Polar CS600 Power - First on the Block...

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You might want to get a cheap multimeter, maybe $15 from Depot or Radio Shack, and make sure it is battery dropouts. I thought it was contacts but got a good voltage and the ends of the leads going into the paddle.

Judging by the response I got from Polar tech support the dropouts are certainly a known issue. Without too much hesitation I was told to send the power unit in for warranty service. It should arrive at Polar Friday. Judging by the remarks here I am guessing it will take them a week or so to turn it around.Well...I already have a voltmeter...but I doubt that will prove much (unless I can figure out how to measure that when I am riding :-) ) since it is intermitten. According to one person at Polar, this is not a known issue...but that is coming from one person so who knows.

If it is a known issue...what was it and how was it corrected? If nobody can give an answer...then it probably was not fixed.

Just my take.

I just wanted to say thank you to everyone who has offered their experiences on this thread. My CS600 arrived yesterday. I had it all installed in about an hour, and got everything working with very little effort - in large part due to the information/advice here. I'm really happy with the device (two rides - so far, so good), and really happy I could use this thread to fill in the (major) information gaps in Polar's manuals. Thanks again.

Mark

Just another quick update.

So far so good...I am not quite sure if bending the leads out on the battery pack did the trick, but I am getting much better performance even through very bumpy roads. I had one dropout for about 1 minute...but that could have been due to power lines or something...the remaining ride proved to be no issues and that ride was 70 miles long so it is looking better.

This is the third ride with little or no issues.

Let's see how the next few weeks go.

hello all,

I got my cs600 today and have installed it using the info posted here. The speed sensor is working, however I do not get any power readings..I have tried different gear combos, and in some combos the chain touches the power sensor, for some reason the sensor is not activated , and the computer does not find this sensor.. the cadence magnet is very close to the cadence sensor in the power unit, but no led flashes here (as it does in the speed sensor). When I try the teach function: the computer does not find the power sensor????

Another funny thing: I have turned and clicked the computer in the steermount. However HOW do I get it OUT?? It seems to be stuck...I find nothing in the manual how to get the computer out of the steermount...

all help is greatly appreciated

best regards

bas

Bas,

There's all sorts wrong with the CS600 power sensor (as there was for those of us who suffered with the 720/725 version)...but there's no excuse for not reading the manuals:


Have you 'taught' the CS600 to find and read your power sensor? if not, read the section on 'teaching new sensors'. This might seem to be a pain, but it allows you to set up different sensors on different bikes etc....
To release the CS600 from the mount, lean on it and twist it in the opposite way to the way you mounted it. i.e if you mount it by twisting it clockwise, lean on in and twist anti-clockwise to dismount it.
McP

...and what are those problems, I hear you ask?


In a nutshell, after returning 4 Polar s720i power units in 12 months because they corroded in English weather I was hoping the new wireless transmission and beefed up cabling for the CS600 would have addressed the under-engineering issues.

However, I got a CS600 in June 2007 and within 3 weeks it was showing the intermittent power/cadence drop-outs that are mentioned earlier in this thread. No way of telling whether this was lack of battery power to the unit, the effect on the sensor of riding the unit on Yorkshire's roads or some problem with the wireless transmission to the handlebar unit.

So back it went to Polar, who have what's best described as a 'love-hate relationship' with me as a customer.

And back came a brand new unit, and a note that my original unit (from week 17/2007 production) had shown short circuits on being opened and tested.

After only 2 weeks operation the new unit (from week 20/2007 production) is showing similar faults: intermittently (and not related to road vibration etc) the power/cadence signal disappears for minutes at a time and re-appears. Once again there are no clues as to whether this is because the sensor/cadence reed switch is not operating or because the battery power to the unit is failing or because the radio transmitter is failing.

On a couple of training rides, I've stopped and removed and re-connected the lead from the battery cigar to the power sensor and this seems to have re-started the unit...but ususally not for long and anyway try doing this in the middle of a 40Km TT

So, I've recently placed this issue with the CEO of Polar UK for his response.



