doping

gw709 · #1 06-20.-2003

anyone got some insight into the doping issue at SA champs???

Vo2 · #2 06-20.-2003

All I know is that some clubs seem unhappy about the way it was handled. Letters of enquiry have been despatched to the SACF regarding the issue. If I hear anything else and it becomes public domain, cyclingforums.com will be the first to know.

gw709 · #3 06-20.-2003

this from the SABC website (and we all know how accurate they are!!!):

Cyclists test positive to banned substance
June 19, 2003, 18:30

Cycling has been rocked by another doping scandal, this time in South Africa. It is believed a number of junior cyclists and a very high profile senior cyclist all tested positive at the recent National Time Trial and Road Championships in Welkom. They all had Hemocrit levels in excess of 51% in their blood.

Experts say one way of boosting hemocrit levels is by using the banned substance EPO. High levels of Hemocrit in the body can be attributed to substance abuse. "If we speak about hemocrit levels, it's basically a lab test that we do that gives an indication of the amount of haemoglobin in the blood," said Lorraine Osman of the Pharmaceutical Society of South Africa. "The important thing is the more red blood cells we have in the blood, the better our oxygen carrying capacity. That gives extra stamina and enhanced performance."

The South African Institute for Drug Free Sport collects urine samples from athletes at all major sporting events. The SA Cycling Federation recommended a doctor who monitored the tests in Welkom. The blood samples were then taken to a laboratory not accredited by the International Olympic Committee but the federation declared the tests null and void because it was not happy with the testing procedure.

Following the federation's ruling, the question now being asked is whether its a cover-up. Goty Hansen, South African cycling federation chairperson, refused to respond today. He said his organisation would take up the matter once it had all the facts.

RalleighOke · #4 06-20.-2003

Also saw it on the news last night. Not good.

But I won't take it to heart, not unless they release any names.

**steve** · #5 06-20.-2003

Quote:

Originally posted by RalleighOke
But I won't take it to heart, not unless they release any names.

This wont happen until the B tests are positive!

As for junior cyclists taking dope, thats pretty pathetic, should thier coach(s) and parents be treated like common drug dealers?

cheers

RalleighOke · #6 06-20.-2003

I think an example of one or two life bans should provide enough reason for them not to take any dope.

**steve** · #7 06-20.-2003

I wonder who the high profile senior cyclist was?

lazysegall · #8 06-21.-2003

Doping on an amatuer level is a sad fact, but it does happen...in america plenty of high school athletes are known to take creatin and andro to improve performance (not illegal, but certainly not candy) and others have been known to take steroids.

RalleighOke · #9 06-23.-2003

Quote:

Originally posted by steve
I wonder who the high profile senior cyclist was?

I heard a name this weekend from one of my cycling buddies but would rather not say as I can't back this up, if this is in fact true then it would be a shock to some.

But, his red blood cell levels were at 52 and the normal person is at 31 (I think).

Ricstern should know what that means.

gw709 · #10 06-23.-2003

Below is a posting by Andrew MAclean around the supposed "doping: issue at SAs

Looks like another great feat of communication and reporting!!

Testing at SA's.

Message: I was most certainly Not tested positive for any banned products at the recent SA's!!! In almost 16 years as a Pro, locally and internationally I never ever had a problem with drug testing. I am absolutely against the use of any banned substances to improve performance. Knowing the facts about the testing at SA's I will also bet the juniors "implicated" are in no way guilty. A local Welcom doctor did a blood test. [Not drug free sport] A blood test that tested for Haematocrit [red blood cell count] level and not for any banned substances. It certainly was not a test for EPO! If your HC level is over 50% for males and 48% for females then you can prohibited from competing for health reasons until the HC drops or more tests [urine] can be done to test for banned substances. The UCI has very strict protocols for HC testing. EG. The test has to be done at 5am on an empty stomach and most importantly before any exercise. At SA's the Blood screening tests were conducted after exercise. It is quiet normal to have HC over 50% after exercise. [Dehydration, exercise stress etc] Some uniformed individuals saw my name and others with Blood result over [50,06%] and thought he had BIG news [Scandal] Well, as they say the rest is History! All I want to say this has been the most frustrating and in factual experience of my life; all the facts will emerge in the next 5 days. However the damage has been done and I just hope out of the experience no other cyclists need to go through this ordeal!

Andrew Mclean.

ric_stern/RST · #11 06-24.-2003

Quote:

Originally posted by RalleighOke
I heard a name this weekend from one of my cycling buddies but would rather not say as I can't back this up, if this is in fact true then it would be a shock to some.

But, his red blood cell levels were at 52 and the normal person is at 31 (I think).

Ricstern should know what that means.

Obviously, i'm not commenting on any individual doping cases. however, haematocrit, which is what is being tested here has a range of 42 - 54 % (for men), with a mean value of 47 % (Astrand and Rodahl, 1986). Women have a lower haematocrit.

Haematocrit is the relative amount of corpuscles and plasma (solids and fluids in the blood).

The UCI, along with professional cyclists (i think) decided that an upper limit of 50% should be adhered too.

As you get fitter (increase in e.g., VO2 max) your haematocrit *lowers* as the plasma expands at a faster rate than the corpuscles. off the top of my head haematocrit is likely to be in the low 40's for people who are well trained.

Ric

jim gravity · #12 06-24.-2003

"off the top of my head haematocrit is likely to be in the low 40's for people who are well trained."

but, more like 49.9% for a professional cyclist for some strange reason.

**steve** · #13 06-24.-2003

Quote:

Originally posted by jim gravity
"off the top of my head haematocrit is likely to be in the low 40's for people who are well trained."

but, more like 49.9% for a professional cyclist for some strange reason.

hehe I like how you have summed that up

cheers

ewep · #14 06-25.-2003

After getting some info on the HB tests by a sports doctor (and orthopeadist), I was told the following: your HB count will be much higher if you've done some excercise and even higher when you are dehydrated in any way. That is the reason why the HB count on many of the cyclists were high. The doctor took the bloodsamples AFTER the SA Champs. Now if the guys didn't have an elevated HB count, I would've lost all respect for them for not giving their EVERYTHING in the champs.

Lazy legs · #15 06-25.-2003

Agree with you 100% ewep, at least they proved that they did put in some effort.
As for the organisers getting the samples taken AFTER the champs ... twhat can we say? Maybe the organisers need to be tested for more than just a HB count?