Total newbie saying hi and asking for help

Gouge Away wrote:
> Hi, folks...
> I > To stop beating around the bush, I have a few questions and would appreciate any advice. For
> one, what kind of discount can I expect from a bike shop? Would a customer typically ask to
> swap components (ie bike seat, shocks)? Also, are there any components on the bike that you
> would change? I intend to use it mainly for flying around the city, but I want the option to
> hit any trail any time I want. Is the Giant Rainier a good choice? Any information would, once
> again, be greatly appreciated. Thanks, G

In my exoperience the only time you should ask for a deal is when something has been around for a
while and they want to get rid of it. I'd expect things like stem to be swapped out for fit, but not
sure about saddle, certainly not a shock.

as for the phat aspect of things.. I'm a skinny little thing, ask JG.

Penny

"Gouge Away" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Would a customer typically ask to swap components (ie bike seat, shocks)?

People often do. You pay to upgrade the components (like the fork), but a different length stem swap
is often free.

If you haven't been riding, you might want to ride for awhile before changing saddles. Toughen up
your self a little, and also make sure you've got the fit, tilt, etc dialed in. If it isn't
comfortable after a few weeks, change it.

David

"Gouge Away" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
| Hi, folks... I normally lurk for a few days in a newsgroup to learn its etiquette
before
| I would consider posting, but under my anxious circumstances, I hope
you'll
| endure me. I haven't mountain-biked in many years, but I have been presented with an opportunity
| to get one. Needless to say, I am quite excited. I was looking for a mountain bike in the
| $1000-1500 range (I live in
Canada)
| and found through research that the Giant Rainier is a bike that maximized bang for its buck.

Emphatically yes.

| I test drove one today at a local bike shop ( I like to support the indies), and it seems great. I
| found the racing seat to be uncomfortable, as I am 32 years old, 6-foot-3 and more than
| 200lbs..(we'll leave it at that ...).

The best advice I can offer about seats is to try them. Don't be lulled into the notion you have to
buy a wide, cushy saddle to be comfortable. At first, you're likely going to hurt. Take it from me,
I'm somewhat heavier than you and I began this hobby riding wide, springy cruiser saddles,
graduating to smaller and smaller seats until I now ride on narrow leather saddles like Selle Italia
Pro-Link and Fizik Nisene. I'm definitely not saying that these specific seats will work for you,
you have to try them and find what works.

| That would be my only complaint, other than reviews I have read on the net that have said the
| front shocks are a bit soft,
but,
| being a novice, I don't have a problem learning with them and upgrading later. Here's the bike:
|
http://www.giant-bicycles.com/cn/030.000.000/030.000.000.asp?lYear=2003&bike
| section=8797&range=96&model=9854
|
| Anyway, the bikes seem to vary only by $20-30 from shop to shop, and I
have
| chosen a shop that the salesman has been personable and better yet, has indicated flexibility in
| the price, unlike some of the other shops I have asked. They are asking $1175. To stop beating
| around the bush, I have a few questions and would
appreciate
| any advice. For one, what kind of discount can I expect from a bike shop? Would a customer
| typically ask to swap components (ie bike seat, shocks)?

Sometimes, if it's an even or close swap type thing to make it fit you properly. Expect more of
an upcharge.

Bike shops don't make a very large margin on the bikes themselves. Don't go begging for deep
discounts on gear, though a modest (like 10%) reduction sometimes comes with the purchase. That is
where they make the money that puts food on the table and pays the rent.

| Also, are there any components on the bike that you would change? I intend to use it mainly for
| flying around the city, but I want the option to hit any trail any time I want. Is the Giant
| Rainier a good choice? Any information would, once again, be greatly appreciated.

Unless they have recently upgraded, there is one glaringly bad part on the Ranier. The cranks. They
are some "house brand" generic Taiwanese junk that had to be the flexiest thing I've ever seen. It
was worse a couple years ago. Yank that puppy off and put a Shimano Deore or better unit on
it. That may cause an up-charge on the bike, but it will be worth it. The Deore crank represents
some serious bang-for-buck.

