Can you estimate V02 max?

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Wasn't Lance's FTP 6.5 w/kg? I don't even think his VO2max was that high- wasn't it more like 88? Be interesting to find out how this chart compares to real life measurements/data. Thanks for posting..very interesting.
This heavily discussed Ed Coyle paper:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/sites/entrez?Db=pubmed&Cmd=ShowDetailView&TermToSearch=15774697&ordinalpos=3&itool=EntrezSystem2.PEntrez.Pubmed.Pubmed_ResultsPanel.Pubmed_RVDocSum

has his maximal O2 uptake at "approximately" 6L/min (6000mL/min), and weight at "approximately" 70kg. Implying VO2 Max approximately mid-80's.

That said, it's unclear what Armstrong's weight was from 1999 - 2005, and I'm fairly sure he was not tested publicly (i.e. - the data is not public) for VO2 Max in any of those competitive seasons.

IOW, while baseline VO2 Max may have been pretty stable in the mid-80's, there's really no telling what it was during the periods we know he was able to make ~6.5W/kg. In fact, it may have been closer to the low/mid 90's number on that chart.

that chart is cool!

i wonder if it can be redone using the top anchor point of lance or indurain. And some other 'known' points?

i think we are on to somthing here.

The relationship between power and VO2 is something with which practically all exercise physiologists are quite familiar. In the present context, though, a distinction needs to be made between power at VO2max, power at the end of a VO2max test, and 5 min power, as using the latter two to estimate VO2max can result in a significant error (due to the contribution of anaerobic capacity to performance power).

BTW, the VO2max of the individual whose data serves as the top anchor of the 5 min column (for men) has been widely reported to be 90 mL/min/kg...substituting Armstrong's or Indurain's data would result in a lowering of the standards.

.... a distinction needs to be made between power at VO2max, power at the end of a VO2max test, and 5 min power, as using the latter two to estimate VO2max can result in a significant error (due to the contribution of anaerobic capacity to performance power)....That's the question I had when the formulas were first presented here. Over what time duration or with what testing protocol do you get the power number to plug into the formulas relating VO2 Max to power. Sounds like sort of a catch-22, if you need to determine power at VO2 Max it sounds like you need to measure power while doing a VO2 max test. If so you've already determined VO2 Max by a direct test and you don't really need the estimate ;)

-Dave

The relationship between power and VO2 is something with which practically all exercise physiologists are quite familiar. In the present context, though, a distinction needs to be made between power at VO2max, power at the end of a VO2max test, and 5 min power, as using the latter two to estimate VO2max can result in a significant error (due to the contribution of anaerobic capacity to performance power).

BTW, the VO2max of the individual whose data serves as the top anchor of the 5 min column (for men) has been widely reported to be 90 mL/min/kg...substituting Armstrong's or Indurain's data would result in a lowering of the standards.Since my calculated VO2max was surprisingly high considering my results :o, I had a feeling there was a catch (my max 5 min is 5.64W/kg). I read an article somewhere where the author suggested an 8 min TT with only the highest 6-minute wattage to be used as power at VO2max. Does that sound more reasonable to you Andy?

Also, you used a value of 2 in place of 1.8 (I quote: "assuming a somewhat lower slope (i.e., greater economy/efficiency"). Since those two figures can produce noticeably different results, can you explain what that economy/efficiency slope is and do cyclists have any control over it.

I had a series of VO2 Max tests done in mid 1988, I always came out between 68-72 mL/min/kg. That was at sea level, and the numbers I posted are from 7000'. My best sea level numbers are from a few years ago (2003? 2004?), 440W for 5 minutes at 80kg.

So yeah, in the ballpark.

ok so i finally got a v02 max test done this weekend. This was done to give a starting point for the 08' season.

I estimated my v02 last season, based off of 3 PR 5-6min power efforts. I'd had a couple of 385-415w efforts (the 415 was 6min NP however). I calculated it to be around 71 ml/kg/min at my best last season.

actual test.

This was done on an SRM Ergometer at ~1000ft+ sealevel.

25y/o
67kg

v02 max - 73.6 ml/kg/min and 4.84 l/min
power at end of effort - 400w +/-
Max HR - 197

V02 was still climbing but test ended because i couldn't hold the power any longer. I think that there is more power/better numbers once the season gets under way and i get down to race weight of 66kg.

leads me to believe that the formula is fairly accurate assuming you use the correct numbers from your PM.

ok so i finally got a v02 max test done this weekend. This was done to give a starting point for the 08' season.

I estimated my v02 last season, based off of 3 PR 5-6min power efforts. I'd had a couple of 385-415w efforts (the 415 was 6min NP however). I calculated it to be around 71 ml/kg/min at my best last season.

actual test.

This was done on an SRM Ergometer at ~1000ft+ sealevel.

25y/o
67kg

v02 max - 73.6 ml/kg/min and 4.84 l/min
power at end of effort - 400w +/-
Max HR - 197

V02 was still climbing but test ended because i couldn't hold the power any longer. I think that there is more power/better numbers once the season gets under way and i get down to race weight of 66kg.

leads me to believe that the formula is fairly accurate assuming you use the correct numbers from your PM.
Cool test..thanks for sharing. My estimate with the following formula is:
VO2max= 1.8((400 x 6.12/67 + 3.5) + 3.5= 75.5 ml/kg/min so pretty close estimate huh?

Cool test..thanks for sharing. My estimate with the following formula is:
VO2max= 1.8((400 x 6.12/67 + 3.5) + 3.5= 75.5 ml/kg/min so pretty close estimate huh?

i would think so. I would say its only as accurate as the way the power number was taken.

Vo2 max is a key indicator for a cyclists potential as it is less traineable than FTP. FTP is a function of Vo2 max, but is modified by your lactic threshold and efficiency which are very traineable. Hence a high vo2max and low FTP may indicate a potentially strong cyclist who with further training aimed at increasing their Vo2(LT) or Vo2(threshold) and efficiency will see good P(FTP) values.

P (FTP) ~ 1.15 * V02(max) * ((Vo2(LT)/(vo2(FTP)) * efficiency (watts/litres)

The middle figure is the percentage of vo2 consumption at LT as opposed to Vo2 max. It is a good indicator of aerobic conditioning. More training will bring this number up from as low as 70% in untrained individuals up to almost 90% in elite athletes,

The last figure is efficiency in watts per litre, which will also go up in response to short and long term adaptions such as the conversion of muscle fibres.

Regarding the formula, it gave me a Vo2 max of 67, actual testing gave 66.7, statistically identical in this case.

Also to be clear, the efficiency term used above the denominator is in Litres of Vo2.

To calculate, you just get your power at LT and divide by Vo2(lt) in litres/minute, not ml/min/kg.

Typical values should range from 65-85 watts litre.

Also the % values above were for FTP/Vo2 not LT/vo2, so values will be a bit lower, more like 55%-80%.