangerous in the rain and couldn't hold a turn, but they were fast right? Well now I am older and wiser( and realize a steel wheel doesn't roll too well on rough pavement :o ), but the point of what I am trying to say is if you believe they are faster, they may be, since perception is reality. ;) .
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