Advise on wheelsets please

~MoDCoN~

there are so many of these threads... perusing them at leisure to gain some kind of idea into what defines a wheelset leads me in circles... there are a few on the boards who seem to have a solid grasp on physics along with some basic english (pardon my lack of capitals - i prefer small text) skills who are able to project a coherent voice (artemidorus springs to mind) but they are all but drowned out by ppl who have something to say. which i guess, is the purpose of the forums, but it makes for a difficult task in selecting a wheelset or even identifying properties (or complete names) of a wheelset that are beneficial. o_O... why isn't there a sticky with some nicely priced, reccomended wheelsets for 'those who have established the type of riding they do (road) and want to upgrade to something that they might occasionally race on over summer' :P. or even 'better wheels than bontrager select which yes, did flex like a coathanger just after you bought the bike'...

help me out here, i'm drowning! :O

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artemidorus

How much do you want to spend, and how much of a pounding do you intend to give them?

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~MoDCoN~

well that's where i'm not too sure... would prefer durability at the expense of weight, and the same for stiffness over weight... dont think i wanna spend more than the bike ~2000... so there you have it; around 1000-1600ish that are reasonably tough and good enough to sprint on. if they are slightly aero i will smile more.

and thanks for the reply! muchly appreciated

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~MoDCoN~

happy if it is a bit less too... otherwise i will have to save more before purchasing...

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nerdag

That's one helluva a wheel budget. You can get top of the line factory wheelsets for that sort of money - or you could easily pay somebody to build you an indestructible pair from uber-light parts.

n

artemidorus

You want a good hub, slim steel spokes that are preferably bladed, no more than 24 spokes on the rear and 20 on the front, a rim that is more or less elliptical or parabolic in profile, ideally 30+mm in depth, and of alloy construction (for durability) where it faces the road, although a carbon fairing is acceptable or even desirable. This ideal wheelset also has alloy braking surfaces. Weight and stiffness are secondary considerations, although you don't want it to be unnecessarily heavy or so floppy that it rubs the pads in a sprint.

How many wheelsets fit the bill?
None.

Which comes closest?
In my opinion, Mavic Cosmic Carbone SL/Premium. I was recently dismayed to learn that the hub fitted to Ksyrium SSC and the Cosmic Carbone has a plastic bush in the freehub body that needs regular service. This is an unnecessary gesture in a heavier wheel such as the Carbone, and it has certainly diminished my keenness for a set. It is for this reason that it fails to make the grade as a close-to-ideal wheel. It fulfills all of my other criteria, and seems to have a reputation for being a robust wheelset.

What else is reasonable in your price range?
Campy Zonda .
Fulcrum Racing 3.
Shimano 7801.
Shimano 6600.
This is NOT a comprehensive list. There are probably some Eastons etc that deserve to be on it. None of the above are close to ideal, but have aerodynamic section, low-spoke count, slim bladed spokes and are alloy.

Many ranges (Ksyrium, Fulcrum, Campy) have cheaper wheels with steel spokes that are probably superior, in terms of drag and stiffness, to their more expensive siblings (ie Zonda vs Eurus, Ksyrium Elite/Equipe vs SSC SL, Racing 3 vs Racing 1/0).

Paul Merlo of RMIT recently published a study showing that a non-deep-profile (~30mm) aerodynamic-section rim laced with 32 spokes is superior in terms of drag to a box-section rim such as an open pro laced with 16 spokes. So don't forget options such as a hand-built Velocity deep V wheel, although a 28-36 spoke wheel can't equal a 20 spoke wheel.

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~MoDCoN~

thanks for that... im still slightly confused...(of course!). are you reccomending more spokes (deep v) or less as above?

i was thinking of having a deeper profile rear, focussed on strength and aero, with a front that was less aero and lighter - carrying less weight and making it easier to steer against wind...im happy if my budget is too high compared to my bike, and would gladly spend less. i just dont want to then be upgrading later on if it wasn't enough?

in terms of handbuilt wheels how do you select everything? and then how would i choose a builder? im happy with my LBS (cecil walker) but don't know about their wheel building...

i like the campy zonda (different profile) and it is quite cheap too! what about a wheelset such as this, but with different hubs/spokes, or does that wreck the point of it?

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artemidorus

A wheel with fewer spokes is better for drag, one with more spokes gives better durability and stiffness. My point about the Deep V is that, although you would probably want at least 28 spokes with a hand built wheel, a 32 spoke "aero", but not deep, profile wheel is still quicker than a box rim with far fewer spokes. (I'm just giving you my usual rant about box rims such as everyone's favourite baby, the Open Pro). If you are not a Clydesdale or a known serial wheel killer, a wheelset with a 16/20 spoke count is to be preferred over a 28+ spoke handbuilt set.

Sounds like the Zondas would suit you. I have never owned Campy wheels, but many favour them. Their hubs are said to be excellent.

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boon

i have a campy zonda wheelset (06 model) and it's by far the best wheelset i've used. the hub is super smooth and it's been pretty bomb proof so far. compared to the Mavic Aksium when coasting downhill, it's can be up to about 3km/h faster (depends on the steepness of the hill). i even out freewheeled a clydesdale once (and i was about 1/2 the size of the clyde).

boon

~MoDCoN~

do you use it everyday, ie as a training wheel? what are the spokes like? where did you get urs from, and what seems a reasonable price?


are the hubs better than DA hubs? i would like a wheel i can ride on, then come summer, maybe do some crits when ive got more mileage in my legs...

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sogood

Now you have an idea of the model and the local price, get ready and take a look at probikekit.com. You'll suddenly find yourself ready for an upgrade at the same price.

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boon

i use the zonda wheelset as my race/eventing wheels (except for the first 500km when i first got it to break in the hubs). the spokes are about 2mm or 2.5mm wide and feels pretty solid. front rims are 24mm deep and rear is 28mm deep. the G3 spokes for the rear wheel feels solid so far. if you have more money to burn, then i hear that the Fulcrum Racing 1 and Racing 0 are pretty awesome wheelsets.

i got mine from www.totalcycling.com (their shipping rates for wheelsets are better than probikekit.com). i have recently found another well priced online store - www.cyclesuperstore.ie (i bought a Fulcrum Racing 5 Evo wheelset and it had worked out to be cheaper than totalcycling and probikekit). the price from totalcycling is reasonable and way cheaper than what i would have paid if bought from my LBS.

i don't know much about the DA hub or DA wheelsets. if your LBS has a demo set, then i suggest you give it a go. the thing about buying online and not having the opportunity to demo the product is that you have to go on faith that what you have read or been told is a reasonably accurate representation of the product. with many conflicting opinions on any given products, you'll have work out who or what to believe and then bite the bullet and hope it works out right for you.

boon

artemidorus

These wheelsets are best avoided as they have oversized alloy spokes and are probably relatively high drag. I can't quote figures, but the Ksyrium SSC/ES wheels, with similar spokes, are disappointing. Spoke profile is hugely important - very expensive, deep profile carbon wheels such as the lightweight obermayer are ruined, in terms of drag, by ridiculous fat spokes.

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boon

the spoke design on the Fulrum Racing 1 and RacingZero is different from the Ksyrium SSC and ES wheels. perhaps this might address the drag issue you have experienced.

anyway, one thing for the OP to bear in mind about Campy and Fulcrum wheelsets is the difficulty when mounting new tyres (such as Michelin Pro2Race). this is apparently due to the width of the rim (20mm). i have found that once mounted, the beads will stretch over a period of time so when it comes to punture repairs, they are much easier to remove and remount.

boon