Tire Boot Patches



J

John Everett

Guest
Over the weekend my girlfriend had a flat with one of her practically
new Conti GatorSkins. Turns out it looks like a glass cut about 3/8"
long right in the middle of the tread. We applied a regular tube patch
to the inside of the tire, which got us home; but the tire still
bulged at the cut site.

I remember when one used to be able to buy casing patches, the last
ones I got were from The Third Hand/Loose Screws many years ago. I
haven't seen them since.

Have these been discontinued? Has the market decided they would rather
sell us new tires instead of providing a method of repair?


jeverett3<AT>earthlink<DOT>net http://home.earthlink.net/~jeverett3
 
On Tue, 09 Nov 2004 20:20:32 GMT, John Everett
<[email protected]> wrote:

>Over the weekend my girlfriend had a flat with one of her practically
>new Conti GatorSkins. Turns out it looks like a glass cut about 3/8"
>long right in the middle of the tread. We applied a regular tube patch
>to the inside of the tire, which got us home; but the tire still
>bulged at the cut site.
>
>I remember when one used to be able to buy casing patches, the last
>ones I got were from The Third Hand/Loose Screws many years ago. I
>haven't seen them since.
>
>Have these been discontinued? Has the market decided they would rather
>sell us new tires instead of providing a method of repair?
>
>
>jeverett3<AT>earthlink<DOT>net http://home.earthlink.net/~jeverett3


Dear John,

Park makes tire boots, which may be what you want:

http://www.performancebike.com/shop/profile.cfm?SKU=2527

Carl Fogel
 
John Everett wrote:
> Over the weekend my girlfriend had a flat with one of her practically
> new Conti GatorSkins. Turns out it looks like a glass cut about 3/8"
> long right in the middle of the tread. We applied a regular tube patch
> to the inside of the tire, which got us home; but the tire still
> bulged at the cut site.
>
> I remember when one used to be able to buy casing patches, the last
> ones I got were from The Third Hand/Loose Screws many years ago. I
> haven't seen them since.
>
> Have these been discontinued? Has the market decided they would rather
> sell us new tires instead of providing a method of repair?


Google around for this, John: http://www.parktool.com/tools/TB_1.shtml.

You can find them at most LBS's or order them online.

Also, the empty wrapper from a Cliff Bar (or equivalent) is reported to work
well.
 
John Everett wrote:

> Over the weekend my girlfriend had a flat with one of her practically
> new Conti GatorSkins. Turns out it looks like a glass cut about 3/8"
> long right in the middle of the tread. We applied a regular tube patch
> to the inside of the tire, which got us home; but the tire still
> bulged at the cut site.
>
> I remember when one used to be able to buy casing patches, the last
> ones I got were from The Third Hand/Loose Screws many years ago. I
> haven't seen them since.
>
> Have these been discontinued? Has the market decided they would rather
> sell us new tires instead of providing a method of repair?


Buy a new tyre. There are boots available but they are strictly a
get-you-home measure.
 
John Everett wrote:
> Over the weekend my girlfriend had a flat with one of her practically
> new Conti GatorSkins. Turns out it looks like a glass cut about 3/8"
> long right in the middle of the tread. We applied a regular tube patch
> to the inside of the tire, which got us home; but the tire still
> bulged at the cut site.
>
> I remember when one used to be able to buy casing patches, the last
> ones I got were from The Third Hand/Loose Screws many years ago. I
> haven't seen them since.


Park Tire Boots are great for emergencies but they can eventually go
brittle and crack.

~PB
 
Make your own. I cut the beads off old but sound casings and trim to proper length. The tread rubber is buffed off with a sanding drum and this "patch" is covered in thinned contact cement. Buff the inside of the tire with fine sandpaper and clean with naptha or Zippo lighter fluid. Apply a thin layer of contact cement and let dry.

Carefully line the patch with the area while maintaining the inflated profile of the tire. Apply the patch from the center outward.

Now for the outside fix. Mount the tire with tube on a rim. Get some "Shoe Goo" and fiberglass strapping tape. Carefully clean the tread cut, removing all dirt, wiping with a naptha soaked rag. Apply a tiny bit of Shoe Goo to the cut, working it to the patch. Wrap the area with a layer of strapping tape, going completely around the rim. Inflate to recommended pressure and let sit for 24 hours. Remove the tape and the excess goo will usually go with the tape but the cut will be glued tightly together to where it will disappear.

