Shoe wear

I have been running with Brooks Addiction for about a year. I have flat feet and they seem to have
been the best shoes for me to do a long run. I used them for my last 13.1 mile run in a half ironman
recently. However, it seems that after only about 2 months of about 15-20 miles a week the outside
rear of my shoes show alot of wear.

When should I consider buying new or changing shoes. It seems like that is just a few miles to have
that much wear. I am 5-10 175. or does anyone have a suggestion for another motion control show that
may wear better. OR is there anything I can to do to limit the seemingly isolated wear on the
outside rears of the shoe.

Any suggestions would be appreciated.

Thanks

Matt P.

On 3 Oct 2003 08:15:36 -0700, aaronpeel@aol.com (Matt Peeler) wrote:

>I have been running with Brooks Addiction for about a year. I have flat feet and they seem to have
>been the best shoes for me to do a long run. I used them for my last 13.1 mile run in a half
>ironman recently. However, it seems that after only about 2 months of about 15-20 miles a week the
>outside rear of my shoes show alot of wear.
>
>When should I consider buying new or changing shoes. It seems like that is just a few miles to have
>that much wear. I am 5-10 175. or does anyone have a suggestion for another motion control show
>that may wear better. OR is there anything I can to do to limit the seemingly isolated wear on the
>outside rears of the shoe.
>
>Any suggestions would be appreciated.
>

Defeniately try the Asics 2080. I liked the feel of Brooks, but found they wore out prematurely too.
Asics has the AHAR heel plug in just the right spot for us type of heel strikers/draggers.

Matt,

I don't have a specific shoe recommendation for you, but do have an observation. I've found that
when I train for a marathon, I tend to get less mileage out of my shoes no matter what I wear. This
is strictly based on wear of the outside heals of the shoes. I've attributed it to the fact that on
my longer runs, my form probably deteriorates as I get tired and I'm probably scuffing/dragging my
heals more than if I have a steady diet of shorter (10 miles or less) runs.

Just my observation. Your mileage may vary.

Dave

"Matt Peeler" <aaronpeel@aol.com> wrote in message
news:4893fade.0310030715.171194a6@posting.google.com...
> I have been running with Brooks Addiction for about a year. I have flat feet and they seem to have
> been the best shoes for me to do a long run. I used them for my last 13.1 mile run in a half
> ironman recently. However, it seems that after only about 2 months of about 15-20 miles a week the
> outside rear of my shoes show alot of wear.
>
> When should I consider buying new or changing shoes. It seems like that is just a few miles to
> have that much wear. I am 5-10 175. or does anyone have a suggestion for another motion control
> show that may wear better. OR is there anything I can to do to limit the seemingly isolated wear
> on the outside rears of the shoe.
>
> Any suggestions would be appreciated.
>
>
> Thanks
>
> Matt P.

Matt, I have dealt with the same problems for 30 years. I have flat feet and always wear out the
outside edges of the heels. I could wear completely though the outer sole in less than 100 miles
with some shoes. I have tried many different brands but the wear pattern is still the same.

I have had some success adding material to this wear spot. I used to use "Shoe Gue" which arguably
was made for that purpose. It would peal off during the first or second run. I currently use a hot
glue gun and deposit the glue itself on the heal and use that as the wear material.

In all honesty it doesn't last that long. Good applications last 4 runs where poor ones last only a
run or two. This strategy seems to work better on newer shoes, ~5 runs. If you let the outer sole
wear to much I think it flexes more and the glue peals off easier. It doesn't stick to new shiny
soles too well and I don't like to change the profile of the sole too much either.

A glue gun costs about $10 and a pack of 24 sticks about $6 more. That lasts me about 1.5 years or
about 1500 miles.

Best of Luck,

Steve W.

aaronpeel@aol.com (Matt Peeler) wrote in message
news:<4893fade.0310030715.171194a6@posting.google.com>...
> I have been running with Brooks Addiction for about a year. I have flat feet and they seem to have
> been the best shoes for me to do a long run. I used them for my last 13.1 mile run in a half
> ironman recently. However, it seems that after only about 2 months of about 15-20 miles a week the
> outside rear of my shoes show alot of wear.
>
> When should I consider buying new or changing shoes. It seems like that is just a few miles to
> have that much wear. I am 5-10 175. or does anyone have a suggestion for another motion control
> show that may wear better. OR is there anything I can to do to limit the seemingly isolated wear
> on the outside rears of the shoe.
>
> Any suggestions would be appreciated.
>
>
> Thanks
>
> Matt P.

