2009 TDF stage 18: Annecy - Annecy 40.5 km - Page 2

Originally Posted by nonns

Have you ever ridden the Tour?
Have you ever become a Tour champion having suffered from a near temrinal illness experience?
Have you ever started a cancer charity?
Have you got the wit/nouse charisma etc. to pull together sufficient people to support you?

What a foul record LA has. Truly disgusting. I for one would kill to have such a CV. Blimey a grand champion and an all round good guy.

If he was such a terrible person people would steer clear. Enough people seem to wish to associate with him that whilst I can see that he might be a tiresome big mouth he's probably not all bad and by golly he can put up a fight.

What's he done that probably most of the pack hasn't other than won 7 times. Taken drugs? OK so every day we find yet another so called innocent being proved to have taken them in spite of claiming otherwise.

I fully support the guy. At least he's doing something worth while. For sheer entertainment he's good value and he's showing balls (err ball) in adversity also.

Whilst I'm certian that a lot of the stuff is hype enough of it is good that frankly I think he's to be lauded.

Why do you have such an epic chip on your shoulder about him? SOB is very strong. Has he hurt you?

Originally Posted by nonns

Have you ever ridden the Tour?
Have you ever become a Tour champion having suffered from a near temrinal illness experience?
Have you ever started a cancer charity?
Have you got the wit/nouse charisma etc. to pull together sufficient people to support you?

What a foul record LA has. Truly disgusting. I for one would kill to have such a CV. Blimey a grand champion and an all round good guy.

If he was such a terrible person people would steer clear. Enough people seem to wish to associate with him that whilst I can see that he might be a tiresome big mouth he's probably not all bad and by golly he can put up a fight.

What's he done that probably most of the pack hasn't other than won 7 times. Taken drugs? OK so every day we find yet another so called innocent being proved to have taken them in spite of claiming otherwise.

I fully support the guy. At least he's doing something worth while. For sheer entertainment he's good value and he's showing balls (err ball) in adversity also.

Whilst I'm certian that a lot of the stuff is hype enough of it is good that frankly I think he's to be lauded.

Why do you have such an epic chip on your shoulder about him? SOB is very strong. Has he hurt you?

Originally Posted by Grater

You need to wake up and smell the roses. The facts are there!

Ullrich, Riis, Zabel etc never tested positive but they admitted to it.

yes with their backs against the wall an no further options they admitted to it. This doesn't make them heroes or honourable. When cornered likes rats in a trap they admitted it. Ulrich fought against it. Zabel wasn't graceful, Kohl admitted to it and said he wasn't going to give his jersey back as he knows how hard he worked for it.Kohl also did something particularly nasty to all of his colleagues in the pro peloton by saying something that more or less tarred them with the guilty brush regardless. A really snide and ****ty thing to do. Hey I'm going down but I'll take everyone with me.

Ricco was tested 13 times last year and only 2 showed he was positive when all 13 should have.

You can dope and not be caught. That's a given.
Yep so lets assume they're all doping and have done with it. At every interview the questions should be do you think with a different cocktail of drugs you may have been able to go slightly faster. Don't talk about the racing. Just suggest that they could have all done better with a different drugs cocktail.

Armstrong is not doing anything worthwhile. He has a lot of followers that worship him.

People typically follow people who they feel they can admire. If one digs one's head out of the sad for two minutes one should ask oneself why so many decide to follow LA. I mean ok so he's good at publicity but he can't pull the wool over everyones eyes.

Not worthwhile. Really he started a charity which is doing big things. You might not like the guy but it is doing those things and creating hope for many. Even if he uses it for photo oppos if the side effect is it helps others that for one is something i think he deserves.

He is getting "Blood Money" for his charity.
Hahahahahahahahahahahaha even by LA hating standards this caused me to laugh. Blood money - you're having a laugh. That must have been tongue in cheek. With people saying stuff like this no wonder dopers end up with a defence.

He is parading around like he never has done anything wrong and cashing in on it for charity. That is a sign of a loser. Someone who loses at life. Lance is that person. He's a horrible person doing what he is doing.

