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Cities Turning to Bicycles - Page 7

post #91 of 1138

Re: Cities Turning to Bicycles

Tim McNamara wrote:
>
> John David Galt <jdg@diogenes.sacramento.ca.us> writes:
>
> > America does imprison reckless drivers that kill and maim.

>
> Well, some of them. Most walk away from the court with minor
> penalties.


AFAIK, there seems to be mandatory jail time for killing with
alcohol in your bloodstream, civil penalty (traffic ticket) for
killing while sober, and no penalty for being unable to pass
a vehicle as narrow as a bicycle without killing the rider.

Mitch.
post #92 of 1138

Re: Cities Turning to Bicycles

RJ wrote:
>
> Before I call you liar, what minivan is it that gets 40 mpg highway?


I have no idea what Baker is talking about, but you could do it
with a stick shift 1984 Dodge Caravan. A diesel Vanagon would be
right up there too. In today's market, I don't know of anything,
unless you want to call a Toyota Matrix a minivan.

Mitch.
post #93 of 1138

Re: Cities Turning to Bicycles

>> Before I call you liar, what minivan is it that gets 40 mpg highway?
>
>I have no idea what Baker is talking about, but you could do it
>with a stick shift 1984 Dodge Caravan. A diesel Vanagon would be
>right up there too.


Very doubtful. Around 84 there were a few cars getting over 40mpg, like the
Omni or LeCar, but todays cars have 3 times the HP and don't get anything close
to 40 conventially, Perhaps the Echo.
TDI dieselwise of course.
Everything's a gas hog nowadays, they're just small with V-6's in them. Full
size trucks are getting 20+ per gallon on the highway and we have cylinder
deactivation and variable valve timing coming up.
SUV's are just hot topic scapegoats because of the size, the mileage difference
is an exageration. Consider the waste if a conventional V-8 is driven slightly
versus a new car being produced with better mileage...and all the energy it
takes to produce a car period...compared to driving a "used car" into the
several hundred thousand mile range.





In today's market, I don't know of anything,
>unless you want to call a Toyota Matrix a minivan.
>
>Mitch.



A matrix? what are you smoking, it isn't even as big as a small station wagon.
post #94 of 1138

Re: Cities Turning to Bicycles

Mitch Haley <mlh@voyager.net> wrote:

> RJ wrote:
> >
> > Before I call you liar, what minivan is it that gets 40 mpg highway?

>
> I have no idea what Baker is talking about, but you could do it
> with a stick shift 1984 Dodge Caravan.


40? No way. Size and shape make it impossible.

> A diesel Vanagon would be
> right up there too. T


Nope. The diesel Jetta is over 40, but the Passat is under 40, and both
of them have vastly better aerodynamic shapes than a minivan.

> In today's market, I don't know of anything,
> unless you want to call a Toyota Matrix a minivan.


Evidently it was just a troll.
post #95 of 1138

Re: Cities Turning to Bicycles

"Chalo" <chumpychump@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:8b4b7de4.0409111525.ebe94f@posting.google.com...

> Your understanding of class hostility is fundamentally flawed.


You framed it as a vehicle safety issue, and so that is what I answered.

People can afford whatever they choose to, you may choose to live
your life in a way that makes you feel better about your place in
society, but does not afford you the option to purchase a new BMW
740iL this is your choice, and your right in a free society.

You seem to feel the need to picture yourself as "smarter" or somehow
better than thosewho make different choices, and this is why the left
will always ailienate the middle class, and cannot hold power.

If people on the left continue to hold "holier than thou" attitudes about
the great unwashed, we will always cede power to the corrupt plutocracy,
who at least goes to the trouble to pretend to care about their fears.

Now I see what you were trying to say.

Bernard
post #96 of 1138

Re: Cities Turning to Bicycles

fx199@aol.com (Fx199) wrote:
>
> >You underestimate the off-road and climbing capabilities of the Type 1
> >Beetle, then.

>
> The beetle pollutes more than a modern SUV Sheistbrains


Who's "Sheist"? Is that a word in a language spoken by someone
besides yourself?

I understand your point, but I don't think it's relevant to what I was
saying. I used the Beetle as an example because it's a particularly
good climber and it's a very lightweight car. While it emits a lot of
foul stuff compared to, say, a New Beetle or even a new Excursion, it
weighs barely over a ton, and it uses less gas than an SUV despite its
engine being inefficient for its power output.

The point I was trying to make is that it doesn't take a 4x4 truck to
climb a dirt road. If I were more familiar with the climbing
abilities of new small cars I might have used one of those as an
example.

