Drivers want road test for cyclists (Observer article)

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David Cowie

http://observer.guardian.co.uk/uk_news/story/0,6903,1125629,00.html

My response

<rant>

1) You'll notice all the 'Useful links' at the bottom of the report are to motoring organisations
and the Special Reports are for Cars, Transport, Oil and Petrol. Now that should indicate the
objectiveness of the article.

2) The title 'Drivers want road test for cyclist' should read 'Motoring Organisations wishing to
promote themselves are calling for road tests for cyclists'

3) The lycra louts referred to are kids who ride on the pavement in black clothes with no lights
(at night). They have no right to be there and 95% of fellow cyclists and 100% of pedestrians
despise them.

4) There is no 'unprecedented campaign' just the usual press articles 'we love cars, we hate
cyclists'.

5) The demand is for stiffer penalties (above the usual). Note we also suffer from lack of
enforcement of penalties. Even the RAC agrees on this.

6) The MP, Eric Martlew represents Carlisle but is looking to solve a London problem. Carlisle is
about 800km from London. His argument is against lack of enforcement. Something he's been
elected to solve !

7) I agree about cyclists not stopping at red lights. My estimates are 50% don't (similar to RAC
findings). Whether you do or don't is a function of how long you have been riding or how many
accidents you've had.

8) A Private members bills (amendments to legislation) (to force young members to where helmets or
face fines) can be raised by a single MP. Bills that survive the 'suggestion phase' then
progress to the Committee Stage. In 2001-02, 8 out of 114 bills were successful.

9) Andrew Howard says 'There is an element of lawlessness among pedal cyclists and they sometimes
need reminding that there are people more vulnerable than them on the roads.' Perhaps the focus
should be on the number of lawless car users.

10) The main bugbear is the increased cost of insurance to organisations from the new proposed
European legislation.

</rant

Jamie G

W K

"David Cowie" <newsgroups@spamhere.com> wrote in message
news:pjbr00hknsotsd1pa73lj3aensfi5rh5dc@4ax.com...
> http://observer.guardian.co.uk/uk_news/story/0,6903,1125629,00.html

> 2) The title 'Drivers want road test for cyclist' should read 'Motoring Organisations wishing to
> promote themselves are calling for road tests for cyclists'

No they don't. The journalist asked a few questions, and they did not say anything of the sort.

Ambrose Nankive

In news:pjbr00hknsotsd1pa73lj3aensfi5rh5dc@4ax.com,
David Cowie <newsgroups@spamhere.com> typed:
> http://observer.guardian.co.uk/uk_news/story/0,6903,1125629,00.html
>
> My response
> 6) The MP, Eric Martlew represents Carlisle but is looking to solve a London problem. Carlisle is
> about 800km from London. His argument is against lack of enforcement. Something he's been
> elected to solve !

about 500km, actually. Aberdeen is about 800km from London.

A

Mseries

David Cowie wrote:
> http://observer.guardian.co.uk/uk_news/story/0,6903,1125629,00.html
>
> My response
>
> <rant>
>
> 1) You'll notice all the 'Useful links' at the bottom of the report are to motoring organisations
> and the Special Reports are for Cars, Transport, Oil and Petrol. Now that should indicate the
> objectiveness of the article.
>
> 2) The title 'Drivers want road test for cyclist' should read 'Motoring Organisations wishing to
> promote themselves are calling for road tests for cyclists'
>
> 3) The lycra louts referred to are kids who ride on the pavement in black clothes with no lights
> (at night). They have no right to be there and 95% of fellow cyclists and 100% of pedestrians
> despise them.
>
> 4) There is no 'unprecedented campaign' just the usual press articles 'we love cars, we hate
> cyclists'.
>
> 5) The demand is for stiffer penalties (above the usual). Note we also suffer from lack of
> enforcement of penalties. Even the RAC agrees on this.
>
> 6) The MP, Eric Martlew represents Carlisle but is looking to solve a London problem. Carlisle is
> about 800km from London. His argument is against lack of enforcement. Something he's been
> elected to solve !
>
> 7) I agree about cyclists not stopping at red lights. My estimates are 50% don't (similar to RAC
> findings). Whether you do or don't is a function of how long you have been riding or how many
> accidents you've had.
>
> 8) A Private members bills (amendments to legislation) (to force young members to where helmets
> or face fines) can be raised by a single MP. Bills that survive the 'suggestion phase' then
> progress to the Committee Stage. In 2001-02, 8 out of 114 bills were successful.
>
> 9) Andrew Howard says 'There is an element of lawlessness among pedal cyclists and they sometimes
> need reminding that there are people more vulnerable than them on the roads.' Perhaps the
> focus should be on the number of lawless car users.
>
> 10) The main bugbear is the increased cost of insurance to organisations from the new proposed
> European legislation.
>
> </rant>

