Passengers on Bicycles

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I just saw this page: http://www.ski-epic.com/amsterdam_bicycles/
which features lots of pictures of people in Amsterdam carrying
passengers on bicycles. I live in San Francisco and I don't drive. I'm
constantly having to wait for my non-biking friends who have to walk
to their car, drive slowly across town, find parking, then walk from
their car to where ever we're going. I'm almost certain that I could
get myself and a passenger anywhere in this city faster than if they
drove (assuming they had to use street parking).

With that goal in mind I did a quick search to see if there is any
equipment available to make this possible. There isn't. How can it be
that Europeans are all riding around with backrests attached to their
rear racks, while we Americans can't even buy one that would hold a
person's weight?

So, I turn to the gear heads. How would you build a bike that was
capable of carrying an adult passenger? Obviously strong wheels are
necessary. Also you'd need a beefy rack. Does anyone make one with a
200lbs or greater weight limit? Would you make them sit side saddle,
or straddling the rack. Forward facing or rear? Where could they hold
on? Where could they put their feet? I've seen kids riding around on
each other's foot pegs. Could BMX foot pegs attached to the rear axle
work? Could you even attach a full second seat? Lets hear your ideas.

Pilgrim who? wrote:
> I just saw this page: http://www.ski-epic.com/amsterdam_bicycles/
> which features lots of pictures of people in Amsterdam carrying
> passengers on bicycles. I live in San Francisco and I don't drive. I'm
> constantly having to wait for my non-biking friends who have to walk
> to their car, drive slowly across town, find parking, then walk from
> their car to where ever we're going. I'm almost certain that I could
> get myself and a passenger anywhere in this city faster than if they
> drove (assuming they had to use street parking).
>
> With that goal in mind I did a quick search to see if there is any
> equipment available to make this possible. There isn't. How can it be
> that Europeans are all riding around with backrests attached to their
> rear racks, while we Americans can't even buy one that would hold a
> person's weight?
>
> So, I turn to the gear heads. How would you build a bike that was
> capable of carrying an adult passenger? Obviously strong wheels are
> necessary. Also you'd need a beefy rack. Does anyone make one with a
> 200lbs or greater weight limit? Would you make them sit side saddle,
> or straddling the rack. Forward facing or rear? Where could they hold
> on? Where could they put their feet? I've seen kids riding around on
> each other's foot pegs. Could BMX foot pegs attached to the rear axle
> work? Could you even attach a full second seat? Lets hear your ideas.

See <http://www.hasebikes.com/ens/pino/index.php> and
<http://www.bilenky.com/viewpnt.html>.

--
Tom Sherman - Holstein-Friesland Bovinia
The weather is here, wish you were beautiful


--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com

On Jul 12, 9:46 am, Pilgrim <j...@codery.com> wrote:
> I just saw this page:http://www.ski-epic.com/amsterdam_bicycles/
> which features lots of pictures of people in Amsterdam carrying
> passengers on bicycles. I live in San Francisco and I don't drive. I'm
> constantly having to wait for my non-biking friends who have to walk
> to their car, drive slowly across town, find parking, then walk from
> their car to where ever we're going. I'm almost certain that I could
> get myself and a passenger anywhere in this city faster than if they
> drove (assuming they had to use street parking).
>
> With that goal in mind I did a quick search to see if there is any
> equipment available to make this possible. There isn't. How can it be
> that Europeans are all riding around with backrests attached to their
> rear racks, while we Americans can't even buy one that would hold a
> person's weight?
>
> So, I turn to the gear heads. How would you build a bike that was
> capable of carrying an adult passenger? Obviously strong wheels are
> necessary. Also you'd need a beefy rack. Does anyone make one with a
> 200lbs or greater weight limit? Would you make them sit side saddle,
> or straddling the rack. Forward facing or rear? Where could they hold
> on? Where could they put their feet? I've seen kids riding around on
> each other's foot pegs. Could BMX foot pegs attached to the rear axle
> work? Could you even attach a full second seat? Lets hear your ideas.

Is this even legal in SF? I see lots of kids doing this Japan, but
that's due to the lack of law enforcement.