---
__o _`\(,_ Cycling is life, (_)/ (_) all the rest, just details. Nelson Binch =^o.o^=
http://intergalax.com

Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.480 / Virus Database: 276 -
Release Date: 5/12/2003

"Gouge Away" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:<[email protected]>...
> Hi, folks... I normally lurk for a few days in a newsgroup to learn its etiquette before I would
> consider posting, but under my anxious circumstances, I hope you'll endure me. I haven't
> mountain-biked in many years, but I have been presented with an opportunity to get one. Needless
> to say, I am quite excited. I was looking for a mountain bike in the $1000-1500 range (I live in
> Canada) and found through research that the Giant Rainier is a bike that maximized bang for its
> buck. I test drove one today at a local bike shop ( I like to support the indies), and it seems
> great. I found the racing seat to be uncomfortable, as I am 32 years old, 6-foot-3 and more than
> 200lbs..(we'll leave it at that ...). That would be my only complaint, other than reviews I have
> read on the net that have said the front shocks are a bit soft, but, being a novice, I don't have
> a problem learning with them and upgrading later. Here's the bike:
> http://www.giant-bicycles.com/cn/030.000.000/030.000.000.asp?lYear=2003&bike
> section=8797&range=96&model=9854
>
> Anyway, the bikes seem to vary only by $20-30 from shop to shop, and I have chosen a shop that the
> salesman has been personable and better yet, has indicated flexibility in the price, unlike some
> of the other shops I have asked. They are asking $1175. To stop beating around the bush, I have a
> few questions and would appreciate any advice. For one, what kind of discount can I expect from a
> bike shop? Would a customer typically ask to swap components (ie bike seat, shocks)? Also, are
> there any components on the bike that you would change? I intend to use it mainly for flying
> around the city, but I want the option to hit any trail any time I want. Is the Giant Rainier a
> good choice? Any information would, once again, be greatly appreciated. Thanks, G

It's a solid bike you'll probably love. Good advice on cranks. XT, LX, or even Deore. Not too
expensive to get something good. Re discounts, don't expect much dicker room, but they may slime the
tires, throw in a few water bottles, and X% off your purchase of gloves, shorts, hydrapak, jersey,
etc. And DO take advantage of the free tune-ups and safety checks, etc., that are usually offered
for a year after purchase. I'd bring it back in after your first ride to make sure nothing's come
loose, broke, etc.

Then ride it. ride it some more. ride it with people better than you. Ride it till your a$$ hurts so
bad you're tempted to get a big springy saddle. But a couple days off and you'll be ready to ride
some more.

Paladin

"Gouge Away" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Hi, folks...

> I was looking for a mountain bike in the $1000-1500 range (I live in
Canada)
> and found through research that the Giant Rainier is a bike that maximized bang for its buck....

Very good advice given so far; but I wanted to add my $.02 USD on a couple of things:

> I found the racing seat to be uncomfortable, as I am 32 years old, 6-foot-3 and more than 200lbs

With saddles, experimentation is required. Everybody likes something different. There is no
universally accepted "best saddle." For some guys, the prostate relief offered by saddles with holes
and channels cut in them is just what the doctor ordered (literally). For others, a harder saddle
will ultimately be a better choice. I have been searching for the best saddle for well over a
decade, having owned dozens of different types. Here is a short list of what I think are potentially
good saddles for you to try:

Wide and very comfy:
---------------------------
Velo Plush (stock on many bikes, sold under many brand names) WTB SST (many different models of the
SST) Bontrager FS+10 (out of production, worth searching for)

Narrow, superlight, and surprisingly comfy:
----------------------------------------
Selle Italia Flite (not the Gel version, the original)

Any of these saddles can be purchased (used) on Ebay or elsewhere for $20 to $40. If you find any
FS+10's, email me! I'm looking for more of 'em.

No matter what saddle you end up with, you should get a RockShox suspension seatpost. PricePoint.com
has them for $45 for the 27.2mm, which can be shimmed to any size (shims are $8). Installation is
super easy (grease the post and shim before installation). Your butt will thank you every time you
ride, and offroad riding will be *much* more comfortable while seated. This will also let you ride a
harder saddle.