Total cost is pennies. Tire will be like new.
 
Michael Fuhr wrote:
> "Neil Brooks" <[email protected]> writes:
>
>
>>Also, the empty wrapper from a Cliff Bar (or equivalent) is reported to work
>>well.

>
>
> Or a dollar bill, but they're weak compared to the Euro.
>

It would be impossible to use a euro as a tire patch since it's only
available as a coin. You'd have to go to a 5 euro note to get a decent
boot.

--
My bike blog:
http://diabloscott.blogspot.com/
 
"Diablo Scott" wrote: (clip) You'd have to go to a 5 euro note to get a
decent boot. (clip)
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
I would write a check. That way, if you don't cash it, it doesn't cost you
anything.
 
On Tue, 09 Nov 2004 20:20:32 +0000, John Everett wrote:

> I remember when one used to be able to buy casing patches, the last
> ones I got were from The Third Hand/Loose Screws many years ago. I
> haven't seen them since.


They come with some patch kits. I had an old silk track tire that I cut
up for a lifetime supply of boots. IMO there is nothing better.

But the follow-up response suggesting that the tire will be "good as new"
is wrong. I used to apply boots in sew-ups and use them for a while, but
even then (when I was cheap) I knew that it was not a great idea.

Replacing a tire is cheap insurance against accidents. Toss out the cut
tire.

--

David L. Johnson

__o | To announce that there must be no criticism of the president, or
_`\(,_ | that we are to stand by the president right or wrong, is not only
(_)/ (_) | unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the
American public. --Theodore Roosevelt
 
David L. Johnson said:
On Tue, 09 Nov 2004 20:20:32 +0000, John Everett wrote:

> I remember when one used to be able to buy casing patches, the last
> ones I got were from The Third Hand/Loose Screws many years ago. I
> haven't seen them since.


They come with some patch kits. I had an old silk track tire that I cut
up for a lifetime supply of boots. IMO there is nothing better.

But the follow-up response suggesting that the tire will be "good as new"
is wrong. I used to apply boots in sew-ups and use them for a while, but
even then (when I was cheap) I knew that it was not a great idea.

Replacing a tire is cheap insurance against accidents. Toss out the cut
tire.

--

David L. Johnson


No, they are as good as new. Contact cement bonds the casings and generous overlap (3/4" from cut) ensures all casing stress is carried over the break in the patch. Shoe Goo and strapping tape keeps the tread bond line thin enough to assure long term stability.

I have had tires last over 2000 miles after repair with no ill effects.
 
On Wed, 10 Nov 2004 13:35:49 +1100, Weisse Luft
<[email protected]> wrote:

>
>David L. Johnson Wrote:
>> On Tue, 09 Nov 2004 20:20:32 +0000, John Everett wrote:
>>
>> > I remember when one used to be able to buy casing patches, the last
>> > ones I got were from The Third Hand/Loose Screws many years ago. I
>> > haven't seen them since.

>>
>> They come with some patch kits. I had an old silk track tire that I
>> cut
>> up for a lifetime supply of boots. IMO there is nothing better.
>>
>> But the follow-up response suggesting that the tire will be "good as
>> new"
>> is wrong. I used to apply boots in sew-ups and use them for a while,
>> but
>> even then (when I was cheap) I knew that it was not a great idea.
>>
>> Replacing a tire is cheap insurance against accidents. Toss out the
>> cut
>> tire.
>>
>> --
>>
>> David L. Johnson
>>
>>

>
>
>No, they are as good as new. Contact cement bonds the casings and
>generous overlap (3/4" from cut) ensures all casing stress is carried
>over the break in the patch. Shoe Goo and strapping tape keeps the
>tread bond line thin enough to assure long term stability.
>
>I have had tires last over 2000 miles after repair with no ill effects.


Dear David and Weisse,

Would it make any difference whether you were talking about
cut along the rim, a gash across the tire parallel to the
nearest spoke, or a faintly star-shaped hole from a Russian
olive's thorn?

Does it matter if the hole is on the tread or on a sidewall?

That is, will differently-shaped damage in different places
be more likely to unrepairable?

