Contador - I Will Never Admire Armstrong - Page 12

Everybody was injuried or suspended when Roche won all three. A good cyclist from his era, but not in the Armstrong league. He is an example of how you can win all three and not be an all time great in the true sense of the word.

Well like I saud, I think it's one of Armstrong's main regrets that he didn't try to win those other grand tours. That's why he made the Giro his first big comeback race (though he was not on form due to injury). But I don't see why he's a hosebag because of the decision to focus on the hardest and most prestigious grand tour. To say that is a bit silly - what's wrong with wanting to be recognised for your achievements in your own country?

These days nobody really tries to win the ToF and another grand tour in the same year. They may go for the Giro and the Vuelta because they are further apart, but not the ToF and one of those. That just shows you how hard modern cycling is. The sport has moved on. I saw Roche interviewed about it and he agreed that today it would be a much harder feet.

Nice try.

You do realise that you're quoting a blog?
Gaea Times (by Simple Thoughts) Breaking News and incisive views 24/7

And the IMF?
Very credible.

And the issue you tried to defend yesterday concerned sponsorship and the ToI.
You alleged we were in recession here and that sponsors do not invest in a recession and that the recession here caused the ToI to be shortened by 40%

Why then was the Volvo Yacht Race sponsored over here in May 2009, if we're in a recession as you and there are no sponsors in this recession-racked country, eh?
Or why would the FIA stage the opening round of the World Championships here last February 2009, if there are no sponsors and we're all in a recession and the IMF is knocking at the door, eh?
Kinda contradicts your blog/IMF waffle, right?

I mean in a recession, there are no sponsors after all?
Thats what you said yesterday, right?

Or maybe, just maybe, commerical companies see a better return sponsoring other sports and other sporting personalities?
Now there's a thought.

back to cycling indeed.
No Giro on TV ???
We got full coverage of the GIRO, daily, here in Europe.
No Vuelta on TV???
We got full coverage of the Vuelta, daily, here in Europe too.

We will get coverage of the ToI - even in it's reduced format.


I suggest you pen a letter to Eurosport and ask them why they have retained Kelly's serves on their International Channel for commentary on all three Grand Tours and all the major one days races, for the past nine years.
Seems to work for Eurosport and their many cycling viewers.

None of which should concern you since you "got no Giro and will not get the Vuelta on the TV", anyhow.
Is that Lancastrian verbige, per chance?
Or do you normally try to communicate that way?

__________________
.."But finally the last thing I’ll say to the people who don’t believe in cycling, the cynics and the sceptics. I'm sorry for you. I’m sorry that you can’t dream big. [I]I'm sorry you don't believe in miracles. You should believe in these athletes, and you should believe in these people. I'll be a fan of the Tour de France for as long as I live. And there are no secrets - this is a hard sporting event and hard work wins it" - Armstrong 2005 TDF
morelike hypocrisy.

[quote=limerickman;3900117]Are you off your nut? What is a more credible source than the IMF on national economic growth rates? To say something so silly brings into question the rest of what you say.

Why? These two events were before the recession hit its depths. There are still sponsors for the tour of Ireland, likely only due to the appearance of Cav and Armstrong, but it's been massively cut back because Ireland is experiencing the biggest recession in the developed world. What is hard to understand about this?

No, these things are cut back and companies are forced to prioritize.

Now you're starting to get it. They have to only go to sports which they have a history with and feel they can get more bang for their buck.

Everbody?

The facts contadict you I'm afraid.
After winning 1987 Giro, Roche won the 1987 Tour de France ahead of riders like Pedro Delgado (GT winner Tour de France and Vuelta), Laurent Fignon (Tour de France x2 winner), Andy Hampsten (TdS winner), Robert Millar, Claude Criquillion, Carly Mottet.
Hinault had retired in 1986.
The only other major rider not present at Tour de France 1987 was LeMond.


The only one making spurious claims is you!


Again who here made any claims about Roche?

He wasn't good enough to win both races in the one season.
He bottled it, to borrow your phrase.



Indurain tried it three times - but only managed to succeed in winning the Giro/Tour de France double twice.
Pantani did it once.




Modern cycling must be really tough - a rider can only try to win one grand tour and refuse to race all other grand tours, eh?

That Contador guy must be something else?
Imagine being able to race and win three different grand tours?
After all modern cycling's so tough.......and all.
Who have thought it.

__________________
.."But finally the last thing I’ll say to the people who don’t believe in cycling, the cynics and the sceptics. I'm sorry for you. I’m sorry that you can’t dream big. [I]I'm sorry you don't believe in miracles. You should believe in these athletes, and you should believe in these people. I'll be a fan of the Tour de France for as long as I live. And there are no secrets - this is a hard sporting event and hard work wins it" - Armstrong 2005 TDF
morelike hypocrisy.

Quoting data from a BLOG is questionable.

You should take this up with swimpy.



You do know that Global Financial Crisis, started in August 2007.

Two years ago.




Global Financial Crisis, started in August 2007.

ToI in 2008, was staged for 5 days, which Cav and the Schleck brothers raced.

Your man announced his decision to race the 2009 ToI in January 2009.

ToI organisers announced 5 stage race for 2009 ToI, in February 2009.

Two world class sporting events, staged in Ireland, in February 2009 and May 2009, attract lots of significant commerical sponsorship.

In May 2009, ToI announce that the 2009 race has been reduced by 40%.

Why wasn't the Volvo Yacht Race in May 2009 not shortened by 40%?
Why was the RIA World rally championship in Feb 2009 not shortened by 40%?



Why wasn't the Volvo Yacht Race in May 2009 not shortened by 40%?
Why was the RIA World rally championship in Feb 2009 not shortened by 40%?


