Mission accomplished +5

Donald Munro

Jack Hollis wrote:
>>> I'm afraid that you live in a fantasy world.

Donald Munro wrote:
>>Speaking of fantasy worlds:
>>
>><http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/msg/6022478bb6cfc21e>

Jack Hollis wrote:
> Thank you DM. I now can add that the US has succeeded in turning the
> Sunni Iraqis against Al Qaeda and is now cleaning up the radical Shia
> militias. The US has gotten rid if Saddam and is in a good position to
> deal a crushing blow to Al Qaeda. Iraq will go down as a major victory
> for the US if the next President continues what the Bush administration
> has started and I expect Mc Cain to do exactly that.

I expect Bush has a higher approval rating in Iran than he does in the US,
after all he first removed the major obstacle to them becoming a regional
superpower and now he does their dirty work for them defeating their Sunni
opponents in Iraq while Al Sadr declares a temporary truce to allow the
US to finish his (and Iran's) enemies off. Now the jobs done the truce
is over, and the shia control Iran and Iraq. Bush and co are the
stateman's equivalent of the keystone cops.

Of course you can keep watching Fox News. I'm sure they'll give you
better "news".

Kurgan Gringioni

On May 4, 7:49*am, Jack Hollis <xslee...@aol.com> wrote:
> On Sat, 3 May 2008 21:30:20 -0700 (PDT), Kurgan Gringioni
>
> <kgringi...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> >Don't be a partisan ideologue. It will make you stupid. This
> >administration's conduct has been especially egregious.
>
> I'm afraid that you live in a fantasy world.



Partisan Idiot -


Name one thing that Clinton, Bush Sr. or Reagan did that was as
corrupt as the FERC doing nothing while Enron created the "California
Energy Crisis".

Doesn't exist.


thanks,

K. Gringioni.

bjw@mambo.ucolick.org

On May 4, 10:19*am, Jack Hollis <xslee...@aol.com> wrote:
> <fat-dumb...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> >Jack Hollis wrote:
> >> I'm afraid that you live in a fantasy world.
>
> >Speaking of fantasy worlds:
> ><http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/msg/6022478bb6cfc21e>
>
> Thank you DM. *I now can add that the US has succeeded in turning the
> Sunni Iraqis against Al Qaeda and is now cleaning up the radical Shia
> militias. The US has gotten rid if Saddam and is in a good position to
> deal a crushing blow to Al Qaeda. *Iraq will go down as a major
> victory for the US if the next President continues what the Bush
> administration has started and I expect Mc Cain to do exactly that.
>

IOW, if anything subsequently deviates from your
idyllic vision of the Muddle East, it won't be Bush's
fault, but the next president for not continuing what
Bush started. I expect this argument to become
common at some point, like the argument that hippies
lost the Vietnam War, rather than the NV winning it.
A closed system of reasoning has the advantage of
being generally self-consistent, and the disadvantage
of not being able to modify itself when new evidence
appears; it always reaches the same conclusions.

Incidentally, we have not dealt a crushing blow to
Al Qaeda. Al Qaeda is in Afghanistan and Pakistan
doing God-knows-what (probably more strikes in
someplace like Indonesia, an easier target than the
continental US). "Al Qaeda in Iraq" is a name of
convenience that licensed the name from actual
Al Qaeda, kind of like one of those ugly "Masi"
aluminum bikes that are made by Haro, or made
by some anonymous welding factory for Haro.

Ben

Michael Press

In article
<e06098d9-ba69-4777-a62b-adc121fb8efe@c19g2000prf.googlegroups.com>,
Kurgan Gringioni <kgringioni@hotmail.com> wrote:

> On May 3, 8:50*pm, Jack Hollis <xslee...@aol.com> wrote:
>
> >
> > Bill, change the politician's name and the company's name and this
> > could describe thousands of government contracts.
>
>
>
>
> Dumbass -
>
>
> Don't be a partisan ideologue. It will make you stupid. This
> administration's conduct has been especially egregious.

Unnecessary to qualify egregious.

egregious: Surpassing; extraordinary; distinguished (in a bad sense);

--
Michael Press

Paul G.

