Post ride glycogen replacement and weight loss… - Page 3

I wasn't arguing, just requesting cites which you have yet to provide.

Funny, I was thinking the same thing.

Clay T

Innermusic: Your statement that "liver glycogen has nothing to do with exercise capacity" surprised me, so I looked up a quick reference. Would appreciate your comments (if you haven't already left the building).

Extracted from "Glycogen Replenishment after Exhaustive Exercise", G. Tardie, PhD, The Sports Journal, Vol I, No. 1, (Summer 1998):

"Therefore, the concentration of muscle and liver glycogen prior to exercise plays an important role in endurance exercise capacity. In exhaustive exercise many studies have observed significant depletion of both liver and muscle glycogen. It is interesting to recognize that the point of exhaustion seems to occur upon the depletion of liver glycogen. Conversely, muscle glycogen reserves, though significantly lower are only 65-85% depleted, versus the 85-95% depletion exhibited for liver glycogen. This should make it readily apparent that liver glycogen is an integral determining factor in an athlete's time to exhaustion. It follows that endurance athletes who maintain a daily regimen of endurance training without glycogen repletion may severely deplete their glycogen reserves.

Glycogen, the major reservoir of carbohydrate in the body is comprised of long chain polymers of glucose molecules. The body stores approximately 450-550 grams of glycogen within the muscle and liver for use during exercise. "

Paper can be read at: http://www.thesportjournal.org/1998J...1/glycogen.asp

Interesting quote. Actually, liver glycogen is in fact the last to go when depletion is fulfilled in a CHO deprived regime. But the fact that these folks link the absence of material liver glycogen with exhaustion is an oversimplification. It would mean that those of us who have maintained a ketogenic state for days or weeks would have become exhausted, as this is yet another method of depletion. But on the contrary, most folks report high energy levels and good if not optimal strength while in ketosis. So a depletion of liver glycogen can but does not have to mean exhaution or even fatigue. What does occur is a drop in blood sugar, but once again this does not necessarily mean fatigue.

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Steve Holt
The Vegetarian Bodybuilder
www.vegetarianbodybuilder.com

you're obviously signing off because 1) you know ****, 2) you obviously dropped a barbell on your head, and 3) i'm doubting you've ever ridden a bike in a manner that the majority of others on this board have done.

if you think you can ride a bike doing proper training in a state of ketosis, then i'm guessing that your brain has been catabolised.

Good bye
Ric

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Liver releases glycogen into the bloodstream (at a rate not exceeding 1g/minute). Hypoglycaemia is a major cause of exhaustion in endurance exercise. The exhaustion of liver glycogen and the rate of release are both material in exercise performance.

Apologies. Was past my bedtime and I was thinking matodextrin rather than dextrose (which is better for a couple of theoretical reasons admittedly).

So had mine when I confused dextrose and maltodextrin at 11pm...

Ric, you never fail to make me smile.

well, there's never anything wrong with making mistakes, being confused, not knowing an answer or asking anything. but repeatedly talking rubbish is just a waste of the forums bandwidth, hence my decision to terminate the said rubbish and make you smile.

having said that i do prefer it, when my says i make her smile!

ric

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umm, as the guy who started this little conversation, can I bring it back to application? Should I drink a Gatoraid type drink after a hard (occasionally maximal) 1hr ride? Am I better to drink Gatoraid during such a ride or after? Will grilled chicken do after work out, or is it better to have liquid protien?

In the end I'm looking to time caloric depletion around working out, to enable me to a) keep working out hard and delay onset of "overtaining" and b) be sure I'm not loosing muscle mass when I do loose weight.


I really appreciate the passion and concern people have on this board: clearly people care about other roadies, and that is great.

Fabio

Especially in the case of caloric deficit it's important to make sure you get enough CHO. This enhances capacity for exercise and reduces the risk of illness. Focus on eating calorie sparse, nutrient dense foods like fruit and vegetables when you aren't exercising to ensure micronutrient sufficiency and make sure you get enough in the way of bread, pasta, other grains, etc. Post-exercise some glycaemic CHO (like gatorade - although I believe powerade is more glycaemic) is a good idea. There is almost certainly no need to have liquid protein post-exercise, as the amount of protein you need with your CHO post workout meal is relatively small ~10-20g.

if you think you can ride a bike doing proper training in a state of ketosis, then i'm guessing that your brain has been catabolised.

Good bye
Ric[/QUOTE]


LMFAO!!!

Nice knowing you too Ric.
You'll go far with that attitude.

__________________
Steve Holt
The Vegetarian Bodybuilder
www.vegetarianbodybuilder.com

if you repeatedly write rubbish, it's just a waste of bandwidth and everyone's time.

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http://www.cyclecoach.com

What is your experience with endurance exercise? What about cycling specifically?

Have you ridden a 40km TT in a ketonic state? Or even just ridden a 40km TT?

Have you ever bonked (become hypoglycaemic due to failure to intake sufficient CHO)?

Or, if not personal experience, do you nonetheless have specific education or skills that pertain to endurance exercise or cycling in particular?

Cant you read the signs dude?!? You dont know what the h3ll you're talking (or writing) about! If you haven't done, or for this matter, ride a bike in the state our posters have asked you, then STOP. You're obviously claiming something you dont know anything about. You should be ashamed of yourself. Just lift a barbell and go look in the mirror and tell yourself: "I am such a crap, all I know is sh1t!!!"

Fabio, did you see my earlier post? As much as I would have loved to jump into this foray, there is no need for me to come to the boss man's rescue, so I tried to slip in a post that was a bit more relavent to your request. Brief recap:
To maximize your exercise, you need to fuel up (carbs) shortly before, during and immediatley after exercise. How much really depends on how hard and how long you intend to exercise; but regardless, follow that pattern always. A 1hr ride is short enough that something like Gatorade is fine for during the workout, but does not nearly have enough carbs for after your workout. A longer ride will demand more carbs/hr than Gatorade can provide as well. Any other time of the day is when you want to cut calories. Don't waste your money on to many fancy products; yes, they work well and are very convenient if you are away from home or short on time (for example), but the cost is high and they are technically not necessary. Remember that energy availability is key to a strong workout and quick recovery...and carbs are the primary source of energy, even at very moderate levels of exercise (and especially during shorter workouts). So get those carbs in before, during and after training (high glycemic carbs are best during and after training; check online for lists, they are redily available - liquied does not equal high glycemic). The rest of the time, eat healthy, eat small meals, eat vegetables, eat fruits, eat fiber, drink water.....you'll do fine.

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Smartty