It's so good to have resources

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Just wanted to offer my greatest thanks to r.b.t., Sheldon Brown, Park
Tools, et al. After hanging around here for a while, I finally got up
the nerve and found the time to tear apart and service (clean,
inspect, grease, re-assemble and adjust) the bottom bracket on my '86
Trek 400. It needed it. The bike has got to be much, much happier
now - with a shiny clean drivetrain and everything. The only funky
noises now are one squeaky shoe/cleat (at least I think that's what it
is) and a little rattling from the old frame-mounted U-lock.

Next challenge: Truing wheels (without just making them worse).

Congratulations! With some information, curiosity and a methodical
approach there is very little you can't learn to fix on your own.

There are a few items that need tools beyond the average home mechanic,
but those are relatively rare. There are some tasks that are done
infrequently enough to make it not worthwhile to invest in the tools
(headset presses, for example) for home use.

> Next challenge: Truing wheels (without just making them worse).

Wheels are easy, if you accept that you sometimes learn the right thing to
do by doing something wrong. Which means it's always best to practice first
on an old wheel you've got lying around. Wheels are easier than you think,
but don't try to do much about "hop" (up & down areas) which, in all
likelihood, are actually deformed (dented). Spoke tension isn't likely the
cause of the dent, nor will it be a solution.

Since your bike is rather old, you might try a couple spoke nipples and see
if they turn easily and, if not, get some penetrating oil and let it soak
into the nipples for a day or two before trying again. It's possible that
they could be totally seized (in which case you either rebuild the wheel
with new spokes or just keep riding it until it's too irregular to be
useful).

--Mike Jacoubowsky
Chain Reaction Bicycles
www.ChainReaction.com
Redwood City & Los Altos, CA USA
"Dan O" <danoverman@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:b11301a6-4143-47d7-9791-836e4b436171@l28g2000prd.googlegroups.com...
>
> Just wanted to offer my greatest thanks to r.b.t., Sheldon Brown, Park
> Tools, et al. After hanging around here for a while, I finally got up
> the nerve and found the time to tear apart and service (clean,
> inspect, grease, re-assemble and adjust) the bottom bracket on my '86
> Trek 400. It needed it. The bike has got to be much, much happier
> now - with a shiny clean drivetrain and everything. The only funky
> noises now are one squeaky shoe/cleat (at least I think that's what it
> is) and a little rattling from the old frame-mounted U-lock.
>
> Next challenge: Truing wheels (without just making them worse).

On May 29, 11:48 am, Tim McNamara <tim...@bitstream.net> wrote:
> Congratulations!  With some information, curiosity and a methodical
> approach there is very little you can't learn to fix on your own.  
>
> There are a few items that need tools beyond the average home mechanic,
> but those are relatively rare.  There are some tasks that are done
> infrequently enough to make it not worthwhile to invest in the tools
> (headset presses, for example) for home use.

Tools are a great value. A Park truing stand (including shipping) is
less than the price of one night at the Mariott in Jersey City. For
the price of one night in a dive on Manhattan, you can get the Park
truing stand plus a headset press, drop-out alignment tool, dishing
tool and a star nut setter. Then you can build a bike, go on tour and
camp for cheap. -- Jay Beattie.

> Tim McNamara <tim...@bitstream.net> wrote:
>> Congratulations! With some information, curiosity and a methodical
>> approach there is very little you can't learn to fix on your own.
>> There are a few items that need tools beyond the average home mechanic,
>> but those are relatively rare. There are some tasks that are done
>> infrequently enough to make it not worthwhile to invest in the tools
>> (headset presses, for example) for home use.

Jay Beattie wrote:
> Tools are a great value. A Park truing stand (including shipping) is
> less than the price of one night at the Mariott in Jersey City. For
> the price of one night in a dive on Manhattan, you can get the Park
> truing stand plus a headset press, drop-out alignment tool, dishing
> tool and a star nut setter. Then you can build a bike, go on tour and
> camp for cheap. -- Jay Beattie.