You should *definitely* buy some good-quality cycling shorts. I advise against the "gel" shorts. Go
for a mid to high-end pair like Bellwether or Pearl Izumi, because they wear like iron. Spend $70 to
$100 CAN on the shorts. You'll be glad you did. Believe it or not, thick padding isn't always good.

> I have read on the net that ...the front shocks are a bit soft, but, being a novice, I don't have
> a problem learning with them and upgrading later.

I test rode a 2003 Giant Rainier, and I agree with you: The shocks do seem a little soft. I didn't
really like them very much. They may just need to have a stiffer spring installed. Ask the shop how
much this will cost.

Shocks are an easy upgrade; but be aware that replacement shocks are *very* expensive. If you buy
them new, expect to pay $300 CAN at a minimum for decent, tunable, durable shocks (Marzocchi EXR,
for instance).

Personally, I prefer Manitou shocks. For cross-country trail riding, I've found nothing better; and
they're well-damped for street riding too - not constantly boinging up and down.

> Anyway, the bikes seem to vary only by $20-30 from shop to shop, and I
have
> chosen a shop that the salesman has been personable and better yet, has indicated flexibility in
> the price, unlike some of the other shops I have asked. They are asking $1175.

Take whatever they offer you, don't beat them up on price. Foster a relationship of respect with the
shopowner(s), and you will be rewarded over and over again with great service.

> To stop beating around the bush, I have a few questions and would
appreciate
> any advice. For one, what kind of discount can I expect from a bike shop?

Very small. They might throw in some accessories to keep you from buying the bike at another shop;
but don't expect much. Maybe a deep discount on shorts or the RockShox seatpost would be a
bargaining point.

> Would a customer typically ask to swap components (ie bike seat, shocks)? Also, are there any
> components on the bike that you would change?

Yes, but expect substantial upcharges. I agree about the Shimano Deore cranks swap/upgrade. Shifting
will be better, for one thing.

> I intend to use it mainly for flying around the city, but I want the option to hit any trail any
> time I want. Is the Giant Rainier a good choice?

Yes, I think it's a fine choice. Honestly, I think the disc brakes are too much. They're not
necessary, and they add a *lot* of weight to the bike (at least 1.5kg or 3+ pounds). If you
plan to ride in sloppy weather, lots of mud, snow, etc then go for disc brakes. If you're
primarily a fair-weather rider, look at another bike with V-brakes, lighter wheels, better
components for the $$.

The lower-end Kona hardtails look like excellent bikes. I regret having sold my Voodoo Bizango
(identical to the Kona design) as it was just about the perfect mountain hardtail. If there's a Kona
dealer in your area, try some of their bikes before you decide. Try as many different bikes from
different brands as you can, because they are all different. My personal preference is for the
lightest bike with the best hubs, cranks and derailleurs for a given price range. This means
V-brakes, not disc brakes. Giant's Iguana looks like another great value, FWIW. Also know that disc
brakes are something you can add later (if your frame has disc mounts, which most do nowadays).

Ride a bunch of bikes, let yourself buy the one that feels the best. Everything is
upgradeable/swappable, and you can always sell the bike and buy another one later if you make a
wrong decision.

Enjoy your new bike!

Barry

Are the stock Taiwanese cranks are ISIS splined? If so, keep in mind that swapping them to
LX/XT/Shimano will require a new (Shimano) bottom bracket too. That'll add a few more $$$cdn.

If they're still using square tapered...then nevermind.

-gary

> Good advice on cranks. XT, LX, or even Deore. Not too expensive to get something good.