On May 4, 12:41 pm, Kurgan Gringioni <kgringi...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> On May 4, 5:37 am, "Qui si parla Campagnolo-www.vecchios.com"
>
>
>
> <pe...@vecchios.com> wrote:
> > On May 3, 1:44 pm, Kurgan Gringioni <kgringi...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > On May 3, 6:48 am, "Qui si parla Campagnolo-www.vecchios.com"
>
> > > <pe...@vecchios.com> wrote:
>
> > > > > > Are you unaware that pilots are officers?
>
> > > > > No, I am not unaware that pilots are officers. Are pilot officers
> > > > > typically well trained in operational war planning?
>
> > > > > Bret
>
> > > > If you stay in the USN log enough and stay operational, you will do
> > > > lots of war planning, as I did in the squadrons(7) I was in, on the
> > > > staff I was on(COMFITAEWWINGPAC) and also in the Naval War College,
> > > > which I attended. I was in the USN from Dec, 1972 until Jan 1993.
>
> > > Dumbass -
>
> > > The war went fine. Saddam's military was defeated very easily.
>
> > > It was the postwar that was/is lost. Getting rid of the Baathist power
> > > structure. Barring the only people who had any expertise in
> > > administration from participating in the new government. Taking away
> > > the jobs of the only people who had any police training (thereby
> > > turning them into resistors).
>
> > > Did they instruct you on nation building?
>
> > > thanks,
>
> > > K. Gringioni.
>
> > No. The military exists for only 2 reasons..to kill people and break
> > things. The civilians are there to nation build after we won the war,
> > and we see how they have done that. Remember, we entered this conflict
> > because of an imminent threat from Iraq(now proven wrong). We defeated
> > their military in 3 weeks, confirmed no WMDs, found and saw Saddam
> > executed..mission accomplished, we should have left long ago. Let them
> > figure it out. Like most gov't programs, ours gooned it up.
>
> Dumbass -
>
> Should've decapitated the Baathists (eliminated Saddam), but left them
> in power. I agree.
>
> W. Bush was actually right when he pooh pooh'd nation building in the
> 2000 election. Too bad he reversed course. Too bad for us and them.
>
> thanks,
>
> K. Gringioni.

No- the Republican'ts were right when they said "We don't do nation-
building". No truer words were ever spoken. But that doesn't mean that
nation-building isn't a good thing. The Marshall Plan was a wildly
successful example of nation-building, under the leadership of
Democrats. All the capable Republicans are making big bucks in the
private sector. Only the incompetent dregs go into politics. Bush is
a prime example, he couldn't even make money in the oil business.
-Paul

Tom Kunich

"Paul G." <carbide@egine.com> wrote in message
news:a1666a59-075a-442c-9c9c-bce2075c10cc@u12g2000prd.googlegroups.com...
>
> I was a radar technician. I'd have given my eye teeth to fly
> fighters.

Ahh yes, all of that great insight of a radar technician.

> I've wondered what real fighter pilots think of Bush's
> pathetic record as a "fighter pilot". What kind of "fighter pilot"
> stops flying as Bush did in April of 1972, refuses to take a required
> flight physical and is grounded, as happened in August of 1972?

About 20% of the pilots reacted like that for reasons you seem unable to
comprehend. But no matter. You've demonstrated that you are unwilling to
think about anything.

Jack Hollis

On Sun, 04 May 2008 20:29:13 +0200, Andrew Price <ajprice@free.fr>
wrote:

>>The US has the best health care in the world.
>
><http://www.lshtm.ac.uk/news/2008/usdeaths.html>
>
>Not everyone would agree with that assertion.

They'd be wrong.

Paul G.

On May 4, 1:57 pm, "b...@mambo.ucolick.org" <b...@mambo.ucolick.org>
wrote:
> On May 4, 10:19 am, Jack Hollis <xslee...@aol.com> wrote:
>
> > <fat-dumb...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> > >Jack Hollis wrote:
> > >> I'm afraid that you live in a fantasy world.
>
> > >Speaking of fantasy worlds:
> > ><http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.racing/msg/6022478bb6cfc21e>
>
> > Thank you DM. I now can add that the US has succeeded in turning the
> > Sunni Iraqis against Al Qaeda and is now cleaning up the radical Shia
> > militias. The US has gotten rid if Saddam and is in a good position to
> > deal a crushing blow to Al Qaeda. Iraq will go down as a major
> > victory for the US if the next President continues what the Bush
> > administration has started and I expect Mc Cain to do exactly that.
>
> IOW, if anything subsequently deviates from your
> idyllic vision of the Muddle East, it won't be Bush's
> fault, but the next president for not continuing what
> Bush started.

Heh heh... I've actually had one of these Bush deadenders tell me that
Bush will be judged a great president... but not until after we're
both dead! That's like saying Clinton will be judged a faithful
husband... but not until after we're both dead.
-Paul

Jack Hollis

On Sun, 04 May 2008 20:59:24 +0200, Donald Munro
<fat-dumbass@hotmail.com> wrote:



>I expect Bush has a higher approval rating in Iran than he does in the US,
>after all he first removed the major obstacle to them becoming a regional
>superpower and now he does their dirty work for them defeating their Sunni
>opponents in Iraq while Al Sadr declares a temporary truce to allow the
>US to finish his (and Iran's) enemies off. Now the jobs done the truce
>is over, and the shia control Iran and Iraq. Bush and co are the
>stateman's equivalent of the keystone cops.

You obviously have zero unredstanding of what's going on in Iraq.

