swollen fingers

[Brian Jones]

Hey folks;

On Saturday I ran my last long run (24 miles) before my first Marathon (Twin Cities, MN, USA,
October 5). The last few long runs went pretty well, though slower than my hoped-for marathon pace.

I noticed that on the 2nd half of my Saturday run, my hands swelled up. My fingers were tight and my
wedding ring was really stuck. This condition remained for a few hours after the run. Today I went
out on the bike for 30 minutes and the same thing happened.

Any ideas about what is going on?

Brian Jones

[Sats]

On Tue, 16 Sep 2003 14:01:33 GMT, "Brian Jones" <firstpres@turtlecreek.net> wrote:

>Hey folks;
>
>On Saturday I ran my last long run (24 miles) before my first Marathon (Twin Cities, MN, USA,
>October 5). The last few long runs went pretty well, though slower than my hoped-for marathon pace.
>
>I noticed that on the 2nd half of my Saturday run, my hands swelled up. My fingers were tight and
>my wedding ring was really stuck. This condition remained for a few hours after the run. Today I
>went out on the bike for 30 minutes and the same thing happened.
>
>Any ideas about what is going on?
>
>Brian Jones
>

Heart valve leakage. You'll be dead in a few hours.

[Arthur Gary]

In article <1JE9b.36$ck.822@bcandid.telisphere.com>, Brian Jones <firstpres@turtlecreek.net> wrote:
>Hey folks;
>
>On Saturday I ran my last long run (24 miles) before my first Marathon (Twin Cities, MN, USA,
>October 5). The last few long runs went pretty well, though slower than my hoped-for marathon pace.
>
>I noticed that on the 2nd half of my Saturday run, my hands swelled up. My fingers were tight and
>my wedding ring was really stuck. This condition remained for a few hours after the run. Today I
>went out on the bike for 30 minutes and the same thing happened.
>
>Any ideas about what is going on?
>
>Brian Jones
>

I ran a mountain race last month. The first 5 miles was straight up, going from 5,000 to 7,000 feet.
I felt okay but as I got to the summit, I clenched my hands in a little private celebration and
noticed that they were swollen.

I've never experienced this before, and I haven't since, and the swelling was gone by the time I
reached the bottom of the mountain 6 miles later.

I've been wondering what that was all about.

Art

[Ozzie Gontang]

[[ This message was both posted and mailed: see the "To," "Cc," and "Newsgroups" headers for
details. ]]

In article <1JE9b.36$ck.822@bcandid.telisphere.com>, Brian Jones <firstpres@turtlecreek.net> wrote:

> Hey folks;
>
> On Saturday I ran my last long run (24 miles) before my first Marathon (Twin Cities, MN,
> USA, October 5). The last few long runs went pretty well, though slower than my hoped-for
> marathon pace.
>
> I noticed that on the 2nd half of my Saturday run, my hands swelled up. My fingers were tight and
> my wedding ring was really stuck. This condition remained for a few hours after the run. Today I
> went out on the bike for 30 minutes and the same thing happened.
>
> Any ideas about what is going on?
>
> Brian Jones

Brian,

Here's a post from about 3 years ago.

Ozzie

+++++++++++++++Original Post++++++++++++++++++ Neuro,

As usual, rec.running pieces together "what's so"...better know as reality. It all adds up to a
great collection of folklore: "This is what works for me, or this is my understanding of.... If it
works for you, use it. If not don't give it the time of day, but find someone who makes better sense
and use their folklore. Or find what works for you and create your own folklore." No matter how you
look at it, it's just a story.

Ozzie

From: neuronix@home.com (Neuro) Newsgroups: rec.running Subject: Swollen fingers on long run! Date:
Tue, 08 Aug 2000 17:53:28 GMT

Yesterday I completed a gruelling long run up a local mountain that included a 4000 ft elevation
gain over the first 5 miles. I noticed at one point that my fingers were really swollen... something
I have not experienced before.

Is this a symptom of fluid retention or dehydration? Or is it nothing worth worrying about? Any info
appreciated!

From: rick++ <rickotto@my-deja.com>

Its called "peripheral edema" in mountain hiking. I asked a high altitude doctor about that last
year because I now get that somtimes during high hikes, and he said it was common. Since I'm started
getting it after 20-some years of running and high altitude hiking, I assume it is just another
symptom of aging.

From: The Trailrunner <TheTrailhead*BS*@yahoo.com>

It is certainly not "normal", in that the vast majority of ultra runners (or other's that I'm aware
of) do not "normally" have swelling of the extremities. In most cases of those that do, it is the
result of water retention caused by drinking without salt replacement and can usually be remedied by
talking salt or specialized sodium capsules every hour or so. If this does not help and the problem
persists, I would recommend you get checked for circulation problems by your MD as it could be an
indication of a more serious problem such as diabetes.

From: mpc82@aol.com (Mike Conway)

I have noticed the "swollen fingers" thing while on hikes, but not while running. My own admittedly
non-medical opinion is that it has to do with blood pooling in the hands, as opposed to what happens
while running...While hiking, my hands typically rest at my sides, while running they have a bit
more motion to them, hence no swelling. Make sense? Mike C

Swollen Hands: A Handful of Folklore and a Bit of Science
c. 2000 Austin "Ozzie" Gontang, Ph.D.