"Nelson Binch" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
> "Gouge Away" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
> | Hi, folks... I normally lurk for a few days in a newsgroup to learn its etiquette
> before
> | I would consider posting, but under my anxious circumstances, I hope
> you'll
> | endure me. I haven't mountain-biked in many years, but I have been presented with
an
> | opportunity to get one. Needless to say, I am quite excited. I was looking for a mountain bike
> | in the $1000-1500 range (I live in
> Canada)
> | and found through research that the Giant Rainier is a bike that
maximized
> | bang for its buck.
>
> Emphatically yes.
>
> | I test drove one today at a local bike shop ( I like to support the indies), and it seems great.
> | I found the racing seat to be uncomfortable, as I am 32 years old, 6-foot-3 and more than
200lbs..(we'll
> | leave it at that ...).
>
> The best advice I can offer about seats is to try them. Don't be lulled into the notion you have
> to buy a wide, cushy saddle to be comfortable.
At
> first, you're likely going to hurt. Take it from me, I'm somewhat heavier than you and I began
> this hobby riding wide, springy cruiser saddles, graduating to smaller and smaller seats until I
> now ride on narrow leather saddles like Selle Italia Pro-Link and Fizik Nisene. I'm definitely not
> saying that these specific seats will work for you, you have to try them
and
> find what works.
>
> | That would be my only complaint, other than reviews I have read on the net that have said the
> | front shocks are a bit soft,
> but,
> | being a novice, I don't have a problem learning with them and upgrading later. Here's the bike:
> |
>
http://www.giant-bicycles.com/cn/030.000.000/030.000.000.asp?lYear=2003&bike
> | section=8797&range=96&model=9854
> |
> | Anyway, the bikes seem to vary only by $20-30 from shop to shop, and I
> have
> | chosen a shop that the salesman has been personable and better yet, has indicated flexibility in
> | the price, unlike some of the other shops I
have
> | asked. They are asking $1175. To stop beating around the bush, I have a few questions and would
> appreciate
> | any advice. For one, what kind of discount can I expect from a bike
shop?
> | Would a customer typically ask to swap components (ie bike seat,
shocks)?
>
> Sometimes, if it's an even or close swap type thing to make it fit you properly. Expect more of an
> upcharge.
>
> Bike shops don't make a very large margin on the bikes themselves. Don't
go
> begging for deep discounts on gear, though a modest (like 10%) reduction sometimes comes with the
> purchase. That is where they make the money that puts food on the table and pays the rent.
>
> | Also, are there any components on the bike that you would change? I
intend
> | to use it mainly for flying around the city, but I want the option to
hit
> | any trail any time I want. Is the Giant Rainier a good choice? Any information would, once
> | again, be greatly appreciated.
>
> Unless they have recently upgraded, there is one glaringly bad part on the Ranier. The
> cranks. They are some "house brand" generic Taiwanese junk that had to be the flexiest thing
> I've ever seen. It was worse a couple years ago. Yank that puppy off and put a Shimano Deore
> or better unit on
> it. That may cause an up-charge on the bike, but it will be worth it.
The
> Deore crank represents some serious bang-for-buck.
>
>
> ---
> __o _`\(,_ Cycling is life, (_)/ (_) all the rest, just details. Nelson Binch =^o.o^=
> http://intergalax.com
>
> Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.480 / Virus Database: 276
> - Release Date: 5/12/2003

And don't forget to ask about free tune-ups. My last one came with a year's worth.

"B. Sanders" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:HK4wa.823943$3D1.472110@sccrnsc01...

> Yes, I think it's a fine choice. Honestly, I think the disc brakes are
too
> much. They're not necessary, and they add a *lot* of weight to the bike
(at
> least 1.5kg or 3+ pounds).

Closer to one pound isn't it?

I have a similar Marzocchi fork on one of my bikes (EXR-ECC). It is an excellent fork for the money.
It is also reasonably stiff and will not deflect to the side very much when you ride it hard. Other
forks I have ridden make me nervous because I am not sure if the wheel will track straight or bend
to the side. As to being too soft along the axis of travel, this happens when the air pressure goes
down. You will have to add air on occasion. I am not much lighter than you (85kg, ~190lb) and it
works well for me.

If you ride up long hills or you find yourself getting out of the saddle and hammering hard a lot,
you may want to thing about upgrading it with an ECC cartridge. This is a gizmo that Marzocchi uses
to "lock out" the fork. You throw a little lever and your fork goes stiff.

I advise riding the cranks before changing them. A new rider is probably not too harsh on the bike,
so it may be some time before flex becomes an issue.

-Dave

Oh and welcome.

