Sodium Phosphate - Page 5

danielwilgocki · #61 08-19.-2004

Anyone know which particular foods contain high amounts of Sodium Phosphate?

duro · #62 10-16.-2004

Hi all.

having loaded with SP how long do the improved performance effects last?

is it a case of load for the 4 days up to race day and when the 'effort' is over then youre back to scratch or is there a carry over period?

Duro

**steve** · #63 10-17.-2004

Quote:

Originally Posted by VeloFlash

You may also check with the NSW Institute of Sport

http://www.nswis.com.au/Online/splash.asp

A year or so ago, their sports scientists were calling for volunteers amongst competitive cyclists to participate in the testing of sodium phosphate.

Hi

I wasn't able to find a link to the study results, do you know if its even published on the website or not?

cheers

ric_stern/RST · #64 10-17.-2004

Quote:

Originally Posted by steve

Hi

I wasn't able to find a link to the study results, do you know if its even published on the website or not?

cheers

we have an abstract in canadian journal of applied physiology, and the full article is under review for another journal. i'm not sure about the NSW study though.

ric

ric_stern/RST · #65 10-17.-2004

Quote:

Originally Posted by duro

Hi all.

having loaded with SP how long do the improved performance effects last?

is it a case of load for the 4 days up to race day and when the 'effort' is over then youre back to scratch or is there a carry over period?

Duro

it takes some period of time for the effect to wear off. in the research most studies use a 14-day washout period, and some have suggested that the effects gradually wear off over a ~ 5 day period.

ric

VeloFlash · #66 10-19.-2004

Quote:

Originally Posted by steve

Hi

I wasn't able to find a link to the study results, do you know if its even published on the website or not?

cheers

I can recall that through the Cycling NSW website 'news', the NSWIS were calling for cycling volunteers to participate in sodium phosphate testing.

I have not heard anything since. You may check with NSWIS if the study was undertaken and if the results are available.

Roadie_scum · #67 10-20.-2004

Quote:

Originally Posted by ric_stern/RST

we have an abstract in canadian journal of applied physiology, and the full article is under review for another journal. i'm not sure about the NSW study though.

ric

Ric, is acute hypocalciaemia a concern with Phosphate use?

ric_stern/RST · #68 10-20.-2004

Quote:

Originally Posted by Roadie_scum

Ric, is acute hypocalciaemia a concern with Phosphate use?

Possibly. No one has tested that per se, and the actual data available on phosphate loading in general is limited. Current recommendations are that phosphate loading should be limited to four times per year spread out evenly. When i was doing my thesis on phosphate loading, the thoughts were to either load maximally four times per year, or that continual use of phosphate would just cause it to be excreted.

i'd certainly err on the side of caution and limit it to four times per year, and not use it, if for e.g., you're osteoporotic.

additionally, it's worth noting that if you consume large amounts of (e.g.) cola you may be subjecting yourself to leaching from the bones in a similar manner.

i can't currently think of any [legal] supplements that don't have _some_ health risks associated with them.

Ric

Roadie_scum · #69 10-20.-2004

Quote:

Originally Posted by ric_stern/RST

Possibly. No one has tested that per se, and the actual data available on phosphate loading in general is limited. Current recommendations are that phosphate loading should be limited to four times per year spread out evenly. When i was doing my thesis on phosphate loading, the thoughts were to either load maximally four times per year, or that continual use of phosphate would just cause it to be excreted.

i'd certainly err on the side of caution and limit it to four times per year, and not use it, if for e.g., you're osteoporotic.

additionally, it's worth noting that if you consume large amounts of (e.g.) cola you may be subjecting yourself to leaching from the bones in a similar manner.

i can't currently think of any [legal] supplements that don't have _some_ health risks associated with them.

Ric

Cheers, that's about what I thought the situation would be. I take it none of the participants in your study exhibited the classic twitchiness associated with acute calcium deficit or other noticeable signs, and you don't know of this being reported with acute phosphate loading for ergogenic effect? I couldn't find any suggestion that this had occured in other trials.

ric_stern/RST · #70 10-20.-2004

Quote:

Originally Posted by Roadie_scum

Cheers, that's about what I thought the situation would be. I take it none of the participants in your study exhibited the classic twitchiness associated with acute calcium deficit or other noticeable signs, and you don't know of this being reported with acute phosphate loading for ergogenic effect? I couldn't find any suggestion that this had occured in other trials.

no one reported any adverse side effects, other than when we first started the trial some people suffered severe GI distress, which was resolved by 'dissolving' the phosphate in ~500 mL of (e.g.) orange squash (cordial??) rather than swallowing the capsule with a drink.

ric

Azrael · #71 10-20.-2004

Does anyone have more information on Baking Soda("sodium bicarbonate" if I reckon correctly) and it's effects? You can get that stuff in the supermarket I suppose....

ric_stern/RST · #72 10-20.-2004

Quote:

Originally Posted by Azrael

Does anyone have more information on Baking Soda("sodium bicarbonate" if I reckon correctly) and it's effects? You can get that stuff in the supermarket I suppose....

for the purpose of clarification, bicarbonate loading and sodium phosphate loading work by completely different mechanisms (although the mechanisms behind phosphate loading have yet to be fully elucidated).

bicarbonate loading tends to work for only very short events (say up to 10-mins). you need a very large dose of bicarbonate (0.3 g/kg body mass, e.g., a 70 kg person would require 21 g). as i understand it, about 50% of subjects in studies looking at bicarb loading suffer *severe* GI distress. To put it gently, if you decide on trying bicarb loading make sure you stay close to a toilet in case you're one of the 50% who suffers from "distress".

ric

Azrael · #73 10-20.-2004

Quote:

Originally Posted by ric_stern/RST

for the purpose of clarification, bicarbonate loading and sodium phosphate loading work by completely different mechanisms (although the mechanisms behind phosphate loading have yet to be fully elucidated).

bicarbonate loading tends to work for only very short events (say up to 10-mins). you need a very large dose of bicarbonate (0.3 g/kg body mass, e.g., a 70 kg person would require 21 g). as i understand it, about 50% of subjects in studies looking at bicarb loading suffer *severe* GI distress. To put it gently, if you decide on trying bicarb loading make sure you stay close to a toilet in case you're one of the 50% who suffers from "distress".

ric

Thanks you for explaining. Must admit I had a laugh from your last phrase...

ric_stern/RST · #74 10-20.-2004

Quote:

Originally Posted by Azrael

Thanks you for explaining. Must admit I had a laugh from your last phrase...

you may not be laughing if you try it!

Azrael · #75 10-20.-2004

Quote:

Originally Posted by ric_stern/RST

you may not be laughing if you try it!

Huuuuuuampppahammmmmmm

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