On Jul 11, 6:00 pm, tiborg <tcg...@mac.com> wrote:
> On Jul 12, 9:46 am, Pilgrim <j...@codery.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> > I just saw this page:http://www.ski-epic.com/amsterdam_bicycles/
> > which features lots of pictures of people in Amsterdam carrying
> > passengers on bicycles. I live in San Francisco and I don't drive. I'm
> > constantly having to wait for my non-biking friends who have to walk
> > to their car, drive slowly across town, find parking, then walk from
> > their car to where ever we're going. I'm almost certain that I could
> > get myself and a passenger anywhere in this city faster than if they
> > drove (assuming they had to use street parking).
>
> > With that goal in mind I did a quick search to see if there is any
> > equipment available to make this possible. There isn't. How can it be
> > that Europeans are all riding around with backrests attached to their
> > rear racks, while we Americans can't even buy one that would hold a
> > person's weight?
>
> > So, I turn to the gear heads. How would you build a bike that was
> > capable of carrying an adult passenger? Obviously strong wheels are
> > necessary. Also you'd need a beefy rack. Does anyone make one with a
> > 200lbs or greater weight limit? Would you make them sit side saddle,
> > or straddling the rack. Forward facing or rear? Where could they hold
> > on? Where could they put their feet? I've seen kids riding around on
> > each other's foot pegs. Could BMX foot pegs attached to the rear axle
> > work? Could you even attach a full second seat? Lets hear your ideas.
>
> Is this even legal in SF? I see lots of kids doing this Japan, but
> that's due to the lack of law enforcement.

Likely not, but then bicycles get away with a lot in this town, and if
we're being honest, even when we don't we kinda like the civil
disobedience of it. Just look at Critical Mass.

"tiborg" <tcg001@mac.com> wrote in message
news:1184202016.514497.323360@22g2000hsm.googlegroups.com...
> On Jul 12, 9:46 am, Pilgrim <j...@codery.com> wrote:
> > I just saw this page:http://www.ski-epic.com/amsterdam_bicycles/
> > which features lots of pictures of people in Amsterdam carrying
> > passengers on bicycles. I live in San Francisco and I don't drive. I'm
> > constantly having to wait for my non-biking friends who have to walk
> > to their car, drive slowly across town, find parking, then walk from
> > their car to where ever we're going. I'm almost certain that I could
> > get myself and a passenger anywhere in this city faster than if they
> > drove (assuming they had to use street parking).
> >
> > With that goal in mind I did a quick search to see if there is any
> > equipment available to make this possible. There isn't. How can it be
> > that Europeans are all riding around with backrests attached to their
> > rear racks, while we Americans can't even buy one that would hold a
> > person's weight?
> >
> > So, I turn to the gear heads. How would you build a bike that was
> > capable of carrying an adult passenger? Obviously strong wheels are
> > necessary. Also you'd need a beefy rack. Does anyone make one with a
> > 200lbs or greater weight limit? Would you make them sit side saddle,
> > or straddling the rack. Forward facing or rear? Where could they hold
> > on? Where could they put their feet? I've seen kids riding around on
> > each other's foot pegs. Could BMX foot pegs attached to the rear axle
> > work? Could you even attach a full second seat? Lets hear your ideas.
>
> Is this even legal in SF? I see lots of kids doing this Japan, but
> that's due to the lack of law enforcement.
>

1. Japan is not a litigatious society like the US.
2. Lawyers would have a fielday with personal injury suits on this one.
3. The average Japanese person weighs a lot less than people in the US and
Europe.
4. They ride 50 Lb. rod brake bikes that will support a lot of weight.
5. They are not riding up and down steep hills like those in SF.

When I was in Japan in the mid 1960s I was always in awe at how the
Japanese could maneuver in traffic with a woman sitting sidesaddle on a
wide rack on the back of the bike carrying a child and or a large package.

I'd like to see some fool pedal up Lombard St. with a 135 Lb. passenger.

Chas.

