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07-05.-2008, 05:32 AM
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#16 |
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Re: SPD Agony!
"Artemisia" <e.roselli@free.fr> wrote in message news:8c061150-8515-47cb-934f-b0d028e4152d@d1g2000hsg.googlegroups.com... > Your experiences? Firstly, if you're having so much trouble clipping in and out, loosen the spring tension adjuster riiiiight off, it sounds way to tight. I have wide feet, and whilst I liked spuds, they caused dead toes for me after 20 or so miles (I'd used straps for years up until then). After 3 different pairs of shoes and various cleat positions, in desperation I went to the LBS who fitted me out with Look Keo's and a pair of Nike shoes (Nike don't sell bike kit anymore, sadly). I've never looked back - the shoes are comfy and after minor fiddling the position is fine and I can do 150 miles without painful feet. My only whinge about the Keo system is that the cleats and pedals wear badly, but it#s a small price to pay for comfort... Tim -- We got a thousand points of light | Greetings from Birmingham, UK For the homeless man | All about me: www.nervouscyclist.org We got a kinder, gentler, | Is your ISP pimping your data? Machine gun hand Neil Young | www.badphorm.co.uk |
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07-05.-2008, 06:43 AM
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#17 |
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Re: SPD Agony!
Artemisia wrote:
> Also, clipping and unclipping is a chore. I thought it would get > easier. But it can take me several minutes to clip and unclipping can > be even longer. Several minutes!!!!??!!!!!!!! There's something very wrong going on - either with your equipment or your technique. Have the pedal tension low, experiement more with cleat position, and keep practising. > The fact of having to press down into the core of the > pain to twist the feet off the pedals is part of it. > > Is this normal? Is it something "you just get used to"? It should never be painful to unclip. As for pain whilst cycling, you don't get used to it, and you should not perservere with it indefinitely, but it might just go away on its own. I also experienced various foot pains when I first used clipless pedals - even after I had adjusted everything as best as possible - but it did disappear after a while. Now for 99.9% of the time, my feet feel more comfortable when I am cycling than when I am walking (in any shoes). Try different cleat positions, think about whether your seat position is OK too, and give it a few more rides. If still pain, try different shoes, maybe different pedals as well. Best of luck. As well as the cleats being adjustable sideways, you will be able to rotate them. The direction they point is crucial, and you can only get it really right by trial and error. ~PB |
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07-05.-2008, 06:54 AM
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#18 |
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Re: SPD Agony!
Roger Zoul wrote:
> This problem is known as hot foot. > I think others have given you good info. > The thing about shoes (and any bike equipment for that matter) is > your never go off on a tour (where the miles increase a lot) without > having thoroughly tested the equipment under the expected > conditions (or as close as possible) - including mileage and > temperature. > Hot foot problems increase as the temps go up. > Sounds as if the shoes are ill-fitting and the cleats are not > position far enough toward your heals. > Taking some Tylenol can be a big help once the problems start. > Otherwise, you just have to stop and get the pressure off the nerves > in your feet. > Oh, the position on your feet (high relatively to your butt) on a > trike can result in circulation problems for some people. This is > typically not an issue on an upright. You may be one of those > people. Hot foot increases with age as circulation to extremities diminishes. If susceptible, making sure the foot rises (or fully unloads) the sole intermittently while pedaling to increase circulation. Jobst Brandt |
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07-05.-2008, 07:39 AM
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#19 |
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Re: SPD Agony!
On 6 May,
"Doki" <mrdoki@gmail.com> wrote: > IME wearing anything that's a) stiff soled and b) a bit on the small side > gives me a lot of pain. I reckon the shoes might be a bit small or laced up > too tight - I know my SPD shoes got a lot comfier when I laced them more > loosely. > I got new shoes recently, my previous pair was too big. Half a mile into first ride I was getting pain in one foot. Slight adjustment to the cleat cured it. I must adjust the other one slightly. Tight (well fitting) shoes are probably more critical of cleat position. It's probably worth trying slight adjustments. -- BD Change lycos to yahoo to reply |
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07-05.-2008, 07:48 AM
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#20 |
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Re: SPD Agony!