On the grounds that it's his problem, not mine (i.e he must decide whether to placate me with the De Rosa carbon full Campy Record job of my choice!!) here is a joke to amuse others currently frustrated by Polar problems:A bloke, a motor mechanic and an IT support worker set off in a car for a weekend's camping. On the way, their car stutters to a halt.


The bloke (who's been driving) says: 'bloody thing...I'll get out and give it a kick and that should get it going.' Twenty minutes later, they're still stuck. The mechanic says: 'look guys, I know a thing or two about cars so if you'll just give me a couple of hours I'll have this thing sorted'. A couple of hours later the engine is beautifuly clean, but the car is going nowhere. Finally, the IT boffin says. 'OK, is it my turn? Everyone get out of the car...then we turn it off, wait a couple of minutes, turn it back on again et voila!'



Right, so I'm making light of this...anyone with any answers to the Polar drop-out riddle please, please post.






McP

Bas,

There's all sorts wrong with the CS600 power sensor (as there was for those of us who suffered with the 720/725 version)...but there's no excuse for not reading the manuals:

Have you 'taught' the CS600 to find and read your power sensor? if not, read the section on 'teaching new sensors'. This might seem to be a pain, but it allows you to set up different sensors on different bikes etc....
To release the CS600 from the mount, lean on it and twist it in the opposite way to the way you mounted it. i.e if you mount it by twisting it clockwise, lean on in and twist anti-clockwise to dismount it.
McPWell...for starters if you read his post...he has the speed working and attempts to ''teach'' the power sensor...so I assume that he has read the manual or figured that part himself. No need to badger anyone here...just try to help him out.

To releast the computer, as long as the computer mount is on the handlebars or stem, all you need to do is turn the computer counter-clock wise and it should release. I don't remember reading that in the manual...but maybe it is in there somwhere.

If I had to guess...I would say that if your computer can not learn of the power sensor, make sure you check the batteries, the springs on the bottom of the battery sleeve, all the wires are connected to the paddle properly, and that the cadense sensor tab gets waved over by the cadense magnet.

You're right, I was hasty, so apologies for that but as you see from my second post the mere mention of the CS600 power sensor brings me out in a rash at the moment!

Anyway, my tip for the removal of the CS600 computer from the handlebar unit is 'don't be afraid to lean on it, before you apply the anti-clockwise twist'.

Just got back from a 2.5hr training ride today with power/cadence data only available for around half that time...drop-outs of anything from 30sec to 10+ minutes, followed by similar periods of perfect sensing/transmission.

What is the fix (hard re-set/three-finger salute?) that Polar recommend for the computer unit...I'll try anything that's going!

McP

thanks for the info.

The first time its quite difficult to remove the computer from the steermount, after a few tries it becomes easier..(plastic becomes more flexibel)


After fiddling around with the battery holder, I got the power sensor to work. With the test ride today it only got 10 minutes of data..
funny thing is that when I held the battery holder upside down, the power sensor was working.. maybe attaching the battery holder upside down could do the trick?

Can anyone confirm that the battery holder (design) is the root cause for the power sensor to not work?

bverdon, I read that you have been bending the springs in the battery holder...could you be a little more specific...what exactly are you bending, and in what direction?

thanks already

Can anyone confirm that the battery holder (design) is the root cause for the power sensor to not work?In my case it was not the battery holder. If you read my earlier posts I verified that I was getting voltage to the power unit by using a volt meter. I had drop outs that became more frequent and then it just stopped working. I ended up sending the unit into Polar for warranty repair. I haven't recieved it back yet. Will update all when I get it installed.

bverdon, I read that you have been bending the springs in the battery holder...could you be a little more specific...what exactly are you bending, and in what direction?

thanks alreadySure....at least I will do my best describing it.

With basic circuit design, keep in mind the circuit must be closed in order for current to flow. The battery connectivity and the positive/negative leads that connect the battery sleeve to the battery container unit (cigar) completes the circuit to the power paddle.

Just for safe measure, I use three peices of electrical tape to secure the batteries to the sleave - one in the middle where the two batteries join, and one in the center of each battery. This will rule out intermitten connectivity issues within the battery sleeve (Polar should really fix that though, shouldn't they?) from vibrations.