Carl Fogel
 
Weisse Luft wrote:

> David L. Johnson Wrote:
>> On Tue, 09 Nov 2004 20:20:32 +0000, John Everett wrote:


>>> I remember when one used to be able to buy casing patches, the last
>>> ones I got were from The Third Hand/Loose Screws many years ago. I
>>> haven't seen them since.


>> They come with some patch kits. I had an old silk track tire that I
>> cut
>> up for a lifetime supply of boots. IMO there is nothing better.
>>
>> But the follow-up response suggesting that the tire will be "good as
>> new"
>> is wrong. I used to apply boots in sew-ups and use them for a while,
>> but
>> even then (when I was cheap) I knew that it was not a great idea.


>> Replacing a tire is cheap insurance against accidents. Toss out the
>> cut
>> tire.


> No, they are as good as new. Contact cement bonds the casings and
> generous overlap (3/4" from cut) ensures all casing stress is carried
> over the break in the patch. Shoe Goo and strapping tape keeps the
> tread bond line thin enough to assure long term stability.
>
> I have had tires last over 2000 miles after repair with no ill
> effects.


I agree. Booting is safe and permanent, as long as you use the right stuff and
do it correctly. I've booted plenty of tires, and ridden them until the cords
showed. Torn casings are inevitable if you ride mountain bikes on rocky
terrain, etc.

The main concern is using material strong enough to bridge the hole without
blowing out, and a bond strong enough so air pressure doesn't push the whole
patch out the hole. Also, the material should be thin and flexible enough that
it doesn't go "bump" with every tire revolution.

For short term boots, to get you home, you can use dollar bills, duct tape, a
piece of canvas, or the new favorite, Tyvek envelope material. Sometimes it's
hard to get duct tape stickum off to make a more permanent patch, but nothing
beats duct tape for easy wilderness repairs while mountain biking. Most
old-time mountain bikers have a couple feet of duct tape stuck to their bike
somewhere.

The best stuff I've found for permanent repairs is heavy duty sail repair tape,
with the cords on the bias to match the tire casing. This makes any tire as
good as new. I've ridden road tires to the cords with this stuff, without ever
feeling the patch. I've fixed 2" tears in mountain bike tires with no problems.
It's expensive, so unless you're already a sailor, it's probably not worth
buying to patch tires with (just buy a new tire).

Next would be the traditonal nylon reinforced rubber rubber patch, either from a
tire patch kit, or an inflatable boat repair kit. Pieces of old tires work fine
too, they're just bulky and stiff. Pieces of canvas work fine, but seal the
canvas well with Shoe Goo -- cotton loses strength if it gets wet. Use rubber
contact cement for all your gluing, and roll the patch well to get a good bond.
Seal the outside of the hole with Shoe Goo, to prevent any further fraying of
the casing. Trim with a razor blade anything sticking out after sealing, then
smear on a final coat for good measure.

I learned all this stuff during the early days of mountain biking, when gear was
relatively more expensive. We didn't have OEM liquidations, discount stores, or
the internet, or zillions of tire models, and manufacturers vying for our
business. If you tore a MTB tire on a rock, you had to go to your LBS and pay
$40-50 for a new one -- unless you could fix it.

These days, you can go to Nashbar or Performance's websites, or one of Supergo's
stores, and get great tires for under $20, or sometimes less than half that. If
booting is a lost art, this is probably why.

Matt O.

..
 
[email protected] wrote:

> Would it make any difference whether you were talking about
> cut along the rim, a gash across the tire parallel to the
> nearest spoke, or a faintly star-shaped hole from a Russian
> olive's thorn?
>
> Does it matter if the hole is on the tread or on a sidewall?
>
> That is, will differently-shaped damage in different places
> be more likely to unrepairable?


Carl, I think the only thing that can't be fixed is a long gash too close to the
bead on a clincher. In that case, there might not be enough bonding area
between the gash and the edge of the tire.

Matt O.
 
On Tue, 9 Nov 2004 23:16:06 -0500, "Matt O'Toole"
<[email protected]> wrote:

>[email protected] wrote:
>
>> Would it make any difference whether you were talking about
>> cut along the rim, a gash across the tire parallel to the
>> nearest spoke, or a faintly star-shaped hole from a Russian
>> olive's thorn?
>>
>> Does it matter if the hole is on the tread or on a sidewall?
>>
>> That is, will differently-shaped damage in different places
>> be more likely to unrepairable?