<me9@privacy.net> wrote in message news:4F9B6FE076%brian13434@lycos.co.uk... > On 6 May, > "Doki" <mrdoki@gmail.com> wrote: > >> IME wearing anything that's a) stiff soled and b) a bit on the small side >> gives me a lot of pain. I reckon the shoes might be a bit small or laced >> up >> too tight - I know my SPD shoes got a lot comfier when I laced them more >> loosely. >> > I got new shoes recently, my previous pair was too big. Half a mile into > first ride I was getting pain in one foot. Slight adjustment to the cleat > cured it. I must adjust the other one slightly. > > Tight (well fitting) shoes are probably more critical of cleat position. > It's > probably worth trying slight adjustments. I don't mean pain in particular. I mean pain combined with a bizarre feeling of slight numbness. In fact, it's more agony. |
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07-05.-2008, 08:01 AM
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#21 |
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Re: SPD Agony!
Artemisia wrote: > Also, clipping and unclipping is a chore. I thought it would get > easier. But it can take me several minutes to clip That is extremely odd. It takes less than a second for me to clip in the right foot when stationary, and a few seconds to clip in the left once moving. and unclipping can > be even longer. The fact of having to press down into the core of the > pain to twist the feet off the pedals is part of it. To unclip, you should just need to twist the foot. Again, I can unclip both feet in half a second. If you need to push the shoe down to unclip, it suggests that something on the show is catching the pedal, which also suggests the cleat is incorrectly positioned. What happens if you take the shoe off, and put it on your hand, and clip it in, and unclip it. Can you see something obviously catching. Martin. |
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07-05.-2008, 09:13 AM
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#22 |
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Re: SPD Agony!
> > To unclip, you should just need to twist the foot. Again, I can unclip > both feet in half a second. > If you need to push the shoe down to unclip, it suggests that something on > the show is catching the pedal, which also suggests the cleat is > incorrectly positioned. > > What happens if you take the shoe off, and put it on your hand, and clip > it in, and unclip it. Can you see something obviously catching. > > Martin. Another possibility is that the cleats are loose. That happened to me once. I kept twisting my foot and the cleat would turn at the same time. Also, I found by trial and error that my left foot tends to point slightly outward and the right foot wants to point straight ahead. I kept trying to make my foot point straight ahead and instead wound up with knee pain. The doc pointed out that ever since I tore my ACL I cannot expect my knee to behave as it used to. So, now, I make sure my feet point wherever they want to---and it helps that the cleats/pedals have enough "float" to let the foot move around some. |
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07-05.-2008, 10:41 AM
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#23 |
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Re: SPD Agony!
On May 6, 11:37*am, Artemisia <e.rose...@free.fr> wrote
a rather long post about foot pain that included the statements- 1- "I'm using Specialized BG Comp mountain biking shoes in the appropriate size." and 2- "Also, clipping and unclipping is a chore. I thought it would get easier. But it can take me several minutes to clip and unclipping can be even longer. The fact of having to press down into the core of the pain to twist the feet off the pedals is part of it." As for #1, based on your description of how they feel they sure don't seem to be the "appropriate" size. Buy new shoes. As for #2, have you checked your cleats for damage and adjusted the tension screws on the pedals? While some downward force might be applied, unclipping from SPDs doesn't *require* any. It's a simple twist of the foot. Regards, Bob Hunt |
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07-05.-2008, 11:48 AM
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#24 |
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Re: SPD Agony!