"Pilgrim" <jesse@codery.com> wrote in message
news:1184201212.812644.280720@o61g2000hsh.googlegroups.com...
> I just saw this page: http://www.ski-epic.com/amsterdam_bicycles/
> which features lots of pictures of people in Amsterdam carrying
> passengers on bicycles. I live in San Francisco and I don't drive. I'm
> constantly having to wait for my non-biking friends who have to walk
> to their car, drive slowly across town, find parking, then walk from
> their car to where ever we're going. I'm almost certain that I could
> get myself and a passenger anywhere in this city faster than if they
> drove (assuming they had to use street parking).
>
> With that goal in mind I did a quick search to see if there is any
> equipment available to make this possible. There isn't. How can it be
> that Europeans are all riding around with backrests attached to their
> rear racks, while we Americans can't even buy one that would hold a
> person's weight?
>
> So, I turn to the gear heads. How would you build a bike that was
> capable of carrying an adult passenger? Obviously strong wheels are
> necessary. Also you'd need a beefy rack. Does anyone make one with a
> 200lbs or greater weight limit? Would you make them sit side saddle,
> or straddling the rack. Forward facing or rear? Where could they hold
> on? Where could they put their feet? I've seen kids riding around on
> each other's foot pegs. Could BMX foot pegs attached to the rear axle
> work? Could you even attach a full second seat? Lets hear your ideas.
>

I'd like to see you pedal up Lombard St. with a 200 Lb. passenger. I'd be
down on the ground screaming "I'm not worthy..." ;-)

Chas.

>> Pilgrim <j...@codery.com> wrote:
>>> I just saw this page:http://www.ski-epic.com/amsterdam_bicycles/
>>> which features lots of pictures of people in Amsterdam carrying
>>> passengers on bicycles. I live in San Francisco and I don't drive. I'm
>>> constantly having to wait for my non-biking friends who have to walk
>>> to their car, drive slowly across town, find parking, then walk from
>>> their car to where ever we're going. I'm almost certain that I could
>>> get myself and a passenger anywhere in this city faster than if they
>>> drove (assuming they had to use street parking).
>>>
>>> With that goal in mind I did a quick search to see if there is any
>>> equipment available to make this possible. There isn't. How can it be
>>> that Europeans are all riding around with backrests attached to their
>>> rear racks, while we Americans can't even buy one that would hold a
>>> person's weight?
>>>
>>> So, I turn to the gear heads. How would you build a bike that was
>>> capable of carrying an adult passenger? Obviously strong wheels are
>>> necessary. Also you'd need a beefy rack. Does anyone make one with a
>>> 200lbs or greater weight limit? Would you make them sit side saddle,
>>> or straddling the rack. Forward facing or rear? Where could they hold
>>> on? Where could they put their feet? I've seen kids riding around on
>>> each other's foot pegs. Could BMX foot pegs attached to the rear axle
>>> work? Could you even attach a full second seat? Lets hear your ideas.

> "tiborg" <tcg001@mac.com> wrote in message
>> Is this even legal in SF? I see lots of kids doing this Japan, but
>> that's due to the lack of law enforcement.

* * Chas wrote:
> 1. Japan is not a litigatious society like the US.
> 2. Lawyers would have a fielday with personal injury suits on this one.
> 3. The average Japanese person weighs a lot less than people in the US and
> Europe.
> 4. They ride 50 Lb. rod brake bikes that will support a lot of weight.
> 5. They are not riding up and down steep hills like those in SF.
>
> When I was in Japan in the mid 1960s I was always in awe at how the
> Japanese could maneuver in traffic with a woman sitting sidesaddle on a
> wide rack on the back of the bike carrying a child and or a large package.
>
> I'd like to see some fool pedal up Lombard St. with a 135 Lb. passenger.

Yes, roadsters were indeed the standard bike in the sixties but Japanese
fashion switched 25+ years ago. China & India have largely abandoned
roadsters as well.

Although illegal, kids who do it here find Wald steel racks last longer
than aluminum models. I agree it's not a great idea.
--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