Chalo Colina
post #97 of 1138

Re: Cities Turning to Bicycles

"George Conklin" <nilknoc@earthlink.net> wrote:

> My Suburban sees daily use of low 4-wheel drive
> so I don't tear up my hill.


That is consistent with my point-- if you weren't trying to lift a
Suburban up the hill, you wouldn't need 4WD. A lightweight car can do
quite well with just two drive wheels.

Chalo Colina
post #98 of 1138

Re: Cities Turning to Bicycles

"Tom Keats" <tomk2003@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:cj90ic.a25.ln@bud.garden.local...
> In article <qJL0d.21265$Wv5.10676@newsread3.news.atl.earthlink.net>,
> "George Conklin" <nilknoc@earthlink.net> writes:
>
> >> > This is a working car.
> >>
> >> It certainly is.
> >>

> > Precisely what I wrote. Got it?

>
> Hey, I'm just agreein' with ya.
>
> BTW, the ladies really resent the term, 'wench'.
> If I were you I'd use it sparingly (if at all);
> otherwise it might affect productivity.
>
> So, what kind of upholstery do you have --
> leopard-skin, or pearl Naugahyde?
>


Lion skin. It wears better. And a snake around the rearview mirror too.
post #99 of 1138

Re: Cities Turning to Bicycles

"H. M. Leary" <mikie357@forgedabit.net> wrote in message
news:mikie357-9C14A9.09021111092004@news.verizon.net...
> In article <414266f0@news.ysu.edu>, Frank Krygowski

<frkrygow@mousepotato.com>
> wrote:
>
> > George Conklin wrote:
> >
> > > My Suburban sees daily use of low 4-wheel drive
> > > so I don't tear up my hill. The neighbor who mows his grandparents'

and
> > > parents' graves next to the house always comes in with a 4-wheel

drive, and
> > > so does the Xmas tree farmer across the way. In the summer, you can

make it
> > > on 2-wheel drive if you don't mind throwing stones all over the place

and
> > > put up with a little skidding. But then again I got stuck with a

2-wheel
> > > drive Suburban in the field one summer day when it was damp. I

really need
> > > a wench on the front of the thing.

> >
> > :-)
> >
> > No, no, no. You need _two_ wenches on the _back_ of the thing. You
> > know, chrome naked wenches in silhouette on the mud flaps. Goes just
> > great with a rebel flag window decal and a Bud Lite bumper sticker.
> >
> > The epitome of sophisticated art - if you're an SUV kinda guy! ;-)

>
> Frank:
>
> You must be one of them good ole boys from rural Georgia!
>


He must mean in the back seat!!
post #100 of 1138

Re: Cities Turning to Bicycles

"Mark Jones" <noemail@mindspring.com> wrote in message
news:w0M0d.13224$w%6.1274@newsread1.news.pas.earthlink.net...
> "Chalo" <chumpychump@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:8b4b7de4.0409111454.5873e757@posting.google.com...
> > "George Conklin" <nilknoc@earthlink.net> wrote:
> >>
> >> "Mark Jones" <noemail@mindspring.com> wrote in message
> >> >
> >> > I bought my 4x4 because I wanted it.
> >>
> >> I got mine because I needed it. Otherwise, I would not have

purchased
> >> it.

> >
> > Mark loves his gas hog so much he drives it less than five miles to
> > work-- twice-- every day.
> >
> > He has a different sense of community responsibility and citizenship
> > than lots of us; unfortunately there are many millions of others who
> > think like he does. Each one of them does not inflict so much damage
> > to be of great concern (except to the people who are killed and maimed
> > in collisions with them, and their loved ones), but collectively, they
> > are a pandemic social disaster.

> I really do think that you are kind of funny, in a pathetic kind of way.
> You want everyone to conform to your way of doing things and you
> get upset because you know it isn't going to happen.
>
> As a side note, I only drive my vehicles about 600 miles a month
> between the two of them. I know people who drive more than
> that every week and I support their right to do it.
>
> I have a low opinion of eco geeks who want to tell other people
> how to live their lives.
>
>


But then you must lack virtue, which only those on a crusade have.
post #101 of 1138

Re: Cities Turning to Bicycles

"Tim McNamara" <timmcn@bitstream.net> wrote in message
news:m2wtz0xib8.fsf@Stella-Blue.local...
> "Mark Jones" <noemail@mindspring.com> writes:
>
> > I have a low opinion of eco geeks who want to tell other people how
> > to live their lives.

>
> You probably consider yourself a conservative then. And perhaps you
> think it's OK for the Bush "base" to tell other people how they should
> live their lives.


