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20-07.-2004, 07:49 PM
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#31 | |
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Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Spain
Posts: 223
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Re: 1970-2004
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What do yo mean by saying: "Just like Indurain he was pepaired medically". |
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20-07.-2004, 10:23 PM
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#32 | |
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Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Anchorage, Alaska, USA
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Re: 1970-2004
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It's called cycling your training mileage and peak performance. In swimming, it is typically called a "taper". How do you know he didn't have cancer already during the Tour of Flanders but that it had not yet been diagnosed? |
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22-07.-2004, 05:57 AM
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#33 | |
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Registered User
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Big square state next to NJ
Posts: 231
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Re: Another poll: best TdF climber
Quote:
i would have thought impe or pantanni...but lance today owned everyone... it was hard to belive those turns were even uphill!
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-2003 Airborne Valk-17.5lbs Raced -1999 Fisher Mt. Tam- 28.5 lbs Punished -1999 Trek Y22-24.5 lbs Newly Pampered |
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23-07.-2004, 05:21 AM
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#34 |
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Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Anchorage, Alaska, USA
Posts: 1,672
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Re: Another poll: best TdF climber
Lance is now the only rider in the history of the Tour de France to win 4 mountain stages in a row.
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23-07.-2004, 07:05 PM
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#35 |
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Registered User
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Flanders
Posts: 24
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Re: 1970-2004
Lance is not riding pure. The accusations made by Lemond is what I have been saying for years now. He can only win in july, in june he loses two minutes on Mayo in TT Dauphiné. Hinault, Marckx, Fignon were sweating while climbing, they were breathing very hard, you could se they were in pain. Armstrong doesn(t seem to breath, is never sweating and he almost laughs while climbing. i sure hope that this will be proved in the near future, especially for all the others riders who tried to follow this ghost. I really think it's a shame to abuse cancer for this.
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23-07.-2004, 09:10 PM
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#36 | |
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Community Team
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: at the bar
Posts: 12,477
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Re: 1970-2004
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I was at Alpe D'Huez and Guzet Neige in 1995. Pantani won both stages and was blasting. I was there to see Miguel Indurain : on both days, he was blasting but he was breathing heavily which is normal. he was breathing so heavily, that you could see his torso expand and contradict like a bellows as he was climbing both climbs. His mouth was wide open and his rib cage flexing was clearly visible. I have seen none of this with Armstrong isnce his return in 1999. |
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23-07.-2004, 10:52 PM
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#37 | |
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Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Spain
Posts: 223
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Re: 1970-2004
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What are you traying to tell us? |
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24-07.-2004, 09:25 PM
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#38 | |
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Registered User
Join Date: Jun 2004
Posts: 17
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Re: 1970-2004
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I'm a beginner to biking, so I don't know much about bike racing, but I have a some experience with competitive cross country and track running. If someone looks like they're struggling a lot during a foot race, then you know that they're in trouble. I think the same is probably true in cycling. If you're huffing, puffing, and wheezing, and moving your body around a lot, you're wasting a lot of energy, and probably not breathing as economically as you could be. Well, that's what my short experience as a bike rider has told me. Also, it seems like he sweats just as much as everyone else to me. It seems like you've already made up your decision, and that could lead you to see what you want to see, but maybe I'm doing the same. I don't deny that it's possible for him to be doping, I just hope he's not. |
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25-07.-2004, 04:59 AM
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#39 |
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Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Anchorage, Alaska, USA
Posts: 1,672
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KOM does not equal best climber.
The best climber in this year's Tour de France is not the KOM winner. As Van Impe commented, the best climber in this year's Tour is Lance Armstrong, not Richard Virenque.
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03-08.-2004, 05:21 AM
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#40 | |
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Registered User
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 228
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Re: KOM does not equal best climber.