On Jul 12, 9:14 am, "* * Chas" <verktygj...@aol.spamski.com> wrote:
> "tiborg" <tcg...@mac.com> wrote in message
>
> news:1184202016.514497.323360@22g2000hsm.googlegroups.com...
>
>
>
> > On Jul 12, 9:46 am, Pilgrim <j...@codery.com> wrote:
> > > I just saw this page:http://www.ski-epic.com/amsterdam_bicycles/
> > > which features lots of pictures of people in Amsterdam carrying
> > > passengers on bicycles. I live in San Francisco and I don't drive. I'm
> > > constantly having to wait for my non-biking friends who have to walk
> > > to their car, drive slowly across town, find parking, then walk from
> > > their car to where ever we're going. I'm almost certain that I could
> > > get myself and a passenger anywhere in this city faster than if they
> > > drove (assuming they had to use street parking).
>
> > > With that goal in mind I did a quick search to see if there is any
> > > equipment available to make this possible. There isn't. How can it be
> > > that Europeans are all riding around with backrests attached to their
> > > rear racks, while we Americans can't even buy one that would hold a
> > > person's weight?
>
> > > So, I turn to the gear heads. How would you build a bike that was
> > > capable of carrying an adult passenger? Obviously strong wheels are
> > > necessary. Also you'd need a beefy rack. Does anyone make one with a
> > > 200lbs or greater weight limit? Would you make them sit side saddle,
> > > or straddling the rack. Forward facing or rear? Where could they hold
> > > on? Where could they put their feet? I've seen kids riding around on
> > > each other's foot pegs. Could BMX foot pegs attached to the rear axle
> > > work? Could you even attach a full second seat? Lets hear your ideas.
>
> > Is this even legal in SF? I see lots of kids doing this Japan, but
> > that's due to the lack of law enforcement.
>
> 1. Japan is not a litigatious society like the US.
> 2. Lawyers would have a fielday with personal injury suits on this one.
> 3. The average Japanese person weighs a lot less than people in the US and
> Europe.
> 4. They ride 50 Lb. rod brake bikes that will support a lot of weight.
> 5. They are not riding up and down steep hills like those in SF.
>
> When I was in Japan in the mid 1960s I was always in awe at how the
> Japanese could maneuver in traffic with a woman sitting sidesaddle on a
> wide rack on the back of the bike carrying a child and or a large package.
>
> I'd like to see some fool pedal up Lombard St. with a 135 Lb. passenger.
>
> Chas.

I'd like to see some fool pedal himself up Lombard period. I tried it
once the first week I was here, and I'll never try it again. The
Embarcadero is a much better way to the Marina. :-)

Jesse

"A Muzi" <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote in message
news:139cm9jnimnmh05@corp.supernews.com...
> >> Pilgrim <j...@codery.com> wrote:
> >>> I just saw this page:http://www.ski-epic.com/amsterdam_bicycles/
> >>> which features lots of pictures of people in Amsterdam carrying
> >>> passengers on bicycles. I live in San Francisco and I don't drive.
I'm
> >>> constantly having to wait for my non-biking friends who have to walk
> >>> to their car, drive slowly across town, find parking, then walk from
> >>> their car to where ever we're going. I'm almost certain that I could
> >>> get myself and a passenger anywhere in this city faster than if they
> >>> drove (assuming they had to use street parking).
> >>>
> >>> With that goal in mind I did a quick search to see if there is any
> >>> equipment available to make this possible. There isn't. How can it
be
> >>> that Europeans are all riding around with backrests attached to
their
> >>> rear racks, while we Americans can't even buy one that would hold a
> >>> person's weight?
> >>>
> >>> So, I turn to the gear heads. How would you build a bike that was
> >>> capable of carrying an adult passenger? Obviously strong wheels are
> >>> necessary. Also you'd need a beefy rack. Does anyone make one with a
> >>> 200lbs or greater weight limit? Would you make them sit side saddle,
> >>> or straddling the rack. Forward facing or rear? Where could they
hold
> >>> on? Where could they put their feet? I've seen kids riding around on
> >>> each other's foot pegs. Could BMX foot pegs attached to the rear
axle
> >>> work? Could you even attach a full second seat? Lets hear your
ideas.
>
> > "tiborg" <tcg001@mac.com> wrote in message
> >> Is this even legal in SF? I see lots of kids doing this Japan, but
> >> that's due to the lack of law enforcement.
>
> * * Chas wrote:
> > 1. Japan is not a litigatious society like the US.
> > 2. Lawyers would have a fielday with personal injury suits on this
one.
> > 3. The average Japanese person weighs a lot less than people in the US
and
> > Europe.
> > 4. They ride 50 Lb. rod brake bikes that will support a lot of weight.
> > 5. They are not riding up and down steep hills like those in SF.
> >
> > When I was in Japan in the mid 1960s I was always in awe at how the
> > Japanese could maneuver in traffic with a woman sitting sidesaddle on
a
> > wide rack on the back of the bike carrying a child and or a large
package.
> >
> > I'd like to see some fool pedal up Lombard St. with a 135 Lb.
passenger.
>
> Yes, roadsters were indeed the standard bike in the sixties but Japanese
> fashion switched 25+ years ago. China & India have largely abandoned
> roadsters as well.
>
> Although illegal, kids who do it here find Wald steel racks last longer
> than aluminum models. I agree it's not a great idea.
> --
> Andrew Muzi

Every summer when I was growing up (1950s) some kid in the neighborhood
would get a severe injury from riding double on a bike. Riding on the rear
rack, they would get their foot caught in the rear wheel, riding
sidesaddle on the crossbar probably wasn't so bad but sitting on the
handle bars was absolutely crazy.

