after Armstrong retires, US cycling is over?

paris_boy

the greatest American rider, Greg Lemon was just 23 when he rode the TDF the first time.

mojomarc

I don't think US Cycling will be over. I suspect that the lack of young rider competition, which is kind of sad, is based more on the fact that a cyclist has to be dominant in the US before a European team will find out about them and bring them in where they could compete. It's much safer for these teams to wait for them to mature more and bring them over when they're already competitive (or, at least, cheaper, since you don't have to move a European to have them compete in Europe, or necessarily sign them to a contract based on the risk associated with moving across an ocean).

I would dare to guess that if the major event in cycling were the Tour d'Amerique, and it involved almost 5000km of racing in the US, you'd be wondering about the lack of European cyclists for the same sorts of reasons. A good parallel can be seen in rugby, where only the very best of the Americans gets a contract to play overseas, and usually then is a very good first XVs player (unless they're injured all the time like Dan Lyle).

Anyway--that's my take. I suspect that there's someone about 23 in Colorado right now training his heart out who will get picked up in a few years and turn out to be pretty competitive in European stage races. Our population base is such that if even a small fraction of the population participates, we're still likely to turn out a couple good ones, even if Americans will never populate the entire peloton.

paris_boy

but you must have races that the young riders can enter for training. in Europe there are long road races every weekend in local areas for young riders. but someone told me the Yank police do not want to close the roads for racing.

mojomarc

I can't answer that directly, as I don't race myself, but I do see quite a bit of team training going on around here, and we're not too far off sea level where I am. Also, although I don't know if they still do them, they used to have criteriums every weekend at Delta Park in Portland when I was growing up. Even raced in a few of them myself on a lark, with little or no success. That said, Western Washington is not a good place to be doing race training, since despite the great mountain roads, there are two few non-rainy days around here. Most of the riders I know train in the velodrome in Redmond near the Microsoft headquarters.

mojomarc

I did a little surfing, and found several weekend racing series. The one that actually looks like it might compare to what you described, Paris, is the Mason Lake series, where they ride up to 84 mile races (multiple laps around the 12 mile lake).

http://www.pazzovelo.com/events/races/2002/mason_lake/

In poking around, I must admit there are way, way more racing options than I had thought. Kind of surprised, actually.

paris_boy

your riders must come to Europe young, like the great Lemon did. this is why the French respect Lemon because he came to Europe, learned the language and adapted our culture (without complaining). but I think it is difficult for other Americans to do this. I don't think your race system can produce enough talent to really challenge Europeans.

mojomarc

Depends on what you mean about challenging the Europeans. If you mean becoming the majority riders on the Tour or the Vuelta, I would agree wholeheartedly. If you mean producing riders with the talent of Leipheimer, Hamilton, Julich, etc., on a regular basis, riders that can perform as a team leader, then I would disagree. Of course, I don't expect there to be another Lemond or Armstrong the first year after Armstrong retires, whenever that is, but I bet there is a 13 or 14 year old kid somewhere that has a ton of talent who will show up in the next decade and be a front-runner in stage races. Heck, I think any country can do that with the right inspiration. I just think the inspiration that Armstrong provides to the younger generation who might just be getting started in the sport is hard to overestimate.

thugpreacha

Yes, Lemon was a heckofa rider, and being a Lemon, he rode up those mountains with the help of fellow limey Robert Millar!

__________________
A fanatic is one who can't change his mind and won't change the subject. Sir Winston Churchill
It [training] doesn't get easier; you just get faster.
-- Greg Lemond

babylou

American riders don't go to Europe to earn French respect. American riders go to Europe to win races at the highest level of the sport. No different than when a European comes to play on the US PGA tour or the NBA.

The complaining part. Well it seems you have made an art complaining about Americans.

meehs

I think that American cycling will definely continue after Armstrong retires. The level of popularity and whether or not there continues to be an Ameican sponsored team when LA is gone remains to be seen.

I'm sure there will always be some American riders in the peloton. What's amazing to me is that while there are very few American riders in the peloton, the ones that are there (with the exception of Floyd Landis) are either team leaders or co-leaders (Armstrong, Hamilton, Leipheimer, Julich).

I don't think there will ever be a proportianate number of American riders in the peloton. Simply because cycling is nowhere near as popular in the US as it is in Europe and other countries.

gntlmn

Anquetil, Merckx, Hinault, Indurain, Armstrong are the only 5 times winners of the Tour de France. Anquetil's and Merckx' time was before this list, which starts in 1975. Merckx would certainly have won best young rider if they had such an award back then (I don't know if they did). He won his first Tour in 1969 with an 18 minute gap to second place, the widest in Tour history. Merckx is in a different league though--the anomaly. He raced until he was 29 before he had to quit. That's a young age to be retiring in cycling, but he already had become the best rider of all time.

Most notably, I don't see Hinault, Indurain or Armstrong on this list. Anquetil was earlier--mid 1950's and 1960's. That's what I was talking about--multi tour champions. As for winning fewer than 5, maybe it's better to flair out young. But if you want to win 5 or more, they are more careful about not wearing themselves out in their early 20's.

renoster

Have you heard of Tom Danielson?

paris_boy

26 is young?

Laflore

Tom got a late start in high level racing, just like Tyler. Both should be able to carry on well into their 30's (i.e. they are much fresher than those who race full on at a very high level from the junior years onward).

I have high hopes for Tom.. IMHO he just needs to get on the right team and adapt to the European system. He has loads of talent.