Bad dog!

Hello,

I believe if the dog is coming off their property onto public space (the road or sidewalk or
whatever), you can do whatever you need to do to protect yourself from the dog including pepper
spray or using a knife or stick or rock or whatever.

I recommend pepper spray because I've used it in the past and it works great and doesn't seem to
cause any damage to the dog. Of course, I guess a particular dog could be allergic to it. If you
decide to use pepper spray, make sure you check the wind so it doesn't blow back on you and so that
it does get to the dog. You can throw up a couple of leaves or some grass or something to determine
the wind direction.

As the dog comes towards you make sure it is downwind then shoot off a couple of sprays as it gets
within a few steps and that should do it. The times I've done it all the dogs do is stop with a kind
of weird look on their face and shake their head then slowly begin to go the other way. I would make
sure the dog is off the owners property though.

Another suggestion is to take an aggressive step towards the dog and say NO!!!! in a loud demanding
voice. My experience has been that this usually works as well. Most dogs know the meaning of NO!!!
because they've heard it from their master many times.

JMO

Doug Gilliam

"Governor Breck" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> I've been walking a good, strenuous 3.5 miles a day and it's been doing me a world of good. For
> example, I can now run up several flights of stairs at work without gettig winded. Trouble is,
> there's a dog on my route who thinks he's the alpha and I'm the beta. Most of the time the owner
> is around to call him off, but I did get bit once (I was wearing heavy gloves and it didn't
> break the skin) and several times, there's been nobody around. I've taken to hollering at the
> dog ("Bad dog!" and "Get away!") and I now know the dog's name ("Bocce"...is there any wonder
> why he has a chip on his shoulder?) so I can use that. But what are my other options? I've
> thought of pepper spray, but I've heard that if the animal is hurt, then I would be liable.
> Plus, I don't want to start a war of escalation that winds up with some crazy redneck poisoning
> my altogether easygoing dogs.
>
> So, what are my options? A coworker mentioned carrying dog treats, but wouldn't that just
> reinforce the animal's behavior? My Dad said to carry a soda can full of pennies, but somehow I
> don't think that would disuade this creature. Frankly, if I had my druthers, I'd pepper spray the
> owner but I don't think the State of Vermont would look too kindly on that. Does anyone else have
> any ideas? Thanks!
> --
> Governor Breck governor_breck at yahoo dot com

Don't they have leash laws where you are? Here in Austin all dogs are required to be on leashes when
outdoors. Dogs that mess with me get their owners reported to the city, and a nice stiff fine. M9

"Governor Breck" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> I've been walking a good, strenuous 3.5 miles a day and it's been doing me a world of good. For
> example, I can now run up several flights of stairs at work without gettig winded. Trouble is,
> there's a dog on my route who thinks he's the alpha and I'm the beta. Most of the time the owner
> is around to call him off, but I did get bit once (I was wearing heavy gloves and it didn't
> break the skin) and several times, there's been nobody around. I've taken to hollering at the
> dog ("Bad dog!" and "Get away!") and I now know the dog's name ("Bocce"...is there any wonder
> why he has a chip on his shoulder?) so I can use that. But what are my other options? I've
> thought of pepper spray, but I've heard that if the animal is hurt, then I would be liable.
> Plus, I don't want to start a war of escalation that winds up with some crazy redneck poisoning
> my altogether easygoing dogs.
>
> So, what are my options? A coworker mentioned carrying dog treats, but wouldn't that just
> reinforce the animal's behavior? My Dad said to carry a soda can full of pennies, but somehow I
> don't think that would disuade this creature. Frankly, if I had my druthers, I'd pepper spray the
> owner but I don't think the State of Vermont would look too kindly on that. Does anyone else have
> any ideas? Thanks!
> --
> Governor Breck governor_breck at yahoo dot com

"minerva nine" <[email protected]> wrote in news:[email protected]:

> Don't they have leash laws where you are? Here in Austin all dogs are required to be on leashes
> when outdoors. Dogs that mess with me get their owners reported to the city, and a nice stiff
> fine. M9
>

No, this is rural Vermont. Not only is there no city to report to, there's no local PD to take
care of it.

--
Governor Breck governor_breck at yahoo dot com

Doug Gilliam wrote:

> Another suggestion is to take an aggressive step towards the dog and say NO!!!! in a loud
> demanding voice. My experience has been that this usually works as well. Most dogs know the
> meaning of NO!!! because they've heard it from their master many times.
>

I'm glad I saw your post. I was walking home today and found myself facing a very aggressive dog. I
took my backpack off and swung it at him, but it didn't have much effect. Then I just yelled "NO!"
and he turned around and walked away.

Robert,

I'm glad the information was useful to you. This seems to be the one word that every dog
understands.

I can tell you about another method that my father and older brother have used their whole life but
I don't recommend it for anybody and I won't use it either. I've seen both of them do it
successfully several times and it has NEVER failed.

Basically, whenever an aggressive dog comes towards them they immediately go after the dog no matter
what type nor how large or mean. My brother will let loose an incredible growl as he does it but my
father didn't say anything. The dog ALWAYS runs. My dad was over 60 yrs. old when he went after a
huge doberman that was very mean and was terrorizing the neighborhood.

I once asked my dad what his secret was and how he did it. He said "there is no secret, you have to
really want to get ahold of the dog." Of course, my dad was a whittler and always carried a fairly
large razor sharp knife and he was very strong so he probably would have killed any dog that
attacked him.

I don't recommend this for anyone but I can attest that it works but I do believe you really have to
want to get ahold of the dog. My youngest brother tried it once after hearing my dad and older
brother talk about it. A little dog came towards him and he charged towards it thinking it would run
and it like to have eaten him up . Of course, he admitted that he was bluffing. He didn't really
want to get ahold of the dog. I guess the dog can tell the difference.

Doug Gilliam "Robert" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Doug Gilliam wrote:
>
> > Another suggestion is to take an aggressive step towards the dog and say NO!!!! in a loud
> > demanding voice. My experience has been that this
usually
> > works as well. Most dogs know the meaning of NO!!! because they've heard
it
> > from their master many times.
> >
>
> I'm glad I saw your post. I was walking home today and found myself facing
a
> very aggressive dog. I took my backpack off and swung it at him, but it
didn't
> have much effect. Then I just yelled "NO!" and he turned around and
walked
> away.

I've had similar incidents and reported the owner to the police. I don't know where you live, but
where I live, we have laws that keep animals penned in their yards. The dog that is attacking you is
obviously out on the loose and needs to be rounded up. Just keep calling the police to come and get
the dog until they come and get him. Be sure to tell the police you've already been bitten once and
you don't want to get bitten again.

When the owner has to pay a fine to pick the dog up from the pound, maybe he'll start locking
the dog up.

Good luck.

Cat

"Governor Breck" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> I've been walking