Chas.

On Jul 11, 5:46 pm, Pilgrim <j...@codery.com> wrote:
> I just saw this page:http://www.ski-epic.com/amsterdam_bicycles/
> which features lots of pictures of people in Amsterdam carrying
> passengers on bicycles. I live in San Francisco and I don't drive. I'm
> constantly having to wait for my non-biking friends who have to walk
> to their car, drive slowly across town, find parking, then walk from
> their car to where ever we're going. I'm almost certain that I could
> get myself and a passenger anywhere in this city faster than if they
> drove (assuming they had to use street parking).
>
> With that goal in mind I did a quick search to see if there is any
> equipment available to make this possible. There isn't. How can it be
> that Europeans are all riding around with backrests attached to their
> rear racks, while we Americans can't even buy one that would hold a
> person's weight?
>
> So, I turn to the gear heads. How would you build a bike that was
> capable of carrying an adult passenger? Obviously strong wheels are
> necessary. Also you'd need a beefy rack. Does anyone make one with a
> 200lbs or greater weight limit? Would you make them sit side saddle,
> or straddling the rack. Forward facing or rear? Where could they hold
> on? Where could they put their feet? I've seen kids riding around on
> each other's foot pegs. Could BMX foot pegs attached to the rear axle
> work? Could you even attach a full second seat? Lets hear your ideas.

I've come to the conclusion that I'm just going to have to build my
own rack. A rack that's built thick enough to hold a person. One that
can hold panniers with the best of them, but doesn't make my bike look
expedition ready when the panniers are off. If I had one of those, it
would be easy to make a padded seat that could strap on in a pinch.
Then I think I'd have people ride with their backs facing me, and
affix handles to the rack wherever they were convenient for a
passenger, and removable when there wasn't one. BMX foot pegs could
provide a good foot rest for them too. I personally don't understand
why that should be illegal. I mean, tendems are legal. With a rack
purpose made for a rider, my bike would technically be a "bicycle
built for two".

Pilgrim wrote:
> I've come to the conclusion that I'm just going to have to build my
> own rack. A rack that's built thick enough to hold a person. One that
> can hold panniers with the best of them, but doesn't make my bike look
> expedition ready when the panniers are off. If I had one of those, it
> would be easy to make a padded seat that could strap on in a pinch.
> Then I think I'd have people ride with their backs facing me, and
> affix handles to the rack wherever they were convenient for a
> passenger, and removable when there wasn't one. BMX foot pegs could
> provide a good foot rest for them too. I personally don't understand
> why that should be illegal. I mean, tendems are legal. With a rack
> purpose made for a rider, my bike would technically be a "bicycle
> built for two".

Have you seen the Xtracycle? www.xtracycle.com, look for the "SnapDeck."

No connection with the company, and I don't have personal experience. It
looks kinda like you describe, though.

--
Dave
dvt at psu dot edu

Everyone confesses that exertion which brings out all the powers of body
and mind is the best thing for us; but most people do all they can to
get rid of it, and as a general rule nobody does much more than
circumstances drive them to do. -Harriet Beecher Stowe, abolitionist and
novelist (1811-1896)

On Jul 12, 11:13 am, dvt <dvt+use...@psu.edu> wrote:
> Pilgrim wrote:
> > I've come to the conclusion that I'm just going to have to build my
> > own rack. A rack that's built thick enough to hold a person. One that
> > can hold panniers with the best of them, but doesn't make my bike look
> > expedition ready when the panniers are off. If I had one of those, it
> > would be easy to make a padded seat that could strap on in a pinch.
> > Then I think I'd have people ride with their backs facing me, and
> > affix handles to the rack wherever they were convenient for a
> > passenger, and removable when there wasn't one. BMX foot pegs could
> > provide a good foot rest for them too. I personally don't understand
> > why that should be illegal. I mean, tendems are legal. With a rack
> > purpose made for a rider, my bike would technically be a "bicycle
> > built for two".
>
> Have you seen the Xtracycle?www.xtracycle.com, look for the "SnapDeck."
>
> No connection with the company, and I don't have personal experience. It
> looks kinda like you describe, though.
>
> --
> Dave
> dvt at psu dot edu
>
> Everyone confesses that exertion which brings out all the powers of body
> and mind is the best thing for us; but most people do all they can to
> get rid of it, and as a general rule nobody does much more than
> circumstances drive them to do. -Harriet Beecher Stowe, abolitionist and
> novelist (1811-1896)

