The $15k delusion: not just for Div III cyclists!

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A story in Canada's National Newspaper -- No, The Other One, talks about
a Brooks (running shoes)-sponsored project to create a house of marathon
runners.

http://www.nationalpost.com/news/canada/story.html?id=536964

The key quotes are pretty hilarious:

"The train-together, win-together approach to the 42.2-kilometre test
was perfected by the Kenyans. For Africans, running can be a way out of
a poverty trap. For young Canadians with Olympic aspirations, it can be
a road to financial ruin.

"The pressure of watching people the same age start careers and
families, and the long climb up the ladder of success, was a major
source of stress for Tara Quinn-Smith before she moved into the house.

""That other part of life is put on hold here," says Ms. Quinn-Smith,
who shares a basement apartment with her husband, and fellow runner,
Andrew. "Because it is put on hold for everyone in the house, it makes
it seem OK.""


I suppose I think it's pretty cool that Brooks is sponsoring something
like this to help transform Canada's pathetic distance-running, but boy,
the participants seem just as messed-up as semi-pro bike racers. At
least Ms. Quinn-Smith seems to realize she's making a mistake, but she's
doing it as a conscious choice.

Mama, don't let your sons grow up to be athletes,

--
Ryan Cousineau rcousine@gmail.com http://www.wiredcola.com/
"In other newsgroups, they killfile trolls."
"In rec.bicycles.racing, we coach them."

On May 26, 5:00 pm, "joseph.santanie...@gmail.com"
<joseph.santanie...@gmail.com> wrote:

>
> But I think kids should have a go at being athletes if they want, in
> any sport. Give it 10 years. If you aren't anywhere by 26, forget it.
> But there is plenty of time to go to school and have a real life
> after. The person might be more mature as well and get more out of an
> education at that point too.
>
> Joseph- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

I think our lack of European style "sport schools" is a huge mistake
too. I'm fairly familiar with the German version and they are great.
The kids get to go do their sports as a school subject, but also learn
trades surrounding sports to stay in the school and do their thing.
Along with the sport the klids I knew did sports nutrition, anatomy,
lots of life sciences stuff, sports medicine type stuff. They did an
awesome job of using the kids interests to get tham an education. Even
if the kid wasn't going to make it as an athlete they were prepared to
do something related to sports, or had a solid basis to move on to
something else at the end of HS. Kept the kids massively motivated to
learn.
Bill C

On May 26, 5:00 pm, "joseph.santanie...@gmail.com"
<joseph.santanie...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> How many people make any money at all running? At least with cycling
> there are some guys on minimum wage.

What's a typical prime prize for a runner? Shorts or a pair of
socks?
People should only run when they're being chased.

R

In article
<3aaad6e7-674c-4331-a949-8ee18507b528@26g2000hsk.googlegroups.com>,
Bill C <tritonrider@verizon.net> wrote:

> On May 26, 5:00 pm, "joseph.santanie...@gmail.com"
> <joseph.santanie...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> >
> > But I think kids should have a go at being athletes if they want, in
> > any sport. Give it 10 years. If you aren't anywhere by 26, forget it.
> > But there is plenty of time to go to school and have a real life
> > after. The person might be more mature as well and get more out of an
> > education at that point too.
> >
> > Joseph- Hide quoted text -
> >
> > - Show quoted text -
>
> I think our lack of European style "sport schools" is a huge mistake
> too. I'm fairly familiar with the German version and they are great.
> The kids get to go do their sports as a school subject, but also learn
> trades surrounding sports to stay in the school and do their thing.
> Along with the sport the klids I knew did sports nutrition, anatomy,
> lots of life sciences stuff, sports medicine type stuff. They did an
> awesome job of using the kids interests to get tham an education. Even
> if the kid wasn't going to make it as an athlete they were prepared to
> do something related to sports, or had a solid basis to move on to
> something else at the end of HS. Kept the kids massively motivated to
> learn.
> Bill C

I should be of two minds about this. On one hand, my brother-in-law
wasted most of his late teens chasing the hockey dream all the way up to
the Austin Ice Bats. Except, erm, he is now running a very successful
hockey school, so I guess it worked out okay.

