It's cool apparently

davek

helen wrote:
> Indeed, but it's good to see that the average teenager finds it cool too.

Blimey, teenager borrows mum's bike, which has full mudguards and no
suspension, and mates think it's cool...

how often does that happen?

d.

Paul - xxx

David Hansen composed the following;:
> On Wed, 19 Jan 2005 18:34:03 -0000 someone who may be "Paul - xxx"
> <notcheckedever@hotmail.com> wrote this:-
>
>> We don't allow them to swear at all, but recognise that they will
>> whilst out with friends maybe, and that they'll hear it all on TV
>> anyway ... and to be honest, they do hear it from me occasionally,
>> whilst outside the influence of swmbo ..
>
> I find that swearing at my computers (and related gadgets) a great
> deal means I almost never swear at anything or anyone else.

Heheheh, I generally mutter at the computers, they can hear, you know ..


--
Paul ...
http://www.4x4prejudice.org/index.php
(8(!) Homer Rules ...
"A tosser is a tosser, no matter what mode of transport they're using."

Paul Rudin

Tony Raven <junk@raven-family.com> writes:

> Not Responding wrote:
>> Any pointers to a simple "how to" guide for windows? The DRM issues
>> have held me back from spending money on legal downloads but if
>> there's a way around that, I may become a customer.
>
> The "simple" way is to burn them to a CD and tnen rip the CD to
> mp3. The complex way is to use Hymn as a command line programme or
> slightly easier to use iOpener. Both available at
> http://hymn-project.org/download.php

jhymn is a nice gui pointy-clicky front end for hymn.

David Hansen

On Wed, 19 Jan 2005 22:02:24 +0000 someone who may be David Martin
<martin-family@blueyonder.co.uk> wrote this:-

>>> Apple stuff only works on machines with Apple operating systems.
>>>
>>> Microsoft stuff only works on machines with Microsoft operating systems.
>>>
>>> Where's the difference?
>>
>> The first one is demonstrably wrong, as my QuickTime for Windows plugin
>> demonstrates.
>
>The second is demonstrably wrong as my Windows Media Player for Mac
>demonstrates.

Or indeed Microshit Office works on Macs, either the Mac version of
office or the PC version if a PC emulator is running on the Mac.

Microshit have written software for the Mac since the first models.
Could someone remind me how much of Apple Microshit own at the
moment?


--
David Hansen, Edinburgh | PGP email preferred-key number F566DA0E
I will always explain revoked keys, unless the UK government
prevents me by using the RIP Act 2000.

Zardoz

On Thu, 20 Jan 2005 08:43:44 +0000, David Hansen
<SENDdavidNOhSPAM@spidacom.co.uk> wrote:

>On Wed, 19 Jan 2005 22:02:24 +0000 someone who may be David Martin
><martin-family@blueyonder.co.uk> wrote this:-
>
>>>> Apple stuff only works on machines with Apple operating systems.
>>>>
>>>> Microsoft stuff only works on machines with Microsoft operating systems.
>>>>
>>>> Where's the difference?
>>>
>>> The first one is demonstrably wrong, as my QuickTime for Windows plugin
>>> demonstrates.
>>
>>The second is demonstrably wrong as my Windows Media Player for Mac
>>demonstrates.
>
>Or indeed Microshit Office works on Macs, either the Mac version of
>office or the PC version if a PC emulator is running on the Mac.
>
>Microshit have written software for the Mac since the first models.
>Could someone remind me how much of Apple Microshit own at the
>moment?

<rant>
Oh don't get me started on Apple Evangelists. If I had as much money
as one of them I'd be happy with an overpriced computer.

And that new iPod shuffle. They even had Radio 4 telling us on Friday
that it would be six months before someone came along with a
comparable but cheaper product. Come off it! Flash memory MP3 players
have been around since the 90s. I bought one off ebuyer for £20 last
week...
</rant>

David Martin

On 20/1/05 9:54 am, in article suvuu0df8u6amgkdjqdhd51e0bb5lnip9n@4ax.com,
"Zardoz" <me@you.twang> wrote:

> On Thu, 20 Jan 2005 08:43:44 +0000, David Hansen
> <SENDdavidNOhSPAM@spidacom.co.uk> wrote:
>
>> On Wed, 19 Jan 2005 22:02:24 +0000 someone who may be David Martin
>> <martin-family@blueyonder.co.uk> wrote this:-
>>
>>>>> Apple stuff only works on machines with Apple operating systems.
>>>>>
>>>>> Microsoft stuff only works on machines with Microsoft operating systems.
>>>>>
>>>>> Where's the difference?
>>>>
>>>> The first one is demonstrably wrong, as my QuickTime for Windows plugin
>>>> demonstrates.
>>>
>>> The second is demonstrably wrong as my Windows Media Player for Mac
>>> demonstrates.
>>
>> Or indeed Microshit Office works on Macs, either the Mac version of
>> office or the PC version if a PC emulator is running on the Mac.
>>
>> Microshit have written software for the Mac since the first models.
>> Could someone remind me how much of Apple Microshit own at the
>> moment?
>
> <rant>
> Oh don't get me started on Apple Evangelists. If I had as much money
> as one of them I'd be happy with an overpriced computer.