I don't think it is a sign of a loser. Most big ego's have done lots wrong. They all parade around and cash in on it. As for making them losers this sounds like the jealousy of the have's for the have nots. These rich performing losers are running the world you and I live in and they all influence far more than we do. Get real. Calling them names just makes you a bitter person who refuses to grow up and stare reality in the face. That Lance may not be a saint is probably true. I'm not sure that he has ever claimed to be. I'm not even sure if he's actually said he doesn't take drugs.. He has made oblique references about feeling sorry for people who can't believe in dreams.

The sooner he gets caught, the better.
If he's doping now then yes I do hope so along with all the other dopers. That he shoudl be singled out - no.

How can you beat guys that were doped up clean? It's impossible! There's plenty of circumstantial evidence against him.

1. From 1999 - 2005 look at the tour podiums. Everyone that finished on the podium cheated, expect Lance? Come on!

So he cheated. He levelled the playing field and he was better than the other cheats.

2. His 1999 samples tested positive. Why won't he get them re-tested? He is guilty! That's why. Contamination yeah right. That's an excuse.

And why wont the cycling authorities call for them to be retested against LA's best wishes. It appears that the authorities are not sufficently sure of their case to want to risk things. That alone is cause for exoneration.

3. His former team-mates have admitted using EPO. Even if he rode clean he still had his team-mates helping him on EPO - that is cheating also.

Yes if LA specifically was responsible for them riding on EPO or if he had knowledge of it. Trouble is has anyone yet been convicted on this basis? Why wont the cycling authorities over rule him and strip him of his palmares. Why is LA the only cheat who has got positives who they're refusing to pursue. There's enough out there who hate him. Finally why wont the cyclign authorities get their sh*t together sufficiently to agree on a way forward? They're more hypociritcal than the riders. They know its happenign and they can't even work out things between themselves in nice comfortbale air conditioned office becase they're all trying to stick it to each other.

There are many many reasons why this guy is a cheat! Those are 3 of them. I'm sure people can list another 15.

Originally Posted by nonns

I owuld disagree with that. If the whole world has chosen what is seen to be a dark path in one time and you realise that you haven't gone that route but decide you have to join then by definition all thats happened is the basis for competition has changed. If everyone cheats then noone is a cheat. If you then win whilst competing under the new basis then you are a great person once again.

.

Originally Posted by nonns

The only reasons why this guy is a cheat are those samples. If they can be reopened and retested and found to convict him then he will be proved to be a cheat for the period to whch those samples applied otherwise sadly it doens't matter what you think LA is innocent in the eyes of the sport and the law unlike Mr Ullrich and many others.

The biggest question that has to be asked is why can't cycling get its act together at the adminsitrative level?
If the tests are so fool proof then why did they feel unabel to pursue LA?
If we assuem that LA was doping when everyone else who finsiehd on the podium was doping then why was LA not damned with the rest of them.

If you suggest that he's got everyone in his pocket then perhaps the guy has got something more special than the rest. The point being whichever way you cut it he still ends up a winner.

ban news eh?

Try showing me the riders who don't dope. Not the ones you like but the ones you can guarantee who haven't doped. Accroding to Kohl there aren't any!

Ho hum.

Originally Posted by bananabrain

or gets disqualified, as other recent riders have been after such ludicrous displays of (apparent) brilliance. How surprised must Cancellara have been? Still, maybe we should extend young Alberto a wide margin of benefit of doubt, what with him being such an endearing lovely chap and all. Maybe next year he'll be going for green too.
The degree of politcally correct, worried neutrality and reticence among cycling commentators continues to surprise me. We had the same when Landis sprinted alone up to Morzine after almost dropping out with exhaustion the day before. Then again with Rasmussen - a man who hitherto had looked as if he was still learning how to ride a bike - oh so convincingly burning up the metal a couple of years ago.

Personally I despise these people (the riders, not the commentators), but feel free to argue the case for our new mighty conqueror.

Originally Posted by beloki

they all take something. Thats the only way you finish this race. Lance is the biggest cheater of all ( I hate the way he acts like Bonds "I never took anything" yeah right you cant tell me you can blow away Beloki,Ulrich,Basso,Kloden and they all took soemthing.


Lance is the biggest two face SOB I have ever seen