I still think there's a mismatch between available sports jobs and
available sports wannabes, but I also know an awful lot of people who
make their living that way. Maybe there's more master fatties than I
think.

--
Ryan Cousineau rcousine@gmail.com http://www.wiredcola.com/
"In other newsgroups, they killfile trolls."
"In rec.bicycles.racing, we coach them."

On May 26, 4:50 pm, Ryan Cousineau <rcous...@gmail.com> wrote:
> In article
> <3aaad6e7-674c-4331-a949-8ee18507b...@26g2000hsk.googlegroups.com>,
>  Bill C <tritonri...@verizon.net> wrote:
>
>
>
> > On May 26, 5:00 pm, "joseph.santanie...@gmail.com"
> > <joseph.santanie...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > But I think kids should have a go at being athletes if they want, in
> > > any sport. Give it 10 years. If you aren't anywhere by 26, forget it.
> > > But there is plenty of time to go to school and have a real life
> > > after. The person might be more mature as well and get more out of an
> > > education at that point too.
>
> > > Joseph- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > - Show quoted text -
>
> >  I think our lack of European style "sport schools" is a huge mistake
> > too. I'm fairly familiar with the German version and they are great.
> > The kids get to go do their sports as a school subject, but also learn
> > trades surrounding sports to stay in the school and do their thing.
> > Along with the sport the klids I knew did sports nutrition, anatomy,
> > lots of life sciences stuff, sports medicine type stuff. They did an
> > awesome job of using the kids interests to get tham an education. Even
> > if the kid wasn't going to make it as an athlete they were prepared to
> > do something related to sports, or had a solid basis to move on to
> > something else at the end of HS. Kept the kids massively motivated to
> > learn.
> >  Bill C
>
> I should be of two minds about this. On one hand, my brother-in-law
> wasted most of his late teens chasing the hockey dream all the way up to
> the Austin Ice Bats. Except, erm, he is now running a very successful
> hockey school, so I guess it worked out okay.
>
> I still think there's a mismatch between available sports jobs and
> available sports wannabes, but I also know an awful lot of people who
> make their living that way. Maybe there's more master fatties than I
> think.

I don't see where this particular story would require
sports schools. My guess is that most of the people in that
house are in their 20s (it doesn't give ages, but two of them
previously had full time jobs as teachers). Actually I think
special school tracking is potentially a bad idea for runners.
The training load for runners is such that you can still do a
real college education if you want (as opposed to the time
demands of an NCAA Div I team sport).

I know, distantly, a US long distance runner of high caliber.
Literally, Olympic-level. He went to a top US university
that also has a well-known track program. Then he got
sponsored by a shoe company. I'm sure he didn't make
bank, and I'm sure he isn't going to keep doing it forever -
IOW, he's not Roberto Gaggioli. The key point is that
once he stops doing it, he has the education and
resources to move on.

Why shouldn't people in their 20s be 15k dreamers?
You have the rest of your life to sit in an office. Some
people spend their 20s working temp jobs or retail while
they try to write a novel or make it as artists. A few of
them go on to make a career of it and the rest become
productive members of society or join me and Chung
inside universities. I don't see this as a problem
unless they hang on too long, or have no other options.
A 24 year old 15k dreamer with a college degree is
an idealist. A 34 year old 15k dreamer with no degree
is a man with nothing better to do.

Ben

p.s. Just to be clear, I don't have a problem with
collegiate running, or cycling for that matter. But NCAA
Div I major team sports are another thing entirely -
both colleges and the pro leagues are exploiting the
kids as 0k dreamers. Maybe Bill C's sports schools
would do that differently.