The article is a load of tosh IMHO, I am adriver and cyclist, I am a motorist and cyclist and I
don't want a test for cyclists, I would like all cyclists to be law abiding ones, a test would not
make that happen just like a magical driving licence does not make all the lights on my car stay
illuminated or my speed to remain within legal limits. My own regard for the law and safety does.
The fear of getting caught and nicked will deter offenders not test. Failing or not taking a cycling
test will not deter anyone who wants to ride a bike. Whichever motorists want a road test for
cyclists are living in cloud cuckoo land. But I guess we all know this already.

martin

--
The Reply & From email addresses are checked rarely. http://www.mseries.freeserve.co.uk (http://www.mseries.freeserve.co.uk/)

Dave Kahn

David Cowie <newsgroups@spamhere.com> wrote in message news:<pjbr00hknsotsd1pa73lj3aensfi5rh5dc@4ax.com>...

> 5) The demand is for stiffer penalties (above the usual). Note we also suffer from lack of
> enforcement of penalties. Even the RAC agrees on this.

All that's required is enforcement of existing laws on pavement cycling, traffic lights, and cycle
lighting at night. While they're about it, it would be nice if they would start fining motorists who
use the cycle lanes.

> 6) The MP, Eric Martlew represents Carlisle but is looking to solve a London problem. Carlisle is
> about 800km from London. His argument is against lack of enforcement. Something he's been
> elected to solve !

Suddenly Eric Martlew is an authority on cycling because of his private member's bill. If enacted
the bill would destroy any faint remaining hope of reaching the government's target for cycling, at
the same time dealing a serious blow to public health just when obsesity in the young is becoming a
serious issue.

--
Dave...

Dave Kahn

"Ambrose Nankivell" <$FirstnameInitialofSurname$@onetel.net.uk> wrote in message news:<bukie1$j2s17$6@ID-93953.news.uni-berlin.de>...
> In news:pjbr00hknsotsd1pa73lj3aensfi5rh5dc@4ax.com, David Cowie <newsgroups@spamhere.com> typed:
> > http://observer.guardian.co.uk/uk_news/story/0,6903,1125629,00.html Carlisle is about 800km from
> > London. His argument is against lack of enforcement. Something he's been elected to solve !
>
> about 500km, actually. Aberdeen is about 800km from London.

Cut David some slack. He's only a colonial. :-)

--
Dave...

Anonymous

David Cowie posted ...

> http://observer.guardian.co.uk/uk_news/story/0,6903,1125629,00.html
>
> My response
>
> <rant>

I guess you'd find similar, biased towards cycling rather than cars, articles in the cycling
press too .. ;)

--
Paul

Paulmouk

"David Cowie" <newsgroups@spamhere.com> wrote in message
news:pjbr00hknsotsd1pa73lj3aensfi5rh5dc@4ax.com...
> http://observer.guardian.co.uk/uk_news/story/0,6903,1125629,00.html
>
> My response
>
> <rant>
>
> 1) You'll notice all the 'Useful links' at the bottom of the report are to motoring organisations
> and the Special Reports are for Cars, Transport, Oil and Petrol. Now that should indicate the
> objectiveness of the article.
>
> 2) The title 'Drivers want road test for cyclist' should read 'Motoring Organisations wishing to
> promote themselves are calling for road tests for cyclists'
>
> 3) The lycra louts referred to are kids who ride on the pavement in black clothes with no lights
> (at night). They have no right to be there and 95% of fellow cyclists and 100% of pedestrians
> despise them.
>
> 4) There is no 'unprecedented campaign' just the usual press articles 'we love cars, we hate
> cyclists'.
>
> 5) The demand is for stiffer penalties (above the usual). Note we also suffer from lack of
> enforcement of penalties. Even the RAC agrees on this.
>
> 6) The MP, Eric Martlew represents Carlisle but is looking to solve a London problem. Carlisle is
> about 800km from London. His argument is against lack of enforcement. Something he's been
> elected to solve !
>
> 7) I agree about cyclists not stopping at red lights. My estimates are 50% don't (similar to RAC
> findings). Whether you do or don't is a function of how long you have been riding or how many
> accidents you've had.
>
> 8) A Private members bills (amendments to legislation) (to force young members to where helmets
> or face fines) can be raised by a single MP. Bills that survive the 'suggestion phase' then
> progress to the Committee Stage. In 2001-02, 8 out of 114 bills were successful.
>
> 9) Andrew Howard says 'There is an element of lawlessness among pedal cyclists and they sometimes
> need reminding that there are people more vulnerable than them on the roads.' Perhaps the
> focus should be on the number of lawless car users.
>
> 10) The main bugbear is the increased cost of insurance to organisations from the new proposed
> European legislation.

Most adult cyclists have passed a driving test and are car owners. Paul

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