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How Much Recovery is Enough?

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Old 21-07.-2005, 08:46 PM   #16
biker-linz
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Default Re: How Much Recovery is Enough?
Quote:
Originally Posted by frenchyge
If this is the simple version, I don't think I could handle the 'full explanation.'

Would it be more correct to say "lactic acid" than "lactate?" That's the term I'd always heard for what causes the burning sensation in over-worked muscles. I'm assuming the protons you speak of are hydrogen ions which combine with the lactate to form the lactic acid, hence 'acidosis.' Is that right? Or do the hydrogen ions come from the lactate during some part of the process?
None of the above, although this is fairly new stuff. Lactate has no part whatever to play in the whole process; in fact that isn't strictly true, as the lactate dehydrogenase reaction (the one which forms lactate) hoovers up a proton and actually alkalinizes the cell. The whole lactic acid thing is a red herring. The theory was that lactic acid released a proton into the cellular fluid (similar to how you described); only problem is if you look at the biochemistry closely there's never a proton there in the first place! The protons are released as ATP is hydrolysed, so the correct term is now 'metabolic acidosis'. It sounds like I'm splitting hairs, but actually it involves a fundamental shift in the way we view lactate.

L.
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Old 21-07.-2005, 08:50 PM   #17
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Default Re: How Much Recovery is Enough?
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Originally Posted by RapDaddyo
Actually, I do care to know what needs to recover and why and how. And, I basically knew that my heart could beat at a high level forever. But, I was wondering if it was a proxy for anything important. It's just nice because I can measure it during the ride. I was sort of headed toward the NP algorithm to work out the recovery phase following a push > 40K TT power. I just need to make sure I have the algorithm correct before I start modeling it. Then, I plan to test it. Thanks for the clarification. I had no idea my acidosis was so incompetent as to go into the red with a measly extra 50-100 watts.
I'm not sure that HR is a useful proxy for anything during recovery. However, 50-100 W over your threshold would cause *significant* acidosis if you continued long enough, that's for sure! I guess I quoted the NP algorithm becuase it already factors in all the responses you're interested in.

L.
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Old 21-07.-2005, 09:31 PM   #18
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Default Re: How Much Recovery is Enough?
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Originally Posted by biker-linz
I'm not sure that HR is a useful proxy for anything during recovery. However, 50-100 W over your threshold would cause *significant* acidosis if you continued long enough, that's for sure! I guess I quoted the NP algorithm becuase it already factors in all the responses you're interested in.

L.
Well, nice to have an algorithm. Thank you, Andy. Thanks for the suggestion.
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Old 22-07.-2005, 12:21 AM   #19
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Default Re: How Much Recovery is Enough?
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Originally Posted by biker-linz
None of the above, although this is fairly new stuff. Lactate has no part whatever to play in the whole process; in fact that isn't strictly true, as the lactate dehydrogenase reaction (the one which forms lactate) hoovers up a proton and actually alkalinizes the cell. The whole lactic acid thing is a red herring. The theory was that lactic acid released a proton into the cellular fluid (similar to how you described); only problem is if you look at the biochemistry closely there's never a proton there in the first place! The protons are released as ATP is hydrolysed, so the correct term is now 'metabolic acidosis'. It sounds like I'm splitting hairs, but actually it involves a fundamental shift in the way we view lactate.

Cool! Sounds like we may have a whole new training vocabulary in the next couple years. Thanks for the info.

That said, I did a nice little Acidosis Threshold ride last night...
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Old 22-07.-2005, 04:43 AM   #20
biker-linz
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Talking Re: How Much Recovery is Enough?
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Originally Posted by frenchyge
Cool! Sounds like we may have a whole new training vocabulary in the next couple years. Thanks for the info.

That said, I did a nice little Acidosis Threshold ride last night...

LMAO!!!

L.
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