People used to have crusades based on religion. But these days religion
in the West is slow, so environmentalism is a good substitute for urbanites
who think that food grows in the aisles of supermarkets.
post #102 of 1138

Re: Cities Turning to Bicycles

"Mitch Haley" <mlh@voyager.net> wrote in message
news:4143989E.255F3868@voyager.net...
> RJ wrote:
> >
> > Before I call you liar, what minivan is it that gets 40 mpg highway?

>
> I have no idea what Baker is talking about, but you could do it
> with a stick shift 1984 Dodge Caravan. A diesel Vanagon would be
> right up there too. In today's market, I don't know of anything,
> unless you want to call a Toyota Matrix a minivan.
>
> Mitch.


No you would NOT get therere with a K-car in any shape or form.
post #103 of 1138

Re: Cities Turning to Bicycles

"RJ" <re_johnson@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1gjywv6.1aewewfts9k66N%re_johnson@hotmail.com...
> Mitch Haley <mlh@voyager.net> wrote:
>
> > RJ wrote:
> > >
> > > Before I call you liar, what minivan is it that gets 40 mpg highway?

> >
> > I have no idea what Baker is talking about, but you could do it
> > with a stick shift 1984 Dodge Caravan.

>
> 40? No way. Size and shape make it impossible.


Besides that, even with a K car and a 4 cylinder engine and a manual
5-speed, you would not get better than 32. If you add in the shape and wind
drag of a van, it is going to be about 28 at best.



>
> > A diesel Vanagon would be
> > right up there too. T

>
> Nope. The diesel Jetta is over 40, but the Passat is under 40, and both
> of them have vastly better aerodynamic shapes than a minivan.
>
> > In today's market, I don't know of anything,
> > unless you want to call a Toyota Matrix a minivan.

>
> Evidently it was just a troll.
post #104 of 1138

Re: Cities Turning to Bicycles

"Chalo" <chumpychump@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:8b4b7de4.0409111525.ebe94f@posting.google.com...
> "Bernard Farquart" <bernardfarquart@hotmail.delete.com> wrote:
> >
> > "Chalo" <chumpychump@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> > news:8b4b7de4.0409091725.599e4fb7@posting.google.com...
> > >
> > > The proliferation of giant cars, and trucks used solely as personal
> > > cars, is an extension of class hostility.

> >
> > That is a pretty stupid statement, vehicle size has been
> > much larger in the past (60's 70's) so the poor can certainly
> > afford, and sometimes can only afford large vehicles.
> >
> > I doubt you will.find a car much larger than the 5300 Lb
> > Lincoln MarkV I drove when I was younger(and poorer)

>
> Your understanding of class hostility is fundamentally flawed. When
> poor and average income folks acquire conspicuous possessions they
> believe will make then appear wealthier and more successful than they
> are, they are participating in the same system of class hostility that
> keeps them down. And of course when they make do with the
> hand-me-downs of a more affluent class, their choice of possessions is
> a matter of what the secondhand market provides for the price they are
> able to pay. But the giant and noxious cars were originally
> manufactured to serve a supercilious and classist market, and whether
> that market is actually wealthy or not is immaterial-- It is still a
> classist market.
>
> You may have driven a tank of a car when you were of meager means, but
> you were driving a cast-off relic of the original buyer's pretensions
> and/or arrogance. The car was not made huge and gauche so you, as a
> subsquent owner, would buy it.
>
> Correspondingly, it may be tradesmen and other nominally working class
> people to whom gigantic and vulgar trucks are marketed, but those
> people buy them to address their notions about the class they aspire
> to, and to differentiate themselves from those they hold in contempt.
>
> To take the example out of the vehicular realm, it is not upper class
> people who can be seen in public wearing a lot of showy gold jewelry.
> Those who wear that kind of jewelry do so because to them it gives the
> impression of riches. That's an expression of class hostility even if
> it is also a sign of sublimated self-contempt.
>
> Chalo Colina


What drivel. The big cars were manufactured because they were much more
comfortable than econoboxes.
post #105 of 1138

Re: Cities Turning to Bicycles

"Mitch Haley" <mlh@voyager.net> wrote in message
news:4143947C.DC42218C@voyager.net...
> Matthew Russotto wrote:
> >
> > In article <4e4a3f58.0409092014.63ed602d@posting.google.com>,
> > DonQuijote1954 <nolionnoproblem@hotmail.com> wrote:
> > >
> > >Hey good question, "What would Jesus had driven before an accident?"

> >
> > Best answer I've seen is "A panel van with 'Nazarene and Son,
> > Carpenters' stenciled on the side."

>
> I always thought the obvious answer to "What would Jesus drive?" was
> "Sandals".


It was 'an ass.'
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