Now...take out the battery sleeve and you will notice a silver metal bar in the back of the unit...that is the positive lead that complets the circuit within the cigar case. I refer these peices of metal as spring leads...since they behave to me, as springs. One is a positive spring, the second is the negative spring. Now...at the bottom of the cigar case are two contact points...one of cource positive and the other negative.

I have found that when I pull gently on the spring leads at the bottom of the sleeve (away from the battery sleeve), intentioinally creating more ''spring action'' (make any sense?), the battery sleeve will stay in contact a lot longer and I basically will not see any drop outs for a week or two...then I repeat pulling the springs out with consistant results. Its as if the springs lose their ''action'' a little.

The reason I strongly believe that the battery unit is the main culprit is that the computer will complain about checking power when there is no cadence or power readings for about 30 seconds of a speed reading...as if it is aware that there is no signal coming from the power paddle. When things are working right and you coast for more than 30 seconds (an don't turn the cranks at all) the computer never complains about checking power. I bet that the paddle sends a ''closed power circuit'' response to the computer.

The only thing that really ticks me off is...If I am right about this, why doesn't Polar Customer Support know about this issue???? They should be able to clearly trouble shoot this with us...and all I got from them was...''We don't know of any issues...you need to send the unit in for repair''.

If I am correct...the fix for Polar to do would be engineer a battery sleeve's springs with stronger springs! Sounds like an easy fix to me. In the mean time...if I continue to get the same results, I may come up with something on my own.


I would be real interested to hear back from those who get the same results as I do so please let me know.

Thanks

Hello,

I agree that the problem came from battery unit, after I have place some tape on the batteries, 3 weeks ago, no more problems..

Hello,

I agree that the problem came from battery unit, after I have place some tape on the batteries, 3 weeks ago, no more problems..

I have replaced the crappy thing polar calls a magnet, with a decent magnet, and that solved my cadence readings...

I bent the springs in the batterycontainer a little, and got good results today: 2 hours reliable power readings in all my gear combos, with no interference whatsoever....Lets hope it stays this way and then I am actually happy with this unit.

If I am correct...the fix for Polar to do would be engineer a battery sleeve's springs with stronger springs! Sounds like an easy fix to me. In the mean time...if I continue to get the same results, I may come up with something on my own.




Even better would be if they just came up with a rechargeable battery module. Shouldn't be too hard since the battery holder is attached with a connector. In fact, that's something some clever person could come up with on their own...all you need is a "spare" battery holder to scrounge the connector plug ;-) I'm sure someone could come up with something with a much lower profile/size and with greater capacity as well.

If I ever had one of the new Polars, that's the first thing I'd look into doing...

The crazy thing is, apparently the current battery configuration came about after "feedback" from ProTour mechanics. They apparently requested something where the batteries were easily replaceable and that's how the "cigar holder" came about. Seems to me that this was a case of Polar not looking at the needs of the ultimate end users and what made sense overall.

Then again, that wouldn't be the first time :rolleyes:

The crazy thing is, apparently the current battery configuration came about after "feedback" from ProTour mechanics. They apparently requested something where the batteries were easily replaceable and that's how the "cigar holder" came about. Seems to me that this was a case of Polar not looking at the needs of the ultimate end users and what made sense overall.

Then again, that wouldn't be the first time http://cyclingforums.com/images/smilies/rolleyes.gif...and of the eleven ProTour teams using the CS600, how many have we spotted so far using the power kit? I keep looking on the TV but so far I don't see any!

Meanwhile...the battery sleeve/connector ideas above are looking interesting. I bent my springs very slightly before this morning's commute and got a perfect 45 minutes...with no drop-outs. I then set out for the return leg this evening thinking that one bend per day should be enough. No! The dreaded 'check power' beeps every few minutes and no data worth keeping.

I also now have tape around the 'join' of the two batteries and I'll consider adding more tape around the mid-point of each battery (good job I don't have a Pro Tour mechanic...that would really slow him down!)

But shouldn't the weight of the loaded battery sleeve kep the thing in contact with the two connector pins at the bottom of the cigar? I've been giving it a good shove in, and screwing the cap down tight...is that the right approach, or do we think the sleeve needs to be looser so when it 'bounces' up the cigar on rough road it's free to drop back down?