All that is true but in another perspective, we often note that even
home basement engine builders send out valve seat grinding. I'll sew a
simple gash, but I wouldn't touch a compound fracture if I had a choice.
I'm undefeated in small claims court (pro se) but I wouldn't buy a house
without competent counsel. Draw the pain-pleasure line where you are
comfortable. At some point, an expert's time is cheap.
--
Andrew Muzi
<www.yellowjersey.org/>
Open every day since 1 April, 1971
** Posted from http://www.teranews.com **

On May 30, 10:12 am, A Muzi <a...@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
> >  Tim McNamara <tim...@bitstream.net> wrote:
> >> Congratulations!  With some information, curiosity and a methodical
> >> approach there is very little you can't learn to fix on your own.  
> >> There are a few items that need tools beyond the average home mechanic,
> >> but those are relatively rare.  There are some tasks that are done
> >> infrequently enough to make it not worthwhile to invest in the tools
> >> (headset presses, for example) for home use.
> Jay Beattie wrote:
> > Tools are a great value. A Park truing stand (including shipping) is
> > less than the price of one night at the Mariott in Jersey City.  For
> > the price of one night in a dive on Manhattan, you can get the Park
> > truing stand plus a headset press, drop-out alignment tool, dishing
> > tool and a star nut setter. Then you can build a bike, go on tour and
> > camp for cheap. -- Jay Beattie.
>
> All that is true but in another perspective, we often note that even
> home basement engine builders send out valve seat grinding. I'll sew a
> simple gash, but I wouldn't touch a compound fracture if I had a choice.
> I'm undefeated in small claims court (pro se) but I wouldn't buy a house
> without competent counsel. Draw the pain-pleasure line where you are
> comfortable. At some point, an expert's time is cheap.

Whether a person should make the purchase and learn to use the tools
is a whole other issue! I took the plunge many years ago and have
gotten many hours of enjoyable frustration from my tools. There are
still a few things that I might have done by a shop -- like facing and
cutting threads, etc.

Apart from whether to own tools or whether to do your own, exotic
repairs, I just think that tools are a great value in the grand scheme
of things. I bought my Park stand in 1979/80 for $129 or $139 (my
memory is now slipping), and you can get the same stand for about $30
more today ($161 at Colorado Cyclist). I pay $40 more for a single
decent rim than I did in 1979 -- and $60 more for a sew-up (like a
Vittoria CX/CG). And if I bought a top-end Assos jersey, I would be
paying $280 or so more ($320 for an Assos SS 13 at Colorado Cyclist --
love that Nazi designation). I could almost get two Park TS2s for the
price of one Assos SS 13. Crash in that sucker and use the rags to
wipe your tears -- tears over your financial loss and not your wounds
(Andrew could sew up the wounds, but probably not the jersey). -- Jay
Beattie.

In article <c47f7$48403548$4584@news.teranews.com>,
A Muzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:

> > Tim McNamara <tim...@bitstream.net> wrote:
> >> Congratulations! With some information, curiosity and a
> >> methodical approach there is very little you can't learn to fix on
> >> your own. There are a few items that need tools beyond the
> >> average home mechanic, but those are relatively rare. There are
> >> some tasks that are done infrequently enough to make it not
> >> worthwhile to invest in the tools (headset presses, for example)
> >> for home use.
>
> Jay Beattie wrote:
> > Tools are a great value. A Park truing stand (including shipping)
> > is less than the price of one night at the Mariott in Jersey City.
> > For the price of one night in a dive on Manhattan, you can get the
> > Park truing stand plus a headset press, drop-out alignment tool,
> > dishing tool and a star nut setter. Then you can build a bike, go
> > on tour and camp for cheap. -- Jay Beattie.
>
> All that is true but in another perspective, we often note that even
> home basement engine builders send out valve seat grinding. I'll sew
> a simple gash, but I wouldn't touch a compound fracture if I had a
> choice. I'm undefeated in small claims court (pro se) but I wouldn't
> buy a house without competent counsel. Draw the pain-pleasure line
> where you are comfortable. At some point, an expert's time is cheap.