On May 26, 1:49 pm, Ryan Cousineau <rcous...@gmail.com> wrote:
> A story in Canada's National Newspaper -- No, The Other One, talks about
> a Brooks (running shoes)-sponsored project to create a house of marathon
> runners.
>
> http://www.nationalpost.com/news/canada/story.html?id=536964
>
>
> I suppose I think it's pretty cool that Brooks is sponsoring something
> like this to help transform Canada's pathetic distance-running, but boy,
> the participants seem just as messed-up as semi-pro bike racers. At
> least Ms. Quinn-Smith seems to realize she's making a mistake, but she's
> doing it as a conscious choice.
>
> Mama, don't let your sons grow up to be athletes,

I forgot, there's another positive side to this story,
which is that it proves the existence of at least 11
Canadians who still have both of their feet.

http://www.nationalpost.com/news/canada/story.html?id=536978

Ben

RicodJour wrote:
> What's a typical prime prize for a runner? Shorts or a pair of socks?
> People should only run when they're being chased.

http://www.thefinalsprint.com/2008/04/boston-marathon-boosts-prize-money-for-2008/

bjw@mambo.ucolick.org schreef:
> http://www.nationalpost.com/news/canada/story.html?id=536978

Good find. I'm never buying Reebok again.

"Ted van de Weteringe" <myfullname@xs4all.nl.invalid> wrote in message
news:483bcc1b$0$14343$e4fe514c@news.xs4all.nl...
> bjw@mambo.ucolick.org schreef:
>> http://www.nationalpost.com/news/canada/story.html?id=536978
>
> Good find. I'm never buying Reebok again.

Do you prefer Adidas?

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/11026473/

On May 26, 10:16 pm, "b...@mambo.ucolick.org" <b...@mambo.ucolick.org>
wrote:
> On May 26, 1:49 pm, Ryan Cousineau <rcous...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > A story in Canada's National Newspaper -- No, The Other One, talks about
> > a Brooks (running shoes)-sponsored project to create a house of marathon
> > runners.
>
> >http://www.nationalpost.com/news/canada/story.html?id=536964
>
> > I suppose I think it's pretty cool that Brooks is sponsoring something
> > like this to help transform Canada's pathetic distance-running, but boy,
> > the participants seem just as messed-up as semi-pro bike racers. At
> > least Ms. Quinn-Smith seems to realize she's making a mistake, but she's
> > doing it as a conscious choice.
>
> > Mama, don't let your sons grow up to be athletes,
>
> I forgot, there's another positive side to this story,
> which is that it proves the existence of at least 11
> Canadians who still have both of their feet.
>
> http://www.nationalpost.com/news/canada/story.html?id=536978
>
> Ben

Boy, those Canadian crabs are picky eaters...
-Paul

In article
<f42b4227-49a6-473d-bfae-a3f0501f75f1@m45g2000hsb.googlegroups.com>,
"joseph.santaniello@gmail.com" <joseph.santaniello@gmail.com> wrote:

> On May 26, 10:49 pm, Ryan Cousineau <rcous...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > A story in Canada's National Newspaper -- No, The Other One, talks about
> > a Brooks (running shoes)-sponsored project to create a house of marathon
> > runners.
> >
> > http://www.nationalpost.com/news/canada/story.html?id=536964
> >
> > The key quotes are pretty hilarious:
> >
> > "The train-together, win-together approach to the 42.2-kilometre test
> > was perfected by the Kenyans. For Africans, running can be a way out of
> > a poverty trap. For young Canadians with Olympic aspirations, it can be
> > a road to financial ruin.
> >
> > "The pressure of watching people the same age start careers and
> > families, and the long climb up the ladder of success, was a major
> > source of stress for Tara Quinn-Smith before she moved into the house.
> >
> > ""That other part of life is put on hold here," says Ms. Quinn-Smith,
> > who shares a basement apartment with her husband, and fellow runner,
> > Andrew. "Because it is put on hold for everyone in the house, it makes
> > it seem OK.""
> >
> > I suppose I think it's pretty cool that Brooks is sponsoring something
> > like this to help transform Canada's pathetic distance-running, but boy,
> > the participants seem just as messed-up as semi-pro bike racers. At
> > least Ms. Quinn-Smith seems to realize she's making a mistake, but she's
> > doing it as a conscious choice.
> >
> > Mama, don't let your sons grow up to be athletes,
>
> How many people make any money at all running? At least with cycling
> there are some guys on minimum wage.
>
> But I think kids should have a go at being athletes if they want, in
> any sport. Give it 10 years. If you aren't anywhere by 26, forget it.
> But there is plenty of time to go to school and have a real life
> after. The person might be more mature as well and get more out of an
> education at that point too.

