Astana to ride the Giro

limerickman

Point taken Eld.

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morelike hypocrisy.

Eldron

Comments like this really bother. Not because they're borne of ignorance (Kloden stood on the TdF podium on the T-Mobile "blood programme") but because they destroy any positive feeling towards cycling in general.

Doping is so embedded that anytime somebody does anything out of the ordinary you label him/her a "doper"???

Writing off pro cyclists as a bunch of dopers damages the sport just as much as the dope itself.

I'm not saying riding is clean - not by a long shot but by rubbishing any victory you're only damaging the sport more.

He won, he was tested, he is clean according to the tests and rules. Appreciate his skill, sacrifice, suffering and dedication to entertaining YOU and everybody else who watched. Don't try and spoil it for those if us that still enjoy the sport.

thunder

flaw is, how many write off Gilbert and Casar. Casar's win last year in the Tour was my personal highlight in a pretty shitty Tour.

Nope, we have to hold them to account and call them on BS doped performances. Doping precedes the vituperation.

Eldron

The question is who decides which performances are doped and which are not? We, the general public, have very little (if any) idea who is really doped and who is not.

And how does a "he's just a farkin doper" comment on a website hold them to account? All it does is blacken an already tarnished sport.

So what do we do? Just write off all performances that we deem extra ordinary? Hell, we could just as well write off all cycling from 1940 onwards.

Maybe Casar & Gilbert were dopers too? Nobody actually knows - I'm just not a fan of guilty without proof in a sport where proving you're innocent is impossible.

thunder

bar Pinotti, cannot believe there is a clean rider in Italy and Spain.

TheDarkLord

Your points have some merit IF there was a testing regimen that could catch a good number of the cheaters. But the current system is built such that at least 95% of the cheaters go scot-free. On top of that some riders are prosecuted relentlessly. Hence, our speculation here is fair game. If you don't want to talk about it, you have other forums like DPF where you can blissfully put your head in the sand and pretend that there is no problem.

Eldron

I agree - the testing system is horribly flawed BUT why do most people always err on the side of guilty?

It's a bit tabloid really - "clean rider wins Tour" is pretty boring but "dirty rider with missing twin somewhere in body wins drug affected Tour" sells more papers and you're swallowing them by the dozen.

I'm certainly not doing the ostrich thing but to write off a rider as a doper on a whim just doesn't seem fair to me...

Thunder - it's obviously fair to you - you can write off two whole country's worth of cyclists with a few keystrokes. Imagine if someone decided you were guilty of stealing a stapler from work - everybody in the office decided the same. You get fired and nobody else will employ you. Is it still fair?

classic1

That is a really unfair assumption. No way does thunder have a job.

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classic1 is on the bandwagon early this year

Eldrack

I am a massive sceptic (thanks to being a member of this forum for so long) when it comes to which of the pro's are doping. I'd put a guess at 90% are doping to some degree. But in the end I enjoy watching cycling. When the race is on I forget about the doping. I enjoy watching cycling because of the tactics, the suicidal breakaways, the amazing scenery. The spectacle of the race, the sheer endurance and grit required to finish. The only way the doping can ruin the enjoyment of watching a race is for one person to be on such a good program that they wipe the floor with everyone else (Basso 2006).

But the doping does have to go. Because it is unfair on the athletes who are clean, because it is against the rules. And riders shouldn't feel compelled to dope to be successful because in the end doping is dangerous. So every time a doper gets caught and sanctioned that is a good thing. And the more money put into creating new tests the better from where I'm sitting. But doping isn't going to stop me watching the sport.

thunder

.

Andrija

I see Astana's participation as a chance to catch them red - handed.
By now, anti doping authorities should have broken Bruyneel's miraculous system.
But, if higher interest is involved, RCS might close its eyes.

Edit:
Also, I'm sure Bruyneel is aware of the fact that all eyes will be fixed upon them.

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Wayne666

I didn't go back to look, but wasn't the original comment about Kloden? There seem to be some pretty good reasons to strongly suspect him of doping much more so than just the general assumption that everyone from his generation was doping, no?

TheDarkLord

CNN has a pretty long article about Astana scrambling to prepare for the Giro: http://edition.cnn.com/2008/SPORT/0...eref=rss_latest

whiteboytrash

I take your point. However my point was your point. I was really really enjoying the racing this year. Watching most races 3 or 4 times each. What annoys me is that if Astana start racing with no previous testing & starting winning like this then we might as well all go home. And before anyone says anything the Tour of farking Turkey is not preparation.

I like Kloden; pedals like no one I've ever seen before. So smooth. However he was on the Ulle/Sink/Vino blood programme & if he is now clean & winning Romandie with zero prep well then I give up. Again Bruyneel is destroying cycling. Is this what we want ?