As long as you're confessing to the world of your flat footedness, why not clear the air about your
inability to satisfy your partners romantically, too?

Have you tried asics with the Ahar plug? Much more effective, and easier too. I had the same
problems until I got plugged...

On 3 Oct 2003 18:03:34 -0700, wicklands@comcast.net (Steve W.) wrote:

>Matt, I have dealt with the same problems for 30 years. I have flat feet and always wear out the
>outside edges of the heels. I could wear completely though the outer sole in less than 100 miles
>with some shoes. I have tried many different brands but the wear pattern is still the same.
>
>I have had some success adding material to this wear spot. I used to use "Shoe Gue" which arguably
>was made for that purpose. It would peal off during the first or second run. I currently use a hot
>glue gun and deposit the glue itself on the heal and use that as the wear material.
>
>In all honesty it doesn't last that long. Good applications last 4 runs where poor ones last only a
>run or two. This strategy seems to work better on newer shoes, ~5 runs. If you let the outer sole
>wear to much I think it flexes more and the glue peals off easier. It doesn't stick to new shiny
>soles too well and I don't like to change the profile of the sole too much either.
>
>A glue gun costs about $10 and a pack of 24 sticks about $6 more. That lasts me about 1.5 years or
>about 1500 miles.
>
>Best of Luck,
>
>Steve W.
>
>aaronpeel@aol.com (Matt Peeler) wrote in message
>news:<4893fade.0310030715.171194a6@posting.google.com>...
>> I have been running with Brooks Addiction for about a year. I have flat feet and they seem to
>> have been the best shoes for me to do a long run. I used them for my last 13.1 mile run in a half
>> ironman recently. However, it seems that after only about 2 months of about 15-20 miles a week
>> the outside rear of my shoes show alot of wear.
>>
>> When should I consider buying new or changing shoes. It seems like that is just a few miles to
>> have that much wear. I am 5-10 175. or does anyone have a suggestion for another motion control
>> show that may wear better. OR is there anything I can to do to limit the seemingly isolated wear
>> on the outside rears of the shoe.
>>
>> Any suggestions would be appreciated.
>>
>>
>> Thanks
>>
>> Matt P.

On Fri, 3 Oct 2003 23:13:31 -0400 (EDT), High_Colonic@webtv.net (Miss Anne Thrope) wrote:

>As long as you're confessing to the world of your flat footedness, why not clear the air about your
>inability to satisfy your partners romantically, too?

So that's why your so bitter, you're one of the frustrated partners.

[[ This message was both posted and mailed: see the "To," "Cc," and "Newsgroups" headers for
details. ]]

In article <4893fade.0310030715.171194a6@posting.google.com>, Matt Peeler <aaronpeel@aol.com> wrote:

> I have been running with Brooks Addiction for about a year. I have flat feet and they seem to have
> been the best shoes for me to do a long run. I used them for my last 13.1 mile run in a half
> ironman recently. However, it seems that after only about 2 months of about 15-20 miles a week the
> outside rear of my shoes show alot of wear.
>
> When should I consider buying new or changing shoes. It seems like that is just a few miles to
> have that much wear. I am 5-10 175. or does anyone have a suggestion for another motion control
> show that may wear better. OR is there anything I can to do to limit the seemingly isolated wear
> on the outside rears of the shoe.
>
> Any suggestions would be appreciated. Thanks Matt P.

Matt,

Here are some posts from 1996 on wearing out the back outside of the heel on one's running shoes.

I think this may speak a bit to your shoe wear.

Ozzie

==============beginning of post 1=============

Doug,

I wanted to open a dialogue about the power runners give away by not thinking about form and style.
I go back to George Sheehan's comment, "First, be a good animal." Shoe styles, a great deal of
research, etc. have the unspoken assumption that runners should land on their heels first. That is
translated into the runners mind by a picture of the heel strike being the back of the heel of the
shoe...with very few thinking that the heel of the foot is an inch and a half or more in front of
the heel of the shoe....and the vector force of body into the ground is in front of the foot's heel.

How many of you reading this have taken off your shoes and run on grass barefoot to see what it
feels like when there is no cushion to mask improper landing on the back of the heel of the foot.

Let me know what you've learned from doing it? Remember, if you have not followed my earlier
thoughts, I often say, "Do it, lovingly." which to me means take care of the one body you have so
that it can serve you well for the 80 to 120+ years. Go for the grace.

