Old Bike On Ebay With Seatstay Shiftlevers?

I noticed this bike on Ebay and it looks like it has the shift levers are mounted on the seatstay.
Has anyone seen this set-up before? Would this be operated with the feet or by hand?

<http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=7298&item=3636262171>

Note: I have nothing to do with this auction.

5 Nov 2003 11:34:19 -0800, <27bc6c79.0311051134.4ea65a0e@posting.google.com>, bicycle@charter.net
(R.White) wrote:

>I noticed this bike on Ebay and it looks like it has the shift levers are mounted on the seatstay.
>Has anyone seen this set-up before? Would this be operated with the feet or by hand?

Hand operated. http://www.rydjor.com/bikecollection/1948bottech.htm

"Two levers run up the right side seat stay. One is to loosen the wheel in the dropout and the other
to do the shifting. The dropout is notched to mesh with the axle which also has nothches on each
end. The wheel will move forward or back to accomodate the shift from one rear cog to the next. Very
tricky move to perform, especially in race conditions. "
--
zk

Zoot Katz <zootkatz@operamail.com> wrote in message news:<3fb0568c.7039421@news.individual.net>...
> 5 Nov 2003 11:34:19 -0800, <27bc6c79.0311051134.4ea65a0e@posting.google.com>, bicycle@charter.net
> (R.White) wrote:
>
> >I noticed this bike on Ebay and it looks like it has the shift levers are mounted on the
> >seatstay. Has anyone seen this set-up before? Would this be operated with the feet or by hand?
>
> Hand operated. http://www.rydjor.com/bikecollection/1948bottech.htm
>
> "Two levers run up the right side seat stay. One is to loosen the wheel in the dropout and the
> other to do the shifting. The dropout is notched to mesh with the axle which also has nothches on
> each end. The wheel will move forward or back to accomodate the shift from one rear cog to the
> next. Very tricky move to perform, especially in race conditions. "

Thanks. I hadn't even thought of the chain slack that would result with each shift and how it would
be taken up/down. Now I have to ask "why"? I searched and found this:

"The first, easy-to-use derailleur was invented in France in 1910 by Paul de Vivie and shifted among
four gears at the pedals. The first modern rear derailleur was patented two years later by a
Frenchman named Joanny Panel, according to David Herlihy, a bicycle historian."

I'm assuming these early derailleurs compensated for chain length the way derailleurs of today do.
Moving the axle in the dropout seems like an answer to a problem that was already taken care of, no?

In article <27bc6c79.0311051459.73ad7784@posting.google.com>, bicycle@charter.net (R.White) writes:

> I'm assuming these early derailleurs compensated for chain length the way derailleurs of today
> do. Moving the axle in the dropout seems like an answer to a problem that was already taken
> care of, no?

From the description provided by Zoot (about the bike with the seatstay-mounted levers), it sounds
to me like the cogset moves inward-&-outward while the chain remains in the same chainline. But I'm
just guessing, and surmising it was an overly-engineered attempt to avoid the extreme chainlines
inherent with derailers. Especially if the bike has multiple chainwheels and/or widely- spaced
cogwheels.

cheers, Tom

--
-- Powered by FreeBSD Above address is just a spam midden. I'm really at: tkeats [curlicue] vcn
[point] bc [point] ca

R.White wrote:

>I noticed this bike on Ebay and it looks like it has the shift levers are mounted on the seatstay.
>Has anyone seen this set-up before? Would this be operated with the feet or by hand?
>
><http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=7298&item=3636262171>
>
>Note: I have nothing to do with this auction.
>
Wow! Looks like a short journey from "doing ok" to "shift lever in the spokes". It may be a valued
antique, but I would like somethin more up to date. Bernie

On Wed, 05 Nov 2003 16:48:55 +0000, Tom Keats wrote:

> In article <27bc6c79.0311051459.73ad7784@posting.google.com>, bicycle@charter.net
> (R.White) writes:
>
>> I'm assuming these early derailleurs compensated for chain length the way derailleurs of today
>> do. Moving the axle in the dropout seems like an answer to a problem that was already taken care
>> of, no?
>
> From the description provided by Zoot (about the bike with the seatstay-mounted levers), it sounds
> to me like the cogset moves inward-&-outward while the chain remains in the same chainline. But
> I'm just guessing, and surmising it was an overly-engineered attempt to avoid the extreme
> chainlines inherent with derailers. Especially if the bike has multiple chainwheels and/or widely-
> spaced cogwheels.

No. The chain moved from sprocket to sprocket after loosening the quick release, by a mechanism
somewhat like a modern front derailleur. There is only one chainring.

There were other derailleur systems in existence before this appeared, but racers did not trust
them. They thought they would be too inefficient. Since this, once you got the wheel back where it
belonged, was more like the fixed gear or single-speed freewheels that they were familiar with, it
had more acceptance among racers.

There is a great Campagnolo history on www.campyonly.com that has an explanation of this as well as
many other tidbits.

BTW, this bike would seem to be a real collector's item.

--

David L. Johnson

__o | This is my religion. There is no need for temples; no need for _`\(,_ | complicated
philosophy. Our own brain, our own heart is our (_)/ (_) | temple. The philosophy is kindness.
--The Dalai Lama

Bernie <bmcilvan@mouse-potato.com> wrote in message news:<3FA9BFAB.1070105@mouse-potato.com>...
> R.White wrote:
>
> >I noticed this bike on Ebay and it looks like it has the shift levers are mounted on the
> >seatstay. Has anyone seen this set-up before? Would this be operated with the feet or by hand?
> >
> ><http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=7298&item=3636262171>
> >
> >Note: I have nothing to do with this auction.
> >
> Wow! Looks like a short journey from "doing ok" to "shift lever in the spokes". It may be a valued
> antique, but I would like somethin more up to date. Bernie

The perfected version, Campy's Paris-Roubiax system only needed 1 lever, it works quite well, takes
about 50 yards for me to make a shift. And for weight weenies it does weigh less. If it was good
enough for Fausto, it is good enough for me. Plus it is a gas to ride.

I figure a Seven set up for brazed on center pulls and a P-R mech would be the bomb.

Scott Goldsmith