That's the right idea, but if I ever had an extra-cycle I probably
wouldn't ride it every day, which means I probably wouldn't be riding
it when someone needed a lift. If I ever made a habit out of carrying
passengers, one of those look like the best solution. Seems like it
would help to distribute the weight to the front tire a little more
than if the passenger simply rode on top of the rear wheel.

Pilgrim wrote:
> I just saw this page: http://www.ski-epic.com/amsterdam_bicycles/
> which features lots of pictures of people in Amsterdam carrying
> passengers on bicycles. ...

Here's a page of multiperson hpvs:

http://www.geocities.com/rcgilmore3/MultiPerson.htm

Well, at least you would not be doing all the work.

These guys sell those Dutch bikes:

http://clevercycles.com/?p=189

alan.

On Thu, 12 Jul 2007 10:32:37 -0700, "* * Chas"
<verktygjunk@aol.spamski.com> wrote:


>Every summer when I was growing up (1950s) some kid in the neighborhood
>would get a severe injury from riding double on a bike. Riding on the rear
>rack, they would get their foot caught in the rear wheel, riding
>sidesaddle on the crossbar probably wasn't so bad but sitting on the
>handle bars was absolutely crazy.

From Jobst Brandt
http://aistigave.hit.bg/Logistics/
--
JT
****************************
Remove "remove" to reply
Visit http://www.jt10000.com
****************************

Pilgrim wrote:
>
> So, I turn to the gear heads. How would you build a bike that was
> capable of carrying an adult passenger? Obviously strong wheels are
> necessary.

Yep. I recommend a 48 spoke rear wheel, dishless if possible.

> Also you'd need a beefy rack. Does anyone make one with a
> 200lbs or greater weight limit?

No. I would make my own if I wanted to carry a passenger. The
closest thing I've seen to suitable is the Burley Moose Rack, but like
most things made by Burley, I think it's no longer in production. At
200 lbs. payload, I think the dropout eyelets and 5mm fasteners used
to anchor most rack stays would become as much of an issue as the
rack's construction. I'd be inclined to braze or weld on some good-
sized nuts (like 8mm) to carry the load. Or just weld the rack
directly to the frame.

> Would you make them sit side saddle,
> or straddling the rack. Forward facing or rear? Where could they hold
> on? Where could they put their feet? I've seen kids riding around on
> each other's foot pegs. Could BMX foot pegs attached to the rear axle
> work? Could you even attach a full second seat?

Footpegs are a good idea IF you use a BMX hub with a 14mm axle, and a
frame with substantial stays and dropouts-- the Redline Monocog comes
to mind on that count. The axle of a loose-ball 14mm axle hub can be
slewed over to the drive side for the purpose of adding spacers and
mounting a multi-speed freewheel. The spacer and locknut would have
to be ground, turned, or otherwise reduced in diameter to no more than
19mm (to fit through a freewheel), and you'd probably have to get an
axle with milled flats to fit a 3/8" dropout slot.

To skip all that complication, you could use motorcycle "highway pegs"
mounted to the chainstays just ahead of the dropouts or perhaps
appendages on the rack itself. But using a hub with a reinforced
axle, like the Gusset Jury hub, is still a good idea to prevent axle
bending or breakage. Unlike the rear wheel of a tandem which mostly
just carries the weight of the stoker, the rear wheel of the bike you
have in mind will be called upon to carry most of the weight of both
riders.