In article <4hk973$m2i@watnews1.watson.ibm.com>, dvfreese@clnt13kgn.kgn.ibm.com (Doug Freese) wrote:

> Ozzie Gontang askes:
> |> It is my belief that after 20 years of watching runners, and training and coaching running form
> |> and style, "Heel Strikers are Overstriders."
> |>
> |> If you are running towards me and I can see the bottoms of your shoes from the front to the
> |> heel, you are overstriding. If you come down on the heel of the shoe, you are landing behind
> |> the heel of the foot which is about an inch or inch and a half in front of the back of the shoe
> |> heel.
> [ alittle snip]
> |>
> |> Shoes will get more technical to deal the injuries caused not by running but by improper
> |> running. I continue to go to Road Runner Sport outlet store and buy size 13 shoes that people
> |> have returned because they didn't work for them. It's not only the shoes that can be the
> |> problem but the unthinking runner who doesn't think about moving over the earth with grace and
> |> ease for 80 to 120 years.
> |>
> |> And so what do you think?
> Ozzie, For what it's worth I agree that heel strikers are over striders. Having said that, I worry
> that people will in mass, look at the heels and try to alter their running stride. An individuals
> foot plant, right or wrong, seems to be a natural phenomenon and over time becomes a habit and all
> their muscles, ligaments and tendons strengthen that style. I don't think you are suggesting that
> people should change, but some people might read otherwise.
>
> In past years, landing on your heels was the "correct" form and many runners started to change
> their style. Toe and fore-foot strikers dug in their heels and as you would expect, the injury
> rate increased dramatically.
>
> My long-winded answer is, yes, a mid-foot striker is probably the most efficient running style but
> unless one is very careful I would not alter your running form. Even the Podiatrists answer to all
> foot injuries, orhtodicts, have to be gradually worked into the running regimen. To correct years
> of over/under pronation takes time to adjust.
>
> I'm sure there is anecdotal evidence that people have changed, so I wouldn't say it's not
> possible. Then again, if your running style is working; you are injury free - stay the course.
>
> A few mills worth..
>
>
> --
> Doug Freese All opinions are mine. IBM Tele: 8-293-8098 INTERNET dvfreese@kgn.ibm.com AT&T (914)
> 433-8098 Beemermail dvfreese@mailserv.kgn.ibm.com VM_mail DVFREESE@MHV

==============end of post 1=============

==============beginning of post 2=============

>Ozzie,
>
>I want to thank you very much for your advice concerning my
overstriding.
>
>I've taken your advice (i.e., marching in place--a practice that six years in the military prepared
>me quite well for and I've noticed a significant difference in my stride.
>
>I no longer seem to be getting the excessive wear on the outside heel
of
>my shoes which I was experiencing. Nor, even more fortunately, am I experiencing the ankle pain I
>would regularly get (which was probably the result of my overstriding rather than excessive
>pronation).
>
>So once, again, my sincere thanks.
>
>
>Dave dp3u@andrew.cmu.edu
>------------------------------------------------------------------------
-
>Unfinished business: May 5, 1996 City of Pittsburgh Marathon
>
>"Sometimes I think the surest sign that intelligent life exists elsewhere in the universe is that
>none of it has tried to contact us."

>--Calvin & Hobbes

==============end of post 2=============

=============beginning of post 3===========

In article <01be5549$ad2c7ca0$5a3ff1cf@default>, "The Chief" <harlan@purepowersystems.com> wrote:

> On my longer runs, I begin to get pain in the ball of my foot at about the ten mile mark. Have
> tried different shoes, inserts; so far not much luck.
>
> Anyone have a distance training shoe suggestion, or any other solutions?

Is it only on one foot or the ball of the foot on both feet. If it's both, I might suspect that you
are a heel striker and your forefoot slaps down each and every step. It would be akin to lightly
tapping you on the head with my fist a million times. After a while it starts to be accumulative.

March in place. Notice you lift your knees. Now if you continued to march in place but leaned from
the ankle keeping the body erect, the lean being only a half inch, you'd notice that you're still
lifting your feet up and down but every time you place you foot down, it's about 2 to 4 inches in
place of the other foot and under your center of gravity. That's what runnings about.

Image: broom handle balanced in the palm of your hand. The broom handle is your slightly leaned
body, the hand is the earth. If the broom handle starts to fall and you move your hand in the same
direction it's falling at the same speed it's falling, it won't fall but keeps on moving in the
direction it's going.

Go out and practice likewise!

===============end of post 3===================

In health and on the run, Ozzie Gontang Maintainer - rec.running FAQ Director, San Diego Marathon
Clinic, est. 1975

Mindful Running: http://www.mindfulness.com/mr.asp http://www.faqs.org/faqs/running-faq/

I do like the Asics and alternate Kayano with 2050/2060/2070. I still need and use the glue. You are
right in that the Asics are for me also, a little longer wearing compared to Nike or Mizuno's.