Is anyone else nagging POlar about this? If so, how are you getting on?

McP

But shouldn't the weight of the loaded battery sleeve kep the thing in contact with the two connector pins at the bottom of the cigar? I've been giving it a good shove in, and screwing the cap down tight...is that the right approach, or do we think the sleeve needs to be looser so when it 'bounces' up the cigar on rough road it's free to drop back down?

Is anyone else nagging POlar about this? If so, how are you getting on?

McP

I now have an additional twist to the "battery-holder-spring theory". I removed the battery holder from the bike for testing, and discovered that when it's not zip-tied to the seatstay the batteries slide in and out freely and spring tension can be felt when the internal battery carrier is pressed into the cigar. When the battery holder is zip-tied to the seatstay, it appears that it gets bent just enough to bind the batteries inside the holder and interfere with good contact. I addressed this problem by using one tight zip-tie and one very loose, thus avoiding any bending of the holder. Results so far have been good. If problems persist, give this idea a try.

I now have an additional twist to the "battery-holder-spring theory". I removed the battery holder from the bike for testing, and discovered that when it's not zip-tied to the seatstay the batteries slide in and out freely and spring tension can be felt when the internal battery carrier is pressed into the cigar. When the battery holder is zip-tied to the seatstay, it appears that it gets bent just enough to bind the batteries inside the holder and interfere with good contact. I addressed this problem by using one tight zip-tie and one very loose, thus avoiding any bending of the holder. Results so far have been good. If problems persist, give this idea a try.Interesting....so you are saying that when the cigar is not zip-tied, and the cap is on the cigar with the batteries inside, you feel spring tension? What do you mean by spring tension? You can feel the batteries kind of bounce back and forth with a little resistance?

So...if I understand what you are saying, the bottom zip tie is pulling the positive (long spring that runs top to bottom) and restricting connectivity? If that is the case, I wonder if putting another piece of electrical tape at the bottom of the spring and pulling it snug in order force the spring to be closer to the battery case?

I now have an additional twist to the "battery-holder-spring theory". I removed the battery holder from the bike for testing, and discovered that when it's not zip-tied to the seatstay the batteries slide in and out freely and spring tension can be felt when the internal battery carrier is pressed into the cigar.It's a measure of how frustrated/obsessed I've become by getting this thing to work that I more or less ran round the room shouting 'Eureka' when I read this. It was simple but in the light of all the observed evidence it made so much sense.

But then I checked my unit...even with my battery holder detached and unplugged, the sleeve is just as tight a fit as when the thing is mounted. The tightness seems to come from the the long vertical 'spring' which acts to push the batteries themselves against the opposite wall of the case (as well as doing it's job as part of th circuit). However carefully I align this with the groove on the inside of the battery case I can't detect the spring tension you talk about. I certainly can't get it to a state where I can slide the batteries in freely.

I'm rubbish at electronics, so this is an innocent question: can the thing be screwed down too tight so as to break or short the circuit? I only ask, as I've been getting the data drops on perfectly smooth road and I'm not sure that they are linked to road shock moving the battery sleeve inside the case?

All that said, I've loosened one zip tie tonight, so we'll see what happens on the road tomorrow.http://cyclingforums.com/images/smilies/rolleyes.gif

McP

All that said, I've loosened one zip tie tonight, so we'll see what happens on the road tomorrow.http://cyclingforums.com/images/smilies/rolleyes.gif

McP...and the drop-outs continue. What do we think is causing the contact to break and reconect?...is the battery sleeve moving up the case under the force of vibration or are we all wrong and the issue is with the transmission of the signal from the power paddle to the computer?

Has anyone worked out whether the battery sleeve is physically able to move once the 'cigar' cap is screwed down?

Polar UK customer support have stopped answering their phone (unless it only switches to voicemail when it sees my number!!) so no help from them at present.

I got about 15 minutes of continuous data at the start of today's ride, then it came and went every few minutes. The only reason I ask about an issue with the paddle is that I can usually 're-start' my data by getting off the bike, disconnecting the power lead (from the battery case) at the paddle and re-connecting it.??

McP