knee problems...bad ones!

man...alot of you guys have been racing longer than me, so i gotta serious question...my knee hurts, lol...both of em actually....a couple weeks ago i started getting tired and my knees started hurting, which culminated in my knees hurting so bad in a time trial two weeks ago to the day that i pulled myself outta the time trial...i took a week and a half off, and felt pretty good, but obviously was sluggish the first time back on...did the time trial again today and my knees are now hurting worse than the first time....what u think? more time off? i know i had overtrained, but thought a week and a half would be long enough off the bike...

tehpr3chr,

The best advise to give is to go see your doctor. You could have simply pulled the muscles or ligaments or worse, but he/she is the best to make the diagnosis and recommend the best course of action.

You are probably going to have to go through a period of building back up to 100% riding capability.

-GN

OK before you go see your doctor:
1. what pedals are you using?
make sure you have enough float in whatever system you are using. If no float available, borrow a friend's pedals that HAS float, from his spare bike, and their cleats too. Try that.
2. Big gears...don't push big gears
do you have cadence on your computer? If so, make sure you don't drop below 90...and if you want to do the Ullrich Shuffle (grinding) while training, to develop power, ONLY do that twice per week, and don't do it too much either, for only a few minutes at a time.
Your knees are pretty damned important...
"overtraining" is not really a valid word. Injuries are more attributable to too much of one type of training. If you mix it up you reduce the chance of injuries.

__________________
"...too old to be riding a bike..." my former workmates used to say. Screw them. I don't judge people for their lack of interest in exercise. So don't judge me.

1.i had speedplays, with tons of float, when this problem started....i just got new look keo carbons...
2.i'm 6'2" so i do tend to mash the pedals
thanks for the advice guys...i guess it's time to go to the doctor and then get a coach...

MSM it's a sulfur supplement

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Romans 5:10 For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life. http://www.earnharts.com/html/realau...cific.asp?id=3

i actually picked up some glucosimine sulfate over the weekend...i plan on taking 14 days off the bike, and will take this supplement twice a day for the 14 days...sound about right?

Glucosimine "sulfate" is a good choice sulfur helps make cartilage just don't take to much because glucosimine can put a load on your kidneys. I try to find the optimum amount of MSM instead by mixing it with applesauce and having a little on toast everyday. To much causes conjunctivitis right eye only and/or gun powder like flatulence Eggs are a good source of sulfur if you don't mind the fat. Some other things that helped me.

Hyaluronic acid = water holding molecule
Horsetail = silica supplement

__________________
Romans 5:10 For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life. http://www.earnharts.com/html/realau...cific.asp?id=3

Just out of curiosity, what do you mean by conjunctivitis? The parent compound of MSM is DMSO and this was thought to cause problems with the lens of the eye, but ultimately wasn't found in human studies.

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"if at first you don't succeed, redefine success"

Sulfur is antagonist to copper and if copper gets low right sided inflamation of the eye can occur. Vitamin C in mega doses is a more common cause it is also an antagonist to copper.

This is where I got this from the only other source I can find is my own experience with supplements.

http://www.acu-cell.com/dis.html

http://www.acu-cell.com/crcu.html

http://www.acu-cell.com/ses.html

Conjunctivitis (irritated / inflamed eyes): High/low Vitamin A, low Vit B2, low copper (right side),
low chromium (left side), low magnesium, low calcium, high iron, high manganese, high Vit C.

__________________
Romans 5:10 For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life. http://www.earnharts.com/html/realau...cific.asp?id=3

that's funny, cause my right eye has been irritated a bit lately...what should i take for that?

It could be a matter of not taking something too does your multi have a mega dose of vitamin C? Or do you tend to eat a certain food or drink daily that may cause this. Every one has food or drink daily habits that are unique so I can't answer that but that is something I would look at. I would never supplement copper it is just a trace mineral that comes from some popular foods just don't over do it on antagonists to copper.

__________________
Romans 5:10 For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life. http://www.earnharts.com/html/realau...cific.asp?id=3

honestly i've changed up my eating a little bit (for the worse), and i'm taking 14 days off right now, on day 4(going crazy now)...eye has stopped itching, lol...i may have just gotten to the point of draining my body of everything since i was riding so much...i'm big on subway tho as far as eating goes...i eat tuna, tuscan chicken, and turkey subs like they're going outta business! i eat a lot of mexican too(1-2 times weekly)...i know its bad, but man it's so good...i'll cut the good food out when i'm a cat2, lol...for now i'm fine....

FWIW- I recovered from a knee injury (simple inflammation) and my sports doc told me that the MSM/Glucosamine supps take at least 6 weeks to have any effect. Hate to say it, but rest is probably the best option unless you're close to an MRI machine to get a peek in the joint.

Knee problems are indicative of strength imbalance issues between the hamstrings and quads. This causes excess force in the joint so the knee basically doesn't track straight. Simple test is when you walk do your feet point toes out? This indicates a weakness in your hamstring/adductor muscles and that is your problem. Balanced musculature will lead to a lifetime of pain free cycling regardless of your position over the bottom bracket or your cadence. Till you balance this out try to set your cleats up to match the way you walk. If you can't then drop to spinning for short distances and focus on spending your time strengthening your adductors/hamstrings till your feet point straight when walking.

Update- knee pain came back/comes back intermittently...finally got a good dianosis from a 24 yr old PT...he pressed on the IT band on the outboard side of my leg about 3" up from the knee and OUCH!

Turned out my IT band (long tendon/small muscle connecting the knee to the hip, I believe) was tight and created a lateral tension on the kneecap. Whenever I forget to stretch it, it reminds me by creating more PAIN in the kneecap.