But the ToI has a history in this country.
The Volvo Yacht Race doesn't have a history here.
Nor does the RIA World Championships have a history here.

If sponsors only got to sports that they have a history with and feel that they can get more bang for their buck (your words), why abandon the event with a history in this country?

__________________
.."But finally the last thing I’ll say to the people who don’t believe in cycling, the cynics and the sceptics. I'm sorry for you. I’m sorry that you can’t dream big. [I]I'm sorry you don't believe in miracles. You should believe in these athletes, and you should believe in these people. I'll be a fan of the Tour de France for as long as I live. And there are no secrets - this is a hard sporting event and hard work wins it" - Armstrong 2005 TDF
morelike hypocrisy.

[quote]
I was exaggerating for effect. But he never went up against the great rider of his era. He was a doper too.

That's a very bold claim. He prefered to focus on the hardest one, but it's hard to argue it was beyond him, given his unprecidented dominance in the ToF.

Yes, but did they win seven ToF in a row? As I said, it would be even harder to do that these days, given how the ToF has been taken to a new level in the last ten years - thanks to Armstrong.

No lots of them ride more than one tour - they rarely try to win the ToF and another grand Tour. Maybe the only rider with that intention in recent years was Armstrong at the beginning of this year.

No, you are incorrent. Contador has never tried to win all three Tours in the same year. The year that he won both he only took part because his team was banned from the ToF. It remains to be seen how much he will focus on winning the other grand tours in the coming years.

[quote=limerickman;3900126].

Don't be dishonest. I quoted your remarks on the IMF and not the blog. You clearly questioned the IMF as a credible source. You must be nuts to think they are not credible on these matters. It shows you are not interested in the truth and are just on some bizarre mind bending excersize to try to blame Lance Armstrong for the global recession. Crazy stuff.

That was the stock market crash. It was then followed by the property crash, then the real economy crash that hit companies. It wasn't until this year that the full extent of it had been felt in Europe, and particularly Ireland.

These events were held before we knew that Ireland had the worst recession in the developed world - worse than just in Europe - but it may well be that advertising revenue and sponsorship was down for these events as well. I'm sure you're intelligent enough to know that not all sporting events have to be reduced in size in precisely the same way because of sponsorship issues.

However, companies will cut their loses by abandoning some events and keeping a few others. That's how it works.

Every single article that I've read about the ToI being shortened blames the recession and not Lance Armstrong. Indeed, I very much suspect the ToI would have been cancelled if Armstrong had not agreed to it. I don't know why you are being so silly about it; it only reflects badly on yourself.

I questioned the use of a blog.


You've got the chronology wrong again.

Property crashed first.
Pensions then collapsed in July/August 2007
Banking crisis happened in August 2007.
Then the stock market fell, and then the real economy became affected.


The chronology of the global financial crisis shows that the economic crisis, worldwide, started in July/August 2007.
Or are you suggesting that AIG, BNP, Northern Rock, UBS, were all spoofing in 2007 when they went bellyup?

And both of the events I cited have been staged here, significantly after the onset of the global financial crisis which started in July/August 2007.

It is curious that two major sporting events held in this country in the past 5 months had no reduction in terms of sposnorship - given your claims about the plight of this economy
and the so-called economic crisis.


To quote you, companies sponsor events which they have a history with and which they feel will give them bang for the buck.
Your words.

In this case the Volve Yacht race and WC Rally prove the point.



Who here contended that the blame lies with your man?

You claimed that he attracts attention when he races.

He cannot attract sponsors.
Even when there is plenty of sponsorship for sporting events, available ie. yacht race and rally championships.


The ToI was staged before your man was invited to participate.
And I am confident that the ToI will continue to be raced long after your man has quit.




This reminds me of the diatribe/rubbish posted by Colorado Rider.
Syntax is very similar.
Content is equally as weak.

__________________
.."But finally the last thing I’ll say to the people who don’t believe in cycling, the cynics and the sceptics. I'm sorry for you. I’m sorry that you can’t dream big. [I]I'm sorry you don't believe in miracles. You should believe in these athletes, and you should believe in these people. I'll be a fan of the Tour de France for as long as I live. And there are no secrets - this is a hard sporting event and hard work wins it" - Armstrong 2005 TDF
morelike hypocrisy.

C'mon Armstrong fanatics! Give it up. Especially my American compatriots. Just got back to the States from the Tour and I swear there are less Americans here than were in France; and all of them pulling for old Lance. I actually received verbal abuse from Americans in a bar for having the audacity for pulling for Andy Schleck. What the hell is wrong with everyone? Get a life!

P.S.

Some say that Contador isn't a team player because he dominated the hell out of everyone, including his team mates? Isn't that what you're supposed to do to win a Grand Tour? I don't remember Lance doing anyone any favors. He and Bruyneel didn't seem too worried that Contador was caught out behind the break and losing time at the beginning of the Tour. What kind of "team" strategy was that?

This is getting a bit silly. You're just repeating the same points over and over.

I will just say you are wrong on the chronology of the recession - it started with the stock market before in moved into the real economy - and you did question the IMF as well as the blog. It's there in black and white.

It's what people tend to do when they are talking to peole that CAN'T FOR THE LIFE OF THEM GET IT. In the vague hope that they will, eventually, understand.
Alas, Lim might have been talking/writing to a brick wall...

nice. insulting all the brick walls like that. this type of wallism is sure to lead to no good. and from what i've heard, brick walls have a leg up on cinder block walls.

__________________
"Kick over the statues and the tyrants die. Wave bye bye to their heroes with a hammer."
--The Redskins, Kick Over the Statues

I think wall of all types can take heart at such empathy. I believe contador admires walls.