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I agree (who can't?) that Lance can climb a mountain fastest ofthem all, but Virenque makes the list because of those 7 (!) polka dots. Those who say Lance doesn't belong on the list should also take a reality pill, as he is the only one of the big TdF winners who depends mostly on climbing. All others (Anquetil, Indurain, Hinault, Lemond,) revolved their GC around their phenomenal TT. And that is not because I am a Lance fan (I am not, I prefer JU by far) Altough I might have missed a few greats, I believe the only ones on this list who might be undeserving are Herrera and Pantani (and that is a might be) as in the end their palmares are not big enough. That said, there should be room for the first Colombian KOM and the phenomenal climbing animal Pantani.
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08-08.-2004, 03:22 PM
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#41 | |
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Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Anchorage, Alaska, USA
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Re: KOM does not equal best climber.
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I used to love to watch Pantani in action. He was amazing. Lance climbs fast like he did, but Pantani made it look absolutely amazing. I'm not sure why. |
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08-08.-2004, 04:00 PM
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#42 | |
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Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 72
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Re: KOM does not equal best climber.
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I can't go back to video to prove it, but I seem to remember Pantani really swinging the bike back and forth a lot more than Armstrong, and really dancing on the pedals when he climbed. Armstrong seems a bit more straight ahead in my mind. Not sure how accurate that is, but that's how I remember it. |
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21-08.-2004, 09:37 AM
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#43 |
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Registered User
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 259
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Re: Another poll: best TdF climber
Pantani deserves to be on the list for still holding the fastest ascent of The Alpe.Lance's climbing ability is there for all to see.
Virenque is a charade. My vote would go to one of the old guys who climbed on bikes weighing a damn sight more than they do today and when the Tour was overall much more brutal. They really were the Kings of Pain in those days (no super-duper synthetic drugs to take then either) |
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21-08.-2004, 08:46 PM
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#44 |
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Registered User
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 333
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Re: Another poll: best TdF climber
well you certainly have great climbers on the list. But the best must be Pantani. Did no one notice that he has times on the climb of the Alpe de Huez that are records. These times at the end of 190 km stages hold up even this year, where in a chrono climb of just the mountain could not produce a time better. Begs the question if the stage was designed especially to remove him from the record books? Class is class. Certainly the record will fall one day as they all do. Better training, nutritional discoveries, science discoveries, bicycle improvements, not to mention doping.
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21-08.-2004, 09:25 PM
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#45 | |
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Registered User
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 333
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Re: 1970-2004
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Perhaps you did not notice the autopsy results of Pantani and the comments of a Doctor Fortuni (I believe that was his name) that he declared that he had expected to see a damaged bone marrow because of all the reports and accusations of abuse by the climber. Yet to his suprise the bone marrrow was completely normal. When pressed further he states that use of EPO for any extended period will leave definite irreversible traces, of which there are none. This report was not released by the major papers in Italy because of the scandal of self reflection it would cause. Pantani was destroyed because sport is secondary to betting in italy. It is the most scandalous of situations. You can see it over the years with soccer game fixing, that continue to this day. In 1999 Pantani was 10 times better than 1998 when they stopped his giro. A giro that was all but in the bag. It was the first time betting was allowed on the giro di italia. Everyone was betting on Pantani, the betting mafia gained 500 million todays euro by falsifying test results. And since Pantani did not roll over like a good boy and continued to proclaim his innocence he was subsequently destroyed in the papers, and a continuous barage of suspensions, accusations, and pending tribunals that were all farces. Testimonies have leaked out that the cyclists knew something was up the evening before the supposed failed hematocrit (blood density test) reporters were calling the Mercatone team to ask if it was true that Pantani would not start the next day? Testimonies have leaked that in the jails they knew about the betting and the impending suspension of the maglia rosa. An army of reporters had assembled at that hotel the next day to be there at the release of the results (they already knew of course the results) Cycling will never know what would have happened with Pantani against Armstrong in 1999 and subsequently. And fans were certainly was cheated of a great rivalry that we got only a taste of in 2000 TdF, with an already battered, depressed, but defiant Pantani |
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