CSC leaves cycling

Cobblestones

I just read this.

Another big sponsor leaves cycling.

ETA: Mods, feel free to delete this thread or merge it with Hawkeye's. He beat me to the punch by 1 minute and has a better (English) link anyway.

Tim Lamkin

Let's hope so....would be good for the sport...more to leave...I hope

__________________
What lies behind us and what lies before us are tiny matters compared to what lies within us.

Crankyfeet

My guess is that CSC (the company) had no farking idea of any doping program within the team... or if they did, it may have just been the guy assigned to write the checks for Bjarne.

Unless the system changes, Teams like Astana and CSC and T-Mobile will leave and be replaced by teams that do exactly the same thing. It's no use having faith that things are going to change if we get a bunch of "Honest Joe" sponsors. Things are only going to change if the risks outweigh the rewards. That's human nature... especially in competitive groups.

And if I was an Honest Joe sponsor... why would I want to expose myself in a sport where just one guy on my team could stick a needle in his arm unbeknownst to me, and sully the whole team's/company's reputation?

Tim Lamkin

They could always sponsor “PRO” billiards…O-Wait they to ....have been caught with drugs….those pesky Germans.

__________________
What lies behind us and what lies before us are tiny matters compared to what lies within us.

limerickman

I didn't know Landis was German.

__________________
.."But finally the last thing I’ll say to the people who don’t believe in cycling, the cynics and the sceptics. I'm sorry for you. I’m sorry that you can’t dream big. [I]I'm sorry you don't believe in miracles. You should believe in these athletes, and you should believe in these people. I'll be a fan of the Tour de France for as long as I live. And there are no secrets" - this is a hard sporting event and hard work wins it - Armstrong 2005 TDF
morelike hypocrisy.

TheDarkLord

I see that Tim is sticking to his old views; not sure if you remember Cranky. Tim's philosophy is that all or most of the sponsors must leave the sport, and it must be rebuilt from scratch for it to be regenerated (or clean). I don't agree with this because if the sport does collapse completely, then I'm not sure if it will ever recover.

Tim Lamkin

....sorry who cares if it does collapse completely, what good is it right now anyway...lies, deceit, cheats, it would help the future of the sport to stop and go through a cleansing process...no one will ever stop unlit the entire sport comes to a conclusion....you and I both know it is still gong on all through the sport......sad as that statement is ......it is true.

__________________
What lies behind us and what lies before us are tiny matters compared to what lies within us.

Tim Lamkin

You need to catch up on the world news a bit....when it comes to Germans and drugs and "billiards"...or what ever you call them

__________________
What lies behind us and what lies before us are tiny matters compared to what lies within us.

Crankyfeet

I've been on here a little over a year if you count a few months of lurking. Tim usually posts in soundbites one sentence long. I didn't know that was his prescription for a solution.

I don't agree that the problem lies with the current sponsors. The problem is in the nature of the sport (it is very conducive to doping), the ability to cheat and not be caught, and the fact that all the big players have skeletons in the closet that they are trying to keep in there while they attempt to fight the problem.

There is doping down to domestic Cat 2 level. Guys who have raced that level on this forum have admitted to it. It's not a problem concentrated to a few teams on the Pro Tour. When you have a sport where a strength/weight ratio of 6.7 wins you the TdF, and 6.4 only gets you a top ten, then you have to get to 6.7 if you want to win. That means you have to be the best AND dope. Like most everyone else in the race basically, except be the subsequent best performer as well.

In my mind the only way competitive cyclists are going to stop doping is if they perceive their chances of being caught are high enough to make it too risky. Even then, we are limited by the fact that some PEDs are untestable. That means a shock and awe policy of fighting doping from those with the responsibility to do so (blood passports, more year round random testing, etc.).

But the money situation and power situation has to be restructured. Amateur boffins in the UCI, like McQuaid, need to move aside from the CEO responsibilties (to a chairman, overseer role) and the UCI needs to hire a qualified CEO IMO. The anti-doping cost needs to be spread over all stake-holders. The conflict of interest where UCI can potentially harm an event (like the TdF) with doping revelations as the dope tester, as well as being a competitor promoter, needs to be eradicated. ASO need to get an adequate reward for the risk they take staging their events and the cumulative brand value they have built up over many years.

Take away the sponsors (which is happening as we post... they're not stupid) and there is no entity to replace the vacuum, unless ASO or UCI are going to pay the cyclists directly with prize money.

The sponsors are leaving because the turf battle between ASO and UCI is being fought at the teams' and riders' expense. The interests of other collateral victims are being ignored in the fight to see who is left standing holding the power (and the future money).

Tim Lamkin

I resemble that remark....and YES I do believe it will need to implode before it will come out on the other side in reasonably good shape...The UCI ASO thing...well..that might be what brings it all down anyway...we can hope.

__________________
What lies behind us and what lies before us are tiny matters compared to what lies within us.

Bro Deal

Cycling Weekly on what the future holds.

http://www.cyclingweekly.co.uk/news...57.html?aff=rss

__________________
"You are like the wind and I like the lion. You form the tempest. The sand stings my eyes and the ground is parched. I roar in defiance but you do not hear. But between us there is a difference. I, like the lion, must remain in my place. While you like the wind will never know yours." -- Mulay Hamid El Raisuli, Lord of the Riff, Sultan to the Berbers, Last of the Barbary Pirates

Crankyfeet

Thanks again Bro... for the 100th time I have read something interesting you have posted the links to in here.

Tim Lamkin

Most of you for one reason or another believe I hate pro cycling, quite the contrary, I am just fed up with the self and often rushing to oblivion by the teams themselves….(into the very depths of self conclusion).......that they can and will withstand this storm by still doping….give me a frigging break, I have said it a dozen times on this forum, the ONLY way this will end is when you take the funding away……that is it.

SAD as it is..... the racers, owners, and team mangers are to wrapped up in self righteous thought to ever believe their sport will come tumbling down, add to that the idiocy of UCI/ASO war…and you have total destruction of the sport, it will rise like a Phoenix ….only after total take down.

I love this sport, however I am one who is tired of the way it has been run….not last year or the year before, but for the last ten/fifteen years…time to clean it up, this article says it all, lays it down as to what WILL happen…….it is time to get on board and save our sport….KILL it and start over.

It is for all intent and purpose, disingenuous for anyone on this forum to believe drug testing is going to clean up this sport.

__________________
What lies behind us and what lies before us are tiny matters compared to what lies within us.

Crankyfeet

Doping exists at Cat 2 and 3 levels domestically. Take away the sponsorship funding and you will just reduce the amount spent on the program by the players... IMO you won't stop the doping. As long as there is an advantage to doping and the chance of being caught is small... players will continue to jab themselves with steroids, micro-dose with EPO, and centrifuge their blood. There just won't be as many who can make a living out of the game. And all the young, potentially clean top young cyclists coming through will suffer less potential remuneration from their career.

Take an axe to the doping industry... doctors, corrupt team staff, as well as riders. Test, test, test... maybe then doping will not occur... at least not so much. Or maybe resistance is futile and we just have to legalize some of it, whatever the consequences.

Relying on teams and cyclists to just be nice guys and not dope is naive in my book.