Stage 14 TDF : Agde - Ax-3 Domaines : Spoiler

tinks

On the penultimate climb, Armstong took at least one bottle from the DC team car. Clearly breaching the rule against taking on board drinks on the way up a climb. I think the penalty is something like 10 seconds at the discretion of the referees?

Ullefan

Well, it doesn't matter to them being 4 minutes ahead. They'll probably be more lenient on a hot day and where the roads are so narrow meaning it's harder to get through. DC definately have an advantage being in first position in line on the narrow roads. I saw Landis and some others taking water from fans even drinking it, probably because their cars couldn't get through.

musette

Can somebody tell me what the policy is for taking bottles from team cars? It sounds like there's discretion in the policy, to be exercised by the race commissares?

All the team cars had their chance to be at the front. If Bruyneel was a better driver or if Bruyneel was at the front because, he started before the other team cars to begin the stage (since LA is #1 on GC), that's more power to Bruyneel. Bruyneel is a very effective DS and this is an example of it.

Ullefan

Not on the climbs. If you watched it you'd know what i'm talking about. The roads are so narrow that it is impossible without one car pulling out.

jhuskey

I think you are saying that since Lance is #1 in the GC standing then his team car goes first.
Which is correct, the way I understand the rules.

__________________
Sobriety is over rated!

MJtje

Or the car was so close, because of fans that might do something like last year that Bruyneel rode to close on Alpe...........

thebluetrain

I am thinking maybe the reason Discovery was allowed to have a car up front is because Lance is in Yellow. Totshnig had his car up there to. I dont know when his car got to him, if it was during the break or not.

Ullefan

Doubt it. He was part of the group on the descent.

musette

Letour.com addresses the TM chasing Vino episode:

"... a bizarre scene which illustrated T-Mobile’s stupidity. Vinokourov proved his fighting spirit by wrestling his way into the lead group before the final mountain. He then bolted ahead to repeat his role from the previous climb – namely to hit the turbo and force his team’s rivals to do the work to reel him in. Perhaps the consistent and aggressive Basso would take the bait. Maybe even Evans could have a go and chase his former team-mates down. Why not Mancebo once again? It was a tactic dreamed up to taunt Armstrong but the American didn’t need to do anything. Why? Because Ullrich and Kloden teamed up and set off in pursuit of their colleague. Huh?!"

Couldn't have said it before myself. The earlier attack by Vino was very effective. It shed LA of all his then remaining domestiques. Unfortunately for TM, isolation of LA is only the first part of an effective strategy against LA. There needs to be a second part that involves dropping or compromising LA (which is the difficulty, obviously).

Also, I find this discussion about how maybe Bruyneel should have allowed other cars to get in front of him to be strange. He was at the front; he would have had to compromise his position, and his opportunity to hand things to LA, to give somebody else's team car a chance. Why do that? Compromise one's own prospects and enhance a competitor's?

Ullefan

Cycling has long been traditionally a friendly sport compared to others. Today I saw a Saunier Duval car handing a bottle to the group of Ullrich, Lance, Landis, Moos, Basso to whoever wanted it. Why was Saunier doing that? because team cars could not get through and since Saunier's car was ahead of them (Garate in the lead group) they saw it only sportsman like to give a assistence to other riders. And I've seen that happen before.

musette

Handing a bottle to another team's rider is easier if one is Saunier Duval, which has no GC contenders, than if one is DC and essentially strengthening a rival. I don't argue that it would not have been very nice of Bruyneel to be handing out water to everybody, but can he be asked to do that? That is not his role, and not doing so, in the case of a rival, is entirely appropriate.

androo

The reason Ullrich & Kloden set off after Vino is because there is a conflict of interest in the Telekom camp and that is why Vino will be from next year in the Discovery Team....


androo

Ullefan

But following tour eqitique would be appropriate, allow other cars to hand bottles to their riders who are dying in the heat. I repeat, Lance went back to his car about 4 times on the descent, over the top in my opinion.

azdroptop

I was kind of thinking it was more of a Lance letting him go kind of thing? Which in a way was proven when Lance decided to regain the pack with complete ease.