Do you have to use perfromance enhancers to be a pro?

Brizza

We do more drug testing than the US, yet we don't even have a pro competition

There is no money in Australian cycling until you get overseas.

Our pros work in poorly paying bike shops and are given a frame or bike each year as sponsorship until they get a reputation they can take overseas.

Where is the money causing all this corruption coming from?

OK a few individuals made a private decision, does that make every Australian dirty?

We have 364 days of warm weather. Is it any suprise we produce good athletes?

VeloFlash

You make the above statement and this statement:

"More bad news for Australian track fans---the truth does smart. The appearence of the AIS progaram is 1) it's a huge success 2) doping is required 3) doping has been confirmed 4) the cover stories are embarrassing and ongoing even in your Parliament."

Then you withdraw from the above direct accusations about the AIS and say:

"I never said the AIS has a conspiracy to commit illegal doping upon their Olymic hopefulls."

Can you elaborate?

Mark French made two fatal legal flaws. He went to the hearing unrepresented and was torn to shreds. He was told he would be given a reduced sanction if he opened up on his fellow competitors.

However, his biggest mistake was to finger two riders who were doping at the training facility at a time when those riders were with teams in Europe. After that exposure no Court or Tribunal would give him any credibility for his evidence.

But you may be interested to know, Flyer, that at no time whatsoever did he implicate the AIS or Cycling Australia has having any contribution into the allegations he made.

By the way, it was only brought up once in parliament. And that was an election year when the opposition party wanted to score some pre election brownie points on the government. Many opposition members of parliament would prefer sporting funding to be re-directed to environment and social welfare issues.

__________________
VF

"Remember, even if you win the rat race, you are still a rat"

kennf

You guys are getting sidetracked on the Australian issue. Flyer isn't singling out Australians, he has stated that he believes EVERY pro rider dopes. In particular, EVERY pro rider who wins a grand tour. He also believes that Lance started doping when he was a 16 year old triathlete. You will note that about half of the threads in the "doping" category are started by Flyer. It is his raison d'etre.

Brizza

We're pointing out that he isn't correct in everything he's asserted.
He had no response to his allegations of widespead dopping in the AIS and didn't have an answer to why Australia tests more than the US when we don't even have a Pro competition.

Many of the riders tested in the US arn't even Americans, while we have no competition worth travelling for (we get a very small number of international riders at some of our big races).

I think flyier is correct in many of his suggestions but he needs to be more careful in his allegations.

kennf

Flyer, on March 1, 2005 you said:

"According to Greg Strock & Erich Kaiter, Lance's former USA National Teammates the "injections" had already begun by 1990, when Lance was 18 years old. Perhaps he did start a few years earlier. The dope is free for promising talent."

I'm sorry I so drastically misrepresented your claims. I guess I should have realized that when you said "a few years earlier", the word "few" meant "one year or less", that is, age 17, not 16. And of course, you did preface your statement with "perhaps", which I guess means "I have no proof of this, but I'll just say it". Do I have it straight now?

VeloFlash

"Not a whole different than Mark French, Shane Perkins and the AIS scandal, eh?"

Flyer, you and you alone refer it as an 'AIS scandal.'

The AIS have never been implicated, unlike the USCF, as being party to any athlete who has failed a drug test. French was granted the opportunity for a reduced sanction if he exposed other parties to the 'shooting gallery'. The AIS never figured in his accusations even though French adopted a scorched earth policy to take as many with him as he could.

The AIS is a government funded and publicly accountable agency. The USCF is not nor is USOC. An individual citizen of Australia (usually referred to as a taxpayer) can raise issues through the political process of any taxpayer funded organisations.

The only complaints I have heard about the AIS through the political process is an alleged waste of government resources in promoting athletic elitism at the expense of environmental and social welfare funding. If there was even a slight hint or rumour about the AIS preparing athletes for competition in breach of the anti doping rules then it would have been exposed.

Ever heard of the expression: "One swallow does not make a summer?"

In your rationale about the AIS you would refute and say "Summer is here, I saw a swallow."

__________________
VF

"Remember, even if you win the rat race, you are still a rat"

Brizza

Keep to the allegations you can sustain and you will receive alot more support in your move against drugs in sport.

By raising allegations without substance many readers are getting defensive when considering your claims and are writing off your other points.

That said I think you have some points our sport and it's spectators should be giving more thought to.

Billsworld

I have been around elite powerlifters most of my life. I hate the broad brush painted over every guy that is better, faster, stronger must be on something. BUT....when an Aussie or Brit or Yank track star is posting lifting numbers of elite powerlifters AND doing all their bike training some questions arise for me.