"David" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
> "Gouge Away" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> > Would a customer typically ask to swap components (ie bike seat,
shocks)?
>
> People often do. You pay to upgrade the components (like the fork), but a
different
> length stem swap is often free.
>
> If you haven't been riding, you might want to ride for awhile before
changing saddles.
> Toughen up your self a little, and also make sure you've got the fit,
tilt, etc dialed in.
> If it isn't comfortable after a few weeks, change it.
>
> David

Good advice that I'm hearing from a lot of people. Thanks, that's what I'm doing.

"Nelson Binch" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...

>
> The best advice I can offer about seats is to try them. Don't be lulled into the notion you have
> to buy a wide, cushy saddle to be comfortable.
At
> first, you're likely going to hurt. Take it from me, I'm somewhat heavier than you and I began
> this hobby riding wide, springy cruiser saddles, graduating to smaller and smaller seats until I
> now ride on narrow leather saddles like Selle Italia Pro-Link and Fizik Nisene. I'm definitely not
> saying that these specific seats will work for you, you have to try them
and
> find what works.
>

Much advice is telling me to endure the pain, as the bike is equipped with a pretty nice saddle, and
that I'll get used to it. Buddy at the shop also suggested bringing the seat back after a couple of
weeks if I didn't like
it. So I'll go with that plan.

> Bike shops don't make a very large margin on the bikes themselves. Don't
go
> begging for deep discounts on gear, though a modest (like 10%) reduction sometimes comes with the
> purchase. That is where they make the money that puts food on the table and pays the rent.

Good advice that I'm heeding, thanks. After all my swapping and adding components, it ended up being
$1535.25, after taxes. He knocked it down to $1400, and I'm happy with that. My problem now is that
He Who Pays For Purchase was happier when the bike was $1200. A friend of mine who works at a bike
shop called me today and told me to come in tomorrow with the quote and he could try to do better. I
feel guilty that I have led the other bike shop to believe I would be purchasing from them, but
being the greedy s##t I am, I have to try to maximize on this purchase. If my friend can get me the
bike I want at the price the purchaser wants, I have to go that route. I will have to go to the
other bike shop and apologize for wasting their time if that is the case, and perhaps offer future
business... sorry, I'm rambling.

>
> | Also, are there any components on the bike that you would change? I
intend
> | to use it mainly for flying around the city, but I want the option to
hit
> | any trail any time I want. Is the Giant Rainier a good choice? Any information would, once
> | again, be greatly appreciated.
>
> Unless they have recently upgraded, there is one glaringly bad part on the Ranier. The
> cranks. They are some "house brand" generic Taiwanese junk that had to be the flexiest thing
> I've ever seen. It was worse a couple years ago. Yank that puppy off and put a Shimano Deore
> or better unit on
> it. That may cause an up-charge on the bike, but it will be worth it.
The
> Deore crank represents some serious bang-for-buck.
>

Checked it today, she's a Deore. Thanks for making me double-check!

"Paladin" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...

>
> It's a solid bike you'll probably love. Good advice on cranks. XT, LX, or even Deore. Not too
> expensive to get something good. Re discounts, don't expect much dicker room, but they may slime
> the tires, throw in a few water bottles, and X% off your purchase of gloves, shorts, hydrapak,
> jersey, etc. And DO take advantage of the free tune-ups and safety checks, etc., that are usually
> offered for a year after purchase. I'd bring it back in after your first ride to make sure
> nothing's come loose, broke, etc.
>

Yay, they're Deore. And they offer the tuneups.

> Then ride it. ride it some more. ride it with people better than you. Ride it till your a$$ hurts
> so bad you're tempted to get a big springy saddle. But a couple days off and you'll be ready to
> ride some more.
>
> Paladin

I have been told. Thanks! G

"Dave Stocker" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
> I have a similar Marzocchi fork on one of my bikes (EXR-ECC). It is an excellent fork for the
> money. It is also reasonably stiff and will not deflect to the side very much when you ride it
> hard. Other forks I have ridden make me nervous because I am not sure if the wheel will track
> straight or bend to the side. As to being too soft along the axis of travel, this happens when the
> air pressure goes down. You will have to
add
> air on occasion. I am not much lighter than you (85kg, ~190lb) and it
works
> well for me.
>
> If you ride up long hills or you find yourself getting out of the saddle
and
> hammering hard a lot, you may want to thing about upgrading it with an ECC cartridge. This is a
> gizmo that Marzocchi uses to "lock out" the fork.
You
> throw a little lever and your fork goes stiff.