A few years back I put in a window in my house that the previous owner
had taken out and sheetrocked over on the inside and sided over on the
outside. I worked as a glazier for seven years in high school and
college and amassed a reasonable amount of applicable skills in the
process. So I figured I could do this and, as it turned out, I could
and did. But it took a week off of work- between not having the correct
tools and having to jury rig stuff as a result, needing to learn a few
carpentry skills I didn't have, etc. not to mention the stress of having
to deal with the weather and such.

It would have, in the long run, cost less to have a journeyman do it
than it did to do it myself. Experts get it done faster and better.

On May 29, 8:40 pm, Jay Beattie <jbeat...@lindsayhart.com> wrote:
> On May 29, 11:48 am, Tim McNamara <tim...@bitstream.net> wrote:
>
> > Congratulations! With some information, curiosity and a methodical
> > approach there is very little you can't learn to fix on your own.
>

I had completely torn apart my Dept Store "stingray" as a young kid in
the '70s, and thereby figured out the basic concepts of cup and cone
bearings, etc.

> > There are a few items that need tools beyond the average home mechanic,
> > but those are relatively rare. There are some tasks that are done
> > infrequently enough to make it not worthwhile to invest in the tools
> > (headset presses, for example) for home use.
>
> Tools are a great value.

One of (my) life's most inarguable core truths.

> A Park truing stand (including shipping) is
> less than the price of one night at the Mariott in Jersey City.

I was incredibly lucky. I answered a CL ad for a touring bike (which
was already sold), but the guy had a really, really nice Park
workstand (which I needed). When I bought the workstand he threw in a
wheel truing stand (again, a really, really nice one), a big box of
parts, and a big bucket of tools - set me up really, really good.

> For
> the price of one night in a dive on Manhattan, you can get the Park
> truing stand plus a headset press, drop-out alignment tool, dishing
> tool and a star nut setter. Then you can build a bike, go on tour and
> camp for cheap. -- Jay Beattie.

I don't live anywhere like Manhattan, but I often justify my
investments with the rationale that "I could be spending it on much
worse things" ;-)

On May 30, 10:12 am, A Muzi <a...@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
> > Tim McNamara <tim...@bitstream.net> wrote:
> >> Congratulations! With some information, curiosity and a methodical
> >> approach there is very little you can't learn to fix on your own.
> >> There are a few items that need tools beyond the average home mechanic,
> >> but those are relatively rare. There are some tasks that are done
> >> infrequently enough to make it not worthwhile to invest in the tools
> >> (headset presses, for example) for home use.
> Jay Beattie wrote:
> > Tools are a great value. A Park truing stand (including shipping) is
> > less than the price of one night at the Mariott in Jersey City. For
> > the price of one night in a dive on Manhattan, you can get the Park
> > truing stand plus a headset press, drop-out alignment tool, dishing
> > tool and a star nut setter. Then you can build a bike, go on tour and
> > camp for cheap. -- Jay Beattie.
>
> All that is true but in another perspective, we often note that even
> home basement engine builders send out valve seat grinding. I'll sew a
> simple gash, but I wouldn't touch a compound fracture if I had a choice.
> I'm undefeated in small claims court (pro se) but I wouldn't buy a house
> without competent counsel. Draw the pain-pleasure line where you are
> comfortable. At some point, an expert's time is cheap.

Agreed - another of life's truths. I love and respect the experienced
masters immensely, but the professional can only spend so much time on
*my* bike, whereas I can diddle with it myself forever (not
necessarily a good thing, I know, but there we have it).