Folklore, i.e.-A different way of explaining an issue based on one's perception and description of
that perception.

Premise: Something during or prior(short term/long term) to your running is causing your
hand to swell.

Assumptions: Some kind of situational stress. (Short term: something during the actual run; Long
term: anything prior to the run) e.g.Life situation which is bothering you; you have started an
upper body lifting regimen; efforting with clenched fists; you were dehydrated before starting your
run; you were running with discomfort (May read "I had this pain, but I ran through it."). Something
caused the swelling.

General Question: If your hands are swelling, from where does the fluid build up come?

If my hands swelled I would have edema. Edema, which means "swelling" in Greek, is defined as "an
abnormal excess accumulation of serous fluid in connective tissue or a serous cavity." Serous means
"resembling serum." Serum, which comes the Greek meaning 'whey,' is the watery portions of an animal
fluid remaining after coagulation. (Serum albumin: a crystallizable albumin or mixture of albumins
that normally constitutes more than half of the protein in blood serum and serves to maintain the
osmotic pressure of the blood).

The osmotic pressure of the blood against the vein wall must be equal so the fluid does not leak.
The pressure depends on the molar concentration and absolute temperature of the fluid. The vein
walls can leak. This leakage is caused by the particles of liquids, gasses or solids mixing together
as a result of their spontaneous movement caused by thermal agitation (violent moving) and then
flowing from place of higher concentration to a place of lower concentration. If my hands swelled,
this may be what happened.

Finally the word "whey" for the Greeks meant "the watery part(serum) of milk that is separated from
the coagulable part or curd, especially in the process of making cheese and that (the whey) is rich
in lactose, minerals, and vitamins and contains lactalbumin and traces of fat.

Now what is happening to the swelling hands? Could be some kind of imbalance in the blood. Could be
that glasping the fists a little tighter than usual (for whatever reason) is restricting the venous
return, [i.e. the tighter muscles up the forearm restrict the blood, which is now O2 poor and CO2
rich, from its normal smooth flow]. So the blood is having trouble and is backing up causing some
pressure since it cannot freely flow back to the heart/lung machine.

If there is an unbalance in the serous fluid, or a stricture so that the blood containing serous
fluid starts to leak through the venous wall or some other explanation, then one's hands will swell.

There are several runners out there who are anxious to hear what you found out about what it is/was
that was causing the swelling. Keep us "Posted."

[Bill]

> I ran a mountain race last month. The first 5 miles was straight up,
going
> from 5,000 to 7,000 feet. I felt okay but as I got to the summit, I
clenched
> my hands in a little private celebration and noticed that they were
swollen.
>
> I've never experienced this before, and I haven't since, and the swelling was gone by the time I
> reached the bottom of the mountain 6 miles later.
>
> I've been wondering what that was all about.
>
> Art

Other threads have given the following reasons:

altitude change electrolyte loss, low sodium clenching hands, holding hands low in a swinging action

[Tim Downie]

"Brian Jones" <firstpres@turtlecreek.net> wrote in message
news:1JE9b.36$ck.822@bcandid.telisphere.com...
> Hey folks;
>
> On Saturday I ran my last long run (24 miles) before my first Marathon
(Twin
> Cities, MN, USA, October 5). The last few long runs went pretty well, though slower than my
> hoped-for marathon pace.
>
> I noticed that on the 2nd half of my Saturday run, my hands swelled up.
My
> fingers were tight and my wedding ring was really stuck. This condition remained for a few hours
> after the run. Today I went out on the bike for
30
> minutes and the same thing happened.
>
> Any ideas about what is going on?

I've certainly had this when hill walking but not running. Were you by any chance wearing a backpack
on both ocassions? Anything that restricts the venous return of blood from your arms may aggravate
swelling. Perhaps have a think about what postion you hold your hands in when you run. Do you run
with your hands nearer waist height than chest height?

I personally wouldn't worry about it unless the swelling doesn't resolve quickly or it causes you
significant discomfort.

Tim

[James]

Lads, Were you wearing a rucksack or bag as this can inhibit the circulation, i have noticed this
myself, as soon as the shoulder straps were lifted the swelling reduced. Regards James

[Doug Freese]

Ozzie Gontang wrote:
> From: The Trailrunner <TheTrailhead*BS*@yahoo.com>
>
> It is certainly not "normal", in that the vast majority of ultra runners (or other's that I'm
> aware of) do not "normally" have swelling of the extremities. In most cases of those that do, it
> is the result of water retention caused by drinking without salt replacement and can usually be
> remedied by talking salt or specialized sodium capsules every hour or so. If this does not help
> and the problem persists, I would recommend you get checked for circulation problems by your MD as
> it could be an indication of a more serious problem such as diabetes.

This can be either low salt or too much salt. You did not say what you did drink but I'd guess you
did not have sufficient electrolytes(salt). If you did not replenish you eletro's overnight I would
expect a continuation. Having said that, as Trailrunner says above, watch this carefully in case
something is medically malfunctioning.

I ran with a friend at Laurel Highland that took to many caps and experienced this swelling and had
to back down to recover.

--
Doug Freese dfreeseNOBS@hvc.rr.com