Mark T wrote:
> Artemisia writtificated > >> Is this normal? Is it something "you just get used to"? > > Sounds like the shoes are too small. I would divert to the nearest bike > shop that stocks shoes and buy another pair. > > Many people have to go a size up to get a shoe that fits, so it is > essential you try them on before buying. > > When wearing the shoes they should not be tight and the toes should not > touch the front of the shoe. I always get shoes where I can wiggle my toes > a little.[...] Too tight shoes are even more of a problem on a recumbent with the bottom bracket at or above seat level. I have a pair of Shimano ATB shoes which are a little narrow. These shoes are fine on the ATB and the low bottom bracket recumbent, but cause pain and a burning feeling when used on a higher bottom bracket recumbent. One alternative to clipless pedals are heel slings, but I am not aware of these being commercially available at this time - please post links if available. -- Tom Sherman - Holstein-Friesland Bovinia The weather is here, wish you were beautiful |
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07-05.-2008, 12:24 PM
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#25 |
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Re: SPD Agony!
jobst.brandt@stanfordalumni.org aka Jobst Brandt wrote:
> [...] > Hot foot increases with age as circulation to extremities diminishes. > If susceptible, making sure the foot rises (or fully unloads) the sole > intermittently while pedaling to increase circulation. A very expensive solution: <http://www.powercranks.com/products/powercranks_xlite.htm>.  -- Tom Sherman - Holstein-Friesland Bovinia The weather is here, wish you were beautiful |
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07-05.-2008, 02:32 PM
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#26 |
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Re: SPD Agony!
"Artemisia" <e.roselli@free.fr> wrote in message news:8c061150-8515-47cb-934f-b0d028e4152d@d1g2000hsg.googlegroups.com... > Two days into my trail and I discover the limit is coming from an > unexpected place - unbelievably painful feet. I'm using Specialized BG > Comp mountain biking shoes in the appropriate size. When I put them on > in the morning, they are already not comfortable shoes, stiff and > grating over the toes, but as the day wears on they turn into Chinese > torture. They sound like shoes that actually aren't the correct size but are too small. As others have suggested, an insole can help, but your shoes sound too small already... I use a Sorbothane insert on my road shoes and find it helps, but from the sound of your shoes - I doubt you'd get an insole and foot in your shoes. Plus play around with cleat position. |
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07-05.-2008, 04:20 PM
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#27 |
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Re: SPD Agony!
On May 7, 6:32*am, "wafflycat" <w*a*ff£y£cat*@£btco*nn£ect.com> wrote:
> They sound like shoes that actually aren't the correct size but are too > small. As others have suggested, an insole can help, but your shoes > sound too small already... I use a Sorbothane insert on my road shoes > and find it helps, but from the sound of your shoes - I doubt you'd get > an insole and foot in your shoes. > > Plus play around with cleat position. Hotfoot is agony when it strikes. You need to get as much ventilation to the feet as you can. The temporary solution is to remove your socks and have the shoes done up as loosely as possible. Never mind pedalling efficiency, at this point it's a question of survival, especially for a diabetic. You should be aware that you should never wear tight shoes of any kind. As Jobst says, pulling on the upstroke will relieve the constant pressure on the sole. If the shoes are grating over the toes then they are simply the wrong fit and they are no good for that rider. The long term solution which I'm surprised no-one has mentioned yet may be SPD sandals. Many long distance riders swear by them. You've really got to admire Artemisia's persistance against many setbacks, but a diabetic with severe foot pain should seriously consider abandoning the tour. -- Dave... |
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07-05.-2008, 04:33 PM
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#28 |
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Re: SPD Agony!
On May 6, 10:43*pm, "Pete Biggs"
<p...@pomegranateremovehighlyimpracticalfruitbiggs.tc> wrote: > It should never be painful to unclip. I think Artemisia's clipping/unclipping problem is that her feet have got so sensitive that she cannot press down with sufficient force to clip in. Artimisia, you do not have to press down to clip out. Just twist the foot. As for the clipping in, this will be relieved if you set the tension on your SPDs to the minimum, but if your feet are that sensitive, you are having circulation problems, and you are diabetic, is it really a good idea to carry on with the tour? Apart from the misery of being in pain you could be setting yourself up for serious long term health problems. My advise is to get these problems sorted out, then try again another time. -- Dave... |
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07-05.-2008, 04:54 PM
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#29 |
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Re: SPD Agony!