(I'm undefeated in out-of-court formal arbitration, BTW - also pro-
se :-)

On May 30, 10:12 am, A Muzi <a...@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
> > Tim McNamara <tim...@bitstream.net> wrote:
> >> Congratulations! With some information, curiosity and a methodical
> >> approach there is very little you can't learn to fix on your own.
> >> There are a few items that need tools beyond the average home mechanic,
> >> but those are relatively rare. There are some tasks that are done
> >> infrequently enough to make it not worthwhile to invest in the tools
> >> (headset presses, for example) for home use.
> Jay Beattie wrote:
> > Tools are a great value. A Park truing stand (including shipping) is
> > less than the price of one night at the Mariott in Jersey City. For
> > the price of one night in a dive on Manhattan, you can get the Park
> > truing stand plus a headset press, drop-out alignment tool, dishing
> > tool and a star nut setter. Then you can build a bike, go on tour and
> > camp for cheap. -- Jay Beattie.
>
> All that is true but in another perspective, we often note that even
> home basement engine builders send out valve seat grinding. I'll sew a
> simple gash, but I wouldn't touch a compound fracture if I had a choice.
> I'm undefeated in small claims court (pro se) but I wouldn't buy a house
> without competent counsel. Draw the pain-pleasure line where you are
> comfortable. At some point, an expert's time is cheap.

I should have added that the expert's time is absolutely one of those
resources referenced in the subject line that are *so* good to have.

On May 29, 12:17 pm, "Mike Jacoubowsky" <Mi...@ChainReaction.com>
wrote:
> > Next challenge: Truing wheels (without just making them worse).
>
> Wheels are easy, if you accept that you sometimes learn the right thing to
> do by doing something wrong. Which means it's always best to practice first
> on an old wheel you've got lying around.

That's what I'll do. These old wheels on my Trek are amazingly
straight and strong after twenty-two years or so. I don't want to
mess them up.

> Wheels are easier than you think,
> but don't try to do much about "hop" (up & down areas) which, in all
> likelihood, are actually deformed (dented). Spoke tension isn't likely the
> cause of the dent, nor will it be a solution.
>

This advice may have saved me a lot of grief. One of the issues I was
hoping to address was a little "hop" in the front wheel. In thinking
about it I had wondered how adjusting spokes was going to fix that.
It's mostly only noticeable on very fast downhills anyway, and even
then not too terribly bad.

> Since your bike is rather old, you might try a couple spoke nipples and see
> if they turn easily and, if not, get some penetrating oil and let it soak
> into the nipples for a day or two before trying again. It's possible that
> they could be totally seized (in which case you either rebuild the wheel
> with new spokes or just keep riding it until it's too irregular to be
> useful).
>

Yeah, there's rust on the rim eyelets. (Things aren't especially
shiny around there.) I imagine the nipples aren't going to like being
cranked on.

This is exactly the kind of help I was talking about. Have no doubt
that you would not lose any of my business as a result of "helping me
learn to fish". I generally couldn't/wouldn't pay a mechanic to do it
anyway. I'd either just let it go to heck, or screw it up trying -
and lose enthusiasm for cycling either way. I would, however,
heartily recommend a mechanic that I trust and respect to anyone who
could/would employ their capable services.



> --Mike Jacoubowsky
> Chain Reaction Bicycleswww.ChainReaction.com
> Redwood City & Los Altos, CA USA"Dan O" <danover...@gmail.com> wrote in message
>
> news:b11301a6-4143-47d7-9791-836e4b436171@l28g2000prd.googlegroups.com...
>
>
>
> > Just wanted to offer my greatest thanks to r.b.t., Sheldon Brown, Park
> > Tools, et al. After hanging around here for a while, I finally got up
> > the nerve and found the time to tear apart and service (clean,
> > inspect, grease, re-assemble and adjust) the bottom bracket on my '86
> > Trek 400. It needed it. The bike has got to be much, much happier
> > now - with a shiny clean drivetrain and everything. The only funky
> > noises now are one squeaky shoe/cleat (at least I think that's what it
> > is) and a little rattling from the old frame-mounted U-lock.
>
> > Next challenge: Truing wheels (without just making them worse).