You can use a tandem stoker stem and cut=down MTB bar to give your
passenger a good way to hold on. a regular bike seat isn't the right
shape for a spraddle-legged backseat rider, but a motorcycle "pillion
pad" is just right. Take note; they range in price from about $30 to
over $300, with the latter pricing designed to fleece Harley-riding
and wannabee-Harley-riding morons.

http://www.royalenfieldusa.com/deluxe-standard-pillion-matches-deluxe-standard-solo-seat-p-424.html
http://search.ebay.com/pillion-pad_W0QQ_trksidZm37QQfromZR40

For all the trouble you'd go to in the attempt to make a single bike
work for two, you might find it easier to use an Xtracycle Free
Radical attachment for your bike, which offers handy options like seat
cushions and footboards.

http://www.rideyourbike.com/xtracycle.html

Chalo

"John Forrest Tomlinson" <usenetremove@jt10000.com> wrote in message
news:cled939952uuggad26djl2scel2nso87ln@4ax.com...
> On Thu, 12 Jul 2007 10:32:37 -0700, "* * Chas"
> <verktygjunk@aol.spamski.com> wrote:
>
>
> >Every summer when I was growing up (1950s) some kid in the neighborhood
> >would get a severe injury from riding double on a bike. Riding on the
rear
> >rack, they would get their foot caught in the rear wheel, riding
> >sidesaddle on the crossbar probably wasn't so bad but sitting on the
> >handle bars was absolutely crazy.
>
> From Jobst Brandt
> http://aistigave.hit.bg/Logistics/
> --
> JT

No personal injury lawyers....

Chas.

On Jul 12, 8:37 pm, Chalo <chalo.col...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Footpegs are a good idea IF you use a BMX hub with a 14mm axle, and a
> frame with substantial stays and dropouts-- the Redline Monocog comes
> to mind on that count. The axle of a loose-ball 14mm axle hub can be
> slewed over to the drive side for the purpose of adding spacers and
> mounting a multi-speed freewheel. The spacer and locknut would have
> to be ground, turned, or otherwise reduced in diameter to no more than
> 19mm (to fit through a freewheel), and you'd probably have to get an
> axle with milled flats to fit a 3/8" dropout slot.

I've ridden quite a bit of 20" in my years, and have carried many
people many miles on pegs back when we kept 4 of them on the bike
instead of the two on one side. In addition to 14mm axles, I would
suggest some thouroughly bombproof pegs. In my experience the lighter
pegs bend early, and often bend the axles in the process. I suspect a
solid 14mm axle with a really bombproof peg (expect to add a good
pound in pegs alone) should be stronger than most road or touring
dropouts.

Pilgrim wrote:

> ...if I ever had an extra-cycle I probably
> wouldn't ride it every day, which means I probably wouldn't be riding
> it when someone needed a lift.

I suspect that will be your main obstacle to finding a suitable
passenger carrying solution. I agree with you... you highlight one of my
main obstacles to pulling a trailer full time, riding an Xtracycle, or
anything of that nature.

--
Dave
dvt at psu dot edu

Everyone confesses that exertion which brings out all the powers of body
and mind is the best thing for us; but most people do all they can to
get rid of it, and as a general rule nobody does much more than
circumstances drive them to do. -Harriet Beecher Stowe, abolitionist and
novelist (1811-1896)

Pilgrim wrote:
> I just saw this page: http://www.ski-epic.com/amsterdam_bicycles/
> which features lots of pictures of people in Amsterdam carrying
> passengers on bicycles.

> With that goal in mind I did a quick search to see if there is any
> equipment available to make this possible. There isn't. How can it be
> that Europeans are all riding around with backrests attached to their
> rear racks, while we Americans can't even buy one that would hold a
> person's weight?

It is true that US bicycle racks all suck ass. They're cheap and flimsy,
because even though you can pay $200 for a well-built rack, it's still
resting all its weight on two tiny 5mm bolts because that's all that US
companies will put on the frames.

If you want to be able to carry lots of weight regularly, then I'd guess
the easiest thing to do would be make a long-rear-end on a frame, and
weld a rack onto that from 3/4" tubing or whatever. The Xtracycle is a
nice idea, but I tend to suspect it's not as stiff as a welded frame
would be and the benefit of being removable is rather dubious, because
of the problem with needing the longer chain.

>
> So, I turn to the gear heads. How would you build a bike that was
> capable of carrying an adult passenger?

Well you could just get a tandem, but then you'd be stuck riding a
tandem all the time.... I'd think in SF you'd come to appreciate the
help getting up hills tho'.

I think the best all-around utility bike would be a Dutch-style cargo
bike (front box) with a wire basket-mesh box instead of wood. Buying
such a thing would be pretty silly though, they're horribly expensive
($2500+?) and would be prone to theft. Buy a welding torch and D.I.Y.,
you could make something like that for a lot less than $2500, even
counting the cost of buying the welding equipment.
~