Not an apple evangelist, but you are comparing apples with oranges.. (pardon
the pun) It's a bit like saying you were done for buying a Dave Yates 631
custom with campag kit, when for a third of the price you could have got a
Carrera thinghy from Halfords.

> And that new iPod shuffle. They even had Radio 4 telling us on Friday
> that it would be six months before someone came along with a
> comparable but cheaper product. Come off it! Flash memory MP3 players
> have been around since the 90s. I bought one off ebuyer for £20 last
> week...

half gig MP3 player for 70 quid? There are comparable products but it is
competetive in the market.

You'll now quiote RRP for a competitor that is as well specced?

...d

Richard Bates

On Wed, 19 Jan 2005 22:42:56 +0000, Tony Raven <junk@raven-family.com>
wrote:

>Not Responding wrote:
>>
>> Any pointers to a simple "how to" guide for windows? The DRM issues have
>> held me back from spending money on legal downloads but if there's a way
>> around that, I may become a customer.
>
>The "simple" way is to burn them to a CD and tnen rip the CD to mp3.

But you will end up with a poorer quality result since you are taking
a lossy file, converting to a non-lossy PCM format but still with the
lossy artefacts, and then converting to another lossy format but with
different losses. You end up with a file which contains double the
amount of "lossyness".

In practice you may not notice the difference.

>The complex way is to use Hymn as a command line programme or slightly
>easier to use iOpener. Both available at
>http://hymn-project.org/download.php

Hymn, as I understand it, does not involve any change in the music
data - it merely strips out the copy protection.


--
Amazon: "If you are interested in 'Asimov's I-Robot',
you may also be interested in 'Garfield - The Movie'.
... erm, how do they figure that one out?

Dave Larrington

Paul Rudin wrote:
> Tony Raven <junk@raven-family.com> writes:
>
>> Paul - xxx wrote:
>>> This is something we're considering, but at 12 years old, we'd
>>> rather not have him going around with a £200 iPod around his neck
>>> .. his £50 MP3 player is good enough for now, and he has a CD
>>> Walkman ..
>>>
>>
>> ..and getting iTunes music onto anything other than an iPod is
>> something Apple make very very difficult (not impossible though ;-)
>
> Not really difficult - you can burn to CD from itunes and then rip the
> CD back to MP3. Or you can use something like hymn
> <http://hymn-project.org/> to remove the drm stuff (which probably
> technically breaks the itunes terms of use...)

The latest version of iTunes (4.7.1) breaks Hymn thobut.

--

Dave Larrington - http://www.legslarry.beerdrinkers.co.uk/
World Domination?
Just find a world that's into that kind of thing, then chain to the
floor and walk up and down on it in high heels. (Mr. Sunshine)

Richard Bates

On Wed, 19 Jan 2005 22:42:56 +0000, Tony Raven <junk@raven-family.com>
wrote:

>Not Responding wrote:
>>
>> Any pointers to a simple "how to" guide for windows? The DRM issues have
>> held me back from spending money on legal downloads but if there's a way
>> around that, I may become a customer.
>
>The "simple" way is to burn them to a CD and tnen rip the CD to mp3.

But you will end up with a poorer quality result since you are taking
a lossy file, converting to a non-lossy PCM format but still with the
lossy artefacts, and then converting to another lossy format but with
different losses. You end up with a file which contains double the
amount of "lossyness".

In practice you may not notice the difference.

>The complex way is to use Hymn as a command line programme or slightly
>easier to use iOpener. Both available at
>http://hymn-project.org/download.php

Hymn, as I understand it, does not involve any change in the music
data - it merely strips out the copy protection.

(Apologies if this appears more than once)
--
Amazon: "If you are interested in 'Asimov's I-Robot',
you may also be interested in 'Garfield - The Movie'.
... erm, how do they figure that one out?

Tony Raven

Paul Rudin wrote:
> Tony Raven <junk@raven-family.com> writes:
>
>
>>Not Responding wrote:
>>
>>>Any pointers to a simple "how to" guide for windows? The DRM issues
>>>have held me back from spending money on legal downloads but if
>>>there's a way around that, I may become a customer.
>>
>>The "simple" way is to burn them to a CD and tnen rip the CD to
>>mp3. The complex way is to use Hymn as a command line programme or
>>slightly easier to use iOpener. Both available at
>>http://hymn-project.org/download.php
>
>
> jhymn is a nice gui pointy-clicky front end for hymn.
>

And iOpener is an even nicer one IMO.