On 6 mai, 19:38, a...@chiark.greenend.org.uk (Alan Braggins) wrote:
> Most SPD shoes have two pairs of holes in a plate which can be moved > forward and back at least a little bit. I went back to the hotel room to check. After prying away all the caked mud with the multi-tool, I did indeed find two sets of holes underneath. I moved the cleats onto the lower pair. We'll see tomorrow, short ride, if that makes any difference. Specialized sell a pair of inner soles/arch supports that are supposed to mitigate foot burn. On every trip, there is always one essential thing that one omits to bring. This time, since I was already using some Scholl orthotics for my plantar fascitis, I decided that a second pair of insoles would be redundant. I'm an idiot! The Scholls are only useful for walking, and I think the BG insoles could have helped with this problem. I do have a pair of normal shoes with me. I'm afraid to use them on the trike. I'm finding this is quite a hassle, having shoes that can only walk but not bike, and other shoes that can only bike and not walk! EFR After a wonderful dinner on Isle sur Sorgue |
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07-05.-2008, 04:54 PM
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#30 |
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Re: SPD Agony!
Artemisia wrote:
> Two days into my trail and I discover the limit is coming from an > unexpected place - unbelievably painful feet. I'm using Specialized BG > Comp mountain biking shoes in the appropriate size. But are they an appropriate shape? Different manufacturers use different lasts and all are slightly different shapes, to account for the variation of human feet. You need to try as many different shoes as you can to ensure that you have shoes built on a last that corresponds to your own feet. Also different sizes mean slightly different things to different manufacturers, sometimes even to the same manufacturer on different lines: I take a 10 in leather Teva sandals, a 9 in plastic Teva sandals. My fell shoes are 2E 8.5 New Balance, same as road shoes from the same make, but the fell shoes are tighter on me. And so on. > iWhen I put them on > in the morning, they are already not comfortable shoes, stiff and > grating over the toes What makes you think these are an appropriate size (or shape) if they're grating your toes before you get on the bike? The stiffness is actually an aid to pedalling once you're on the bike, but there should be no grating of your toes. > , but as the day wears on they turn into Chinese > torture. This is on a recumbent tadpole trike where the use of SPDs is > required as a safety measure (to prevent running over one's own leg, > which I nearly did the other day). Well... no, not "required". You wouldn't have to go too far to find someone using one with normal pedals, though personally I would /recommend/ them. > I tried putting a wad of kleenex between the lining of the shoe and > the SPD clip. That improved matters slightly, but I still cannot go > more than about 10km without the most agonizing pain. And the pain > lasts for about half an hour even after I have taken the shoes off. As others have suggested, it sounds like the cleat is in the wrong place. You should be able to move it by loosening the cleats and sliding the mounting plate inside the shoe. Take the insole out to do that more easily. > Also, clipping and unclipping is a chore. I thought it would get > easier. But it can take me several minutes to clip and unclipping can > be even longer. The fact of having to press down into the core of the > pain to twist the feet off the pedals is part of it. This reinforces the suspicion that the cleat is in the wrong place. It should be a second or two at most to get either in or out. Time ATAC pedals are, IME, slightly easier to get into as you engage along a line rather than at a point, but there's not that much in it. > Is this normal? Is it something "you just get used to"? No. Cycling shoes are not overly comfortable to walk in, but they should be comfortable to pedal in or to stand in. Yours aren't even comfortable to stand in, so I suspect you bought the wrong thing for you. Also, it sounds like the cleat is in the wrong place, and this needs a bit of fiddling to get right. By "a bit of fiddling" I mean 10 minutes trial and error on and off the bike, nudging them about until they feel right. Start with the cleat as far back as it will go and gradually push them forward, lock them at the right position. Another piece of advice, do running-in trials of new kit close to home, by which I mean round your block a few times. Pete. -- Peter Clinch Medical Physics IT Officer Tel 44 1382 660111 ext. 33637 Univ. of Dundee, Ninewells Hospital Fax 44 1382 640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK net p.j.clinch@dundee.ac.uk http://www.dundee.ac.uk/~pjclinch/ |
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