>
>Carl, I think the only thing that can't be fixed is a long gash too close to the
>bead on a clincher. In that case, there might not be enough bonding area
>between the gash and the edge of the tire.
>
>Matt O.


Dear Matt,

Aha! I hadn't even thought of that side of things.

Thanks,

Carl Fogel
 
Matt O'Toole said:
[email protected] wrote:

> Would it make any difference whether you were talking about
> cut along the rim, a gash across the tire parallel to the
> nearest spoke, or a faintly star-shaped hole from a Russian
> olive's thorn?
>
> Does it matter if the hole is on the tread or on a sidewall?
>
> That is, will differently-shaped damage in different places
> be more likely to unrepairable?


Carl, I think the only thing that can't be fixed is a long gash too close to the
bead on a clincher. In that case, there might not be enough bonding area
between the gash and the edge of the tire.

Matt O.

Well, that may be the case for a permanent repair but duct tape will get you home. Easily. Just keep the tape smooth over the bead and only a single layer, inside and out, rolling the tape over the outside of the bead up to mid sidewall. It will work for longer than necessary to get you home.

On Shoe Goo tread repair, you need to use the strapping tape and inflate method to compress the bond line. The tire will appear compressed under the tape, this is normal and desired to make the bond line as thin as possible. Thinner is stronger. You can nick the tape immediately over the bond to vent excess glue, reducing cure time. If not, the excess glue will form a blister under the tape which will be removed with the tape.

You see that picture in my avatar? That race I ran a front tire repaired in the above method. I broke 60 on one of the descents. 60 miles per hour. I trust this method.
 
"Weisse Luft" <[email protected]> wrote in
message news:[email protected]...
>
> David L. Johnson Wrote:


> > Replacing a tire is cheap insurance against accidents. Toss out the
> > cut tire.


> No, they are as good as new. Contact cement bonds the casings and
> generous overlap (3/4" from cut) ensures all casing stress is carried
> over the break in the patch.


Just in case someone's skill at booting isn't quite as good as yours, it
might be prudent to reserve the repaired tires for rear wheel use only.
 
On Tue, 09 Nov 2004 13:25:49 -0700, [email protected] wrote:

>On Tue, 09 Nov 2004 20:20:32 GMT, I
><[email protected]> wrote:
>
>>I remember when one used to be able to buy casing patches, the last
>>ones I got were from The Third Hand/Loose Screws many years ago. I
>>haven't seen them since.
>>
>>Have these been discontinued? Has the market decided they would rather
>>sell us new tires instead of providing a method of repair?
>>
>>
>>jeverett3<AT>earthlink<DOT>net http://home.earthlink.net/~jeverett3

>
>Dear John,
>
>Park makes tire boots, which may be what you want:
>
>http://www.performancebike.com/shop/profile.cfm?SKU=2527
>
>Carl Fogel


This isn't what I meant at all. I'm talking about casing patches. I
currently have on my lap a Michelin Hi-Lite Supercomp H.D to which I
applied a casing patch many years ago. I also superglued the cut.The
patch is round, fabric reinforced, 32mm (1 1/4") in diameter, black
with a 2mm blue border. For years I carried this tire folded and
bungeed to my seat stays as a ready spare. It looks like it's still
useable.

Being a bit of a pack-rat, I just checked the Summer 1994 "The Third
"Hand" catalog. The patches were listed there. So let me rephrase my
question. Has anyone seen these lately? Are they no longer made?


jeverett3<AT>earthlink<DOT>net http://home.earthlink.net/~jeverett3
 
<[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Good tubular tires having thin casings and being flexible generally
> needed a boot if the puncture was anything but a thorn or snake bite.
> Therefore, casing material from a similar tire was cut and trimmed to
> make a boot that was glued into place in the tire before patching the
> tube and re-sewing.
>
> http://draco.acs.uci.edu/rbfaq/FAQ/8b.19.html
>
> Jobst Brandt
> [email protected]


I've been using Velox rim tape as tire boot material with great success.
It's thin enough, strong and has adhesive on one side.
Bill Brannon