Jack Hollis

On Sun, 4 May 2008 13:57:07 -0700 (PDT), "bjw@mambo.ucolick.org"
<bjw@mambo.ucolick.org> wrote:

>Incidentally, we have not dealt a crushing blow to
>Al Qaeda. Al Qaeda is in Afghanistan and Pakistan
>doing God-knows-what (probably more strikes in
>someplace like Indonesia, an easier target than the
>continental US).

So far, they seem to be good at making video tapes which makes threats
that never happen. Bottom line there have been no attacks in the US
and credit for that goes to Bush and his aggressive anti-terrorist
policies.

Tom Kunich

"Jack Hollis" <xsleeper@aol.com> wrote in message
news:buhs14d2h3ob6li832krgjsic7fi013gof@4ax.com...
> On Sun, 04 May 2008 20:29:13 +0200, Andrew Price <ajprice@free.fr>
> wrote:
>
>>>The US has the best health care in the world.
>>
>><http://www.lshtm.ac.uk/news/2008/usdeaths.html>
>>
>>Not everyone would agree with that assertion.
>
> They'd be wrong.

Well, while you're correct, that doesn't mean that other people's opinions
are of value to theirselves.

Without the medical advances coming out of the USA there'd be a great deal
less health in the world today.

Tom Kunich

"Jack Hollis" <xsleeper@aol.com> wrote in message
news:ndis145qcaevidqdthj90qkv76p98vnbli@4ax.com...
> On Sun, 04 May 2008 20:59:24 +0200, Donald Munro
> <fat-dumbass@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>I expect Bush has a higher approval rating in Iran than he does in the US,
>>after all he first removed the major obstacle to them becoming a regional
>>superpower and now he does their dirty work for them defeating their Sunni
>>opponents in Iraq while Al Sadr declares a temporary truce to allow the
>>US to finish his (and Iran's) enemies off. Now the jobs done the truce
>>is over, and the shia control Iran and Iraq. Bush and co are the
>>stateman's equivalent of the keystone cops.
>
> You obviously have zero understanding of what's going on in Iraq.

What's more, he is more than willing to lie about it and fight any successes
there to the end of time.

Iraq was directly in the middle of everything with a leader capable of just
about anything. It was necessary to stick a stick in the spokes of the
growing terrorist threats in that area. Anyone that knows anything about
Israel would know that if we didn't do it they would have to and that would
start a world war.

If the USA were to use its stated morals we had to try to set up a
democratic government which then necessitated defeating the Sunni (violent
and bloodthirsty) control of Iraq.

Jack Hollis

On Sun, 4 May 2008 16:52:19 -0700, "Tom Kunich" <cyclintom@yahoo. com>
wrote:

>Iraq was directly in the middle of everything with a leader capable of just
>about anything.

Saddam, when he controlled Iraq, was easily the most dangerous man in
the world from the US point of view. As you said, he was capable of
anything and his two sons were of the same cloth.

There was no outcome in Iraq that could be worse than leaving Saddam
in power. Luckily, as it looks now, the US just might pull off a
triple victory. Saddam gone, Al Qaeda in Iraq defeated and a pro-West
democratic government in Iraq with a US military presence to insure
stability in the region.

This is why Bush will go down in history as a great President.

Tom Kunich

"Jack Hollis" <xsleeper@aol.com> wrote in message
news:uhms1497uauvdda9o4qu3j89ospjb3pchj@4ax.com...
> On Sun, 4 May 2008 16:52:19 -0700, "Tom Kunich" <cyclintom@yahoo. com>
> wrote:
>
>>Iraq was directly in the middle of everything with a leader capable of
>>just
>>about anything.
>
> Saddam, when he controlled Iraq, was easily the most dangerous man in
> the world from the US point of view. As you said, he was capable of
> anything and his two sons were of the same cloth.
>
> There was no outcome in Iraq that could be worse than leaving Saddam
> in power. Luckily, as it looks now, the US just might pull off a
> triple victory. Saddam gone, Al Qaeda in Iraq defeated and a pro-West
> democratic government in Iraq with a US military presence to insure
> stability in the region.
>
> This is why Bush will go down in history as a great President.

If Bush gets any credit it will be long after most of the "Democrats"
presently alive today are long dead.

Fact is that Bush made some good decisions and a whole lot of
average-to-poor decisions. At least from my viewpoint which does not include
trillions of dollars of government intelligence reports, thousands of
experts and many advisors who have studied the matter their entire lives.

Of course, most of the fools here think that they can get a better view of
the problem from the Rolling Stone articles or worse.

I personally met and spent most of a dinner with Hamid Karzai. I found him
to be the most normal of people. Honest, trustworthy and a valuable person
in his own right.

He has repeatedly expressed appreciation and support of President Bush.
That's enough for most of the Liberals here to put him on a hit list.