Tony

Paul - xxx

David Martin composed the following;:
> On 20/1/05 9:54 am, in article
> suvuu0df8u6amgkdjqdhd51e0bb5lnip9n@4ax.com, "Zardoz" <me@you.twang>
> wrote:
>
>> On Thu, 20 Jan 2005 08:43:44 +0000, David Hansen
>> <SENDdavidNOhSPAM@spidacom.co.uk> wrote:
>>
>>> On Wed, 19 Jan 2005 22:02:24 +0000 someone who may be David Martin
>>> <martin-family@blueyonder.co.uk> wrote this:-
>>>
>>>>>> Apple stuff only works on machines with Apple operating systems.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Microsoft stuff only works on machines with Microsoft operating
>>>>>> systems.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Where's the difference?
>>>>>
>>>>> The first one is demonstrably wrong, as my QuickTime for Windows
>>>>> plugin demonstrates.
>>>>
>>>> The second is demonstrably wrong as my Windows Media Player for Mac
>>>> demonstrates.
>>>
>>> Or indeed Microshit Office works on Macs, either the Mac version of
>>> office or the PC version if a PC emulator is running on the Mac.
>>>
>>> Microshit have written software for the Mac since the first models.
>>> Could someone remind me how much of Apple Microshit own at the
>>> moment?
>>
>> <rant>
>> Oh don't get me started on Apple Evangelists. If I had as much money
>> as one of them I'd be happy with an overpriced computer.
>
> Not an apple evangelist, but you are comparing apples with oranges..
> (pardon the pun) It's a bit like saying you were done for buying a
> Dave Yates 631 custom with campag kit, when for a third of the price
> you could have got a Carrera thinghy from Halfords.
>
>> And that new iPod shuffle. They even had Radio 4 telling us on Friday
>> that it would be six months before someone came along with a
>> comparable but cheaper product. Come off it! Flash memory MP3 players
>> have been around since the 90s. I bought one off ebuyer for £20 last
>> week...
>
> half gig MP3 player for 70 quid? There are comparable products but it
> is competetive in the market.
>
> You'll now quiote RRP for a competitor that is as well specced?

Son now has a 1 gig MP3 (MPMan I think) from Currys for £99, which he
paid for himself.

--
Paul ...
http://www.4x4prejudice.org/index.php
(8(!) Homer Rules ...
"A tosser is a tosser, no matter what mode of transport they're using."

Paul - xxx

Simon Brooke composed the following;:
> in message <357oj4F4ic68tU1@individual.net>, Paul - xxx
> ('notcheckedever@hotmail.com') wrote:
>
>> Tony Raven composed the following;:
>>> Paul - xxx wrote:
>>>>
>>>> This is something we're considering, but at 12 years old, we'd
>>>> rather not have him going around with a £200 iPod around his neck
>>>> .. his £50 MP3 player is good enough for now, and he has a CD
>>>> Walkman ..
>>>>
>>> ..and getting iTunes music onto anything other than an iPod is
>>> something Apple make very very difficult (not impossible though ;-)
>>
>> Which is another reason I don't have .. er .. I mean my son doesn't
>> have, an iPod.
>>
>> And people moan at Microsoft ... where everyone has access ...
>
> Err... sorry?
>
> Apple stuff only works on machines with Apple operating systems.

No it doesn't ..

> Microsoft stuff only works on machines with Microsoft operating
> systems.

No it doesn't ..

> Where's the difference?

I was having a laugh. I dislike Apple products such as iPod iTunes
because they seem so proprietary and limiting, in much the opposite yet
same way that I like Microsoft products which anyone might hack into or
make a virus for, whatever ..


--
Paul ...
http://www.4x4prejudice.org/index.php
(8(!) Homer Rules ...
"A tosser is a tosser, no matter what mode of transport they're using."

Tony Raven

Richard Bates wrote:

>
> But you will end up with a poorer quality result since you are taking
> a lossy file, converting to a non-lossy PCM format but still with the
> lossy artefacts, and then converting to another lossy format but with
> different losses. You end up with a file which contains double the
> amount of "lossyness".
>
> In practice you may not notice the difference.
>

>
>>The complex way is to use Hymn as a command line programme or slightly
>>easier to use iOpener. Both available at
>>http://hymn-project.org/download.php
>
>
> Hymn, as I understand it, does not involve any change in the music
> data - it merely strips out the copy protection.
>
>


iTUnes uses the mpeg4 (AAC) format now which many mpeg players do not
handle. So you probably have to convert it to mp3 either way after
stripping the DRM. At least you can use a decent LAME encoder to do the
conversion though rather than Apple's lame one.

Anyone tried the iTunes 3.7.1 to see if they've shut down the DRM
stripping on it while closing the security flaw?

Tony

Zardoz

>half gig MP3 player for 70 quid? There are comparable products but it is
>competetive in the market.
>
>You'll now quiote RRP for a competitor that is as well specced?
>
>..d

Ebuyer 512mb MP3 Player with LCD Display, FM Radio and Digital Voice
recording

£57.57 inc VAT

http://www.ebuyer.com/customer/prod...oduct_uid=78183



Granted the Apple thingy isn't badly priced (probably better so in US)
it was the way it was represented by the BBC as cutting edge
technology that'll take the competitors years to catch up with.