T.J. Hooker <T.J.Hooker@coppers.com> wrote in message
news:<3khsnv4pi3vi3fipbsudf2jfodk12hfubi@4ax.com>...
> Have you tried asics with the Ahar plug? Much more effective, and easier too. I had the same
> problems until I got plugged...

On 4 Oct 2003 21:23:10 -0700, wicklands@comcast.net (Steve W.) wrote:

>I do like the Asics and alternate Kayano with 2050/2060/2070. I still need and use the glue. You
>are right in that the Asics are for me also, a little longer wearing compared to Nike or Mizuno's.
>

You must be real bad then, because I've yet to wear out an Ahar plug.

Steve W. wrote:

> I do like the Asics and alternate Kayano with 2050/2060/2070. I still need and use the glue. You
> are right in that the Asics are for me also, a little longer wearing compared to Nike or Mizuno's.

Have you or anyonbe else looked into your running form? Sounds like you are overstriding if you are
that hard on you heels.

--
Doug Freese dfreeseS@NOBShvc.rr.com

On Sun, 05 Oct 2003 14:09:35 GMT, Doug Freese <dfreese@NOBShvc.rr.com> wrote:

>
>
>Steve W. wrote:
>
>> I do like the Asics and alternate Kayano with 2050/2060/2070. I still need and use the glue. You
>> are right in that the Asics are for me also, a little longer wearing compared to Nike or
>> Mizuno's.
>
>Have you or anyonbe else looked into your running form? Sounds like you are overstriding if you are
>that hard on you heels.

I gotta agree with 'ol numbnutz. I've never heard of anyone even coming close to wearing out heels
like that. If you wear out the Ahar plug that fast then something is wrong.

have u check out asics kojo or foundation??? plodzilla

Matt Peeler wrote:
>
> I have been running with Brooks Addiction for about a year. I have flat feet and they seem to have
> been the best shoes for me to do a long run. I used them for my last 13.1 mile run in a half
> ironman recently. However, it seems that after only about 2 months of about 15-20 miles a week the
> outside rear of my shoes show alot of wear.
>
> When should I consider buying new or changing shoes. It seems like that is just a few miles to
> have that much wear. I am 5-10 175. or does anyone have a suggestion for another motion control
> show that may wear better. OR is there anything I can to do to limit the seemingly isolated wear
> on the outside rears of the shoe.
>
> Any suggestions would be appreciated.
>
> Thanks
>
> Matt P.

Doug Freese <dfreese@NOBShvc.rr.com> wrote in message
news:<zCVfb.17135$pv6.12081@twister.nyc.rr.com>...
> Steve W. wrote:
>
> > I do like the Asics and alternate Kayano with 2050/2060/2070. I still need and use the glue. You
> > are right in that the Asics are for me also, a little longer wearing compared to Nike or
> > Mizuno's.
>
> Have you or anyonbe else looked into your running form? Sounds like you are overstriding if you
> are that hard on you heels.

I don't think so. I do vary my turnover depending on conditions, sometimes with a very short
stride. I have run with 100's of different people over the years and have gotten little to no
mention of anything strange. I'm not particularly slow, I'm in the top 10 to 15% of my age group in
larger races.

I am kind of surprised that I am so far out of the norm. I start adding the glue long before the
outer sole wears through so I can't say exactly what kind of mileage I would get today.

I am not as fast on downhills as other runners my speed. It could be the extra pounding I get from
hitting on my heals so hard.

T.J. Hooker <T.J.Hooker@coppers.com> wrote in message
news:<35a0ovgvfvf87refd026nmbk06jqavtdr3@4ax.com>...
> On Sun, 05 Oct 2003 14:09:35 GMT, Doug Freese <dfreese@NOBShvc.rr.com> wrote:
>
> >
> >
> >Steve W. wrote:
> >
> >> I do like the Asics and alternate Kayano with 2050/2060/2070. I still need and use the glue.
> >> You are right in that the Asics are for me also, a little longer wearing compared to Nike or
> >> Mizuno's.
> >
> >Have you or anyonbe else looked into your running form? Sounds like you are overstriding if you
> >are that hard on you heels.
>
> I gotta agree with 'ol numbnutz. I've never heard of anyone even coming close to wearing out heels
> like that. If you wear out the Ahar plug that fast then something is wrong.

I'm not sure if wrong is the right word but definitely different and probably not in a good sense.