By age eighteen anyone should know what his gift is. Ten
years of getting trashed by your peers is called a clue.
Another eight years is self delusion. Pack it in and go
with what you have while there is still time. It could
still be athletics. One guy was an adequate college hockey
player whose coach said "Go to law school." Guy became a
very successful general manager.

--
Michael Press

In article
<8d82dd15-f8d8-44ee-8b3e-2df515f3ef23@b9g2000prh.googlegroups.com>,
"bjw@mambo.ucolick.org" <bjw@mambo.ucolick.org> wrote:

> On May 26, 1:49 pm, Ryan Cousineau <rcous...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > A story in Canada's National Newspaper -- No, The Other One, talks about
> > a Brooks (running shoes)-sponsored project to create a house of marathon
> > runners.
> >
> > http://www.nationalpost.com/news/canada/story.html?id=536964
> >
> >
> > I suppose I think it's pretty cool that Brooks is sponsoring something
> > like this to help transform Canada's pathetic distance-running, but boy,
> > the participants seem just as messed-up as semi-pro bike racers. At
> > least Ms. Quinn-Smith seems to realize she's making a mistake, but she's
> > doing it as a conscious choice.
> >
> > Mama, don't let your sons grow up to be athletes,
>
> I forgot, there's another positive side to this story,
> which is that it proves the existence of at least 11
> Canadians who still have both of their feet.
>
> http://www.nationalpost.com/news/canada/story.html?id=536978

Another example of the decline in values. In my day any
self-respecting gangster chose concrete overshoes.
And most went with a roll of chicken wire and cinder blocks.
Feh!

--
Michael Press

On May 26, 4:19 pm, RicodJour <ricodj...@worldemail.com> wrote:
> On May 26, 5:00 pm, "joseph.santanie...@gmail.com"
>
> <joseph.santanie...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > How many people make any money at all running? At least with cycling
> > there are some guys on minimum wage.
>
> What's a typical prime prize for a runner? Shorts or a pair of
> socks?
> People should only run when they're being chased.
>
> R

A long time ago, as an idiotic Cat IV I took something like fifth
place in a USCF no name crit and won a Raleigh floor pump that didn't
work. Does that count?


"It's insane to waste four years of your life for one stab at glory."

- Tom Officer (One of my heros, because the first
ones are more important the the successful ones.)

tf

On May 26, 6:50 pm, Ryan Cousineau wrote:

> I should be of two minds about this. On one hand, my brother-in-law
> wasted most of his late teens chasing the hockey dream all the way up to
> the Austin Ice Bats. Except, erm, he is now running a very successful
> hockey school, so I guess it worked out okay.

Ahhh, better one more way, for the Ice Bats have flown. Without
stopping at the Congress Ave (by whatever name) bridge, neither.

Ice Hockey school in Austin, Texas... That's pretty smooth. --D-y

In article
<f6b64e77-411f-4f33-aac2-46e2fbcc1de5@k37g2000hsf.googlegroups.com>,
"dustoyevsky@mac.com" <dustoyevsky@mac.com> wrote:

> On May 26, 6:50 pm, Ryan Cousineau wrote:
>
> > I should be of two minds about this. On one hand, my brother-in-law
> > wasted most of his late teens chasing the hockey dream all the way up to
> > the Austin Ice Bats. Except, erm, he is now running a very successful
> > hockey school, so I guess it worked out okay.
>
> Ahhh, better one more way, for the Ice Bats have flown. Without
> stopping at the Congress Ave (by whatever name) bridge, neither.
>
> Ice Hockey school in Austin, Texas... That's pretty smooth. --D-y

No, he played in Austin. Also, Moorehead MN; Kimberly, BC; and probably
a few whistle-stops I have forgotten.

Actually, I have to correct that after looking at his online bio: he
doesn't mention all of his teams, but it says he played for the
Knoxville Speed of the UHL without mentioning the Ice Bats.

http://www.insideedgehockey.com/

The school is in Canada. He lives about three blocks from me, and drives
a nicer car.

--
Ryan Cousineau rcousine@gmail.com http://www.wiredcola.com/
"In other newsgroups, they killfile trolls."
"In rec.bicycles.racing, we coach them."