Cool. I'll definitely research that. I never knew it existed!

>
> I advise riding the cranks before changing them. A new rider is probably not too harsh on the
> bike, so it may be some time before flex becomes an issue.
>
Agreed. I'm happy with the Deore on it.

Thanks, G

> -Dave

"Dave Stocker" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
> Oh and welcome.
>
>

Thank you very much. Everybody has been extraordinarily helpful. Great meeting you all! G

James Messick wrote:

>>Yes, I think it's a fine choice. Honestly, I think the disc brakes are
>
> too
>
>>much. They're not necessary, and they add a *lot* of weight to the bike
>
> (at
>
>>least 1.5kg or 3+ pounds).
>
>
> Closer to one pound isn't it?

Nope. 1lb = 454g, so 1.5kg would be 3+ lbs.

--
a.m-b FAQ: http://www.t-online.de/~jharris/ambfaq.htm

b.bmx FAQ: http://www.t-online.de/~jharris/bmx_faq.htm

Gouge Away wrote:
> Good advice that I'm heeding, thanks. After all my swapping and adding components, it ended up
> being $1535.25, after taxes. He knocked it down to $1400, and I'm happy with that. My problem now
> is that He Who Pays For Purchase was happier when the bike was $1200. A friend of mine who works
> at a bike shop called me today and told me to come in tomorrow with the quote and he could try to
> do better. I feel guilty that I have led the other bike shop to believe I would be purchasing from
> them, but being the greedy s##t I am, I have to try to maximize on this purchase. If my friend can
> get me the bike I want at the price the purchaser wants, I have to go that route. I will have to
> go to the other bike shop and apologize for wasting their time if that is the case, and perhaps
> offer future business... sorry, I'm rambling.
>

I sure hope that shop #1 isn't ordering something in for you. Personally I think that's a lousy way
to treat a shop that you may want to have a relationship with in the future. Price while a very
important factor is not everything. The least you can do is take them a box of bakery goods and buy
some decent accessories there.

Penny

"Gouge Away" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
> "David" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
> >
> > "Gouge Away" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
> > > Would a customer typically ask to swap components (ie bike seat,
> shocks)?
> >
> > People often do. You pay to upgrade the components (like the fork), but
a
> different
> > length stem swap is often free.
> >
> > If you haven't been riding, you might want to ride for awhile before
> changing saddles.
> > Toughen up your self a little, and also make sure you've got the fit,
> tilt, etc dialed in.
> > If it isn't comfortable after a few weeks, change it.

And make sure you have a pair of well-padded shorts. Makes a world of difference, as I am
learning...

determined

"Penny S." <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
> Gouge Away wrote:
> > Good advice that I'm heeding, thanks. After all my swapping and adding components, it ended up
> > being $1535.25, after taxes. He knocked it down to $1400, and I'm happy with that. My problem
> > now is that He Who Pays For Purchase was happier when the bike was $1200. A friend of mine who
> > works at a bike shop called me today and told me to come in tomorrow with the quote and he could
> > try to do better. I feel guilty that I have led the other bike shop to believe I would be
> > purchasing from them, but being the greedy s##t I am, I have to try to maximize on this
> > purchase. If my friend can get me the bike I want at the price the purchaser wants, I have to go
> > that route. I will have to go to the other bike shop and apologize for wasting their time if
> > that is the case, and perhaps offer future business... sorry, I'm rambling.
> >
>
> I sure hope that shop #1 isn't ordering something in for you. Personally I think that's a lousy
> way to treat a shop that you may want to have a relationship with in the future. Price while a
> very important factor is
not
> everything. The least you can do is take them a box of bakery goods and
buy
> some decent accessories there.
>
> Penny
>
>
Yeah, I agree. That weighed on my consciousness for quite a few days. Strange that it would,
seeing as I sell cars for a living and people do that to me all the time. However, I have decided
to buy the bike from them after all, so everybody is happy. I liked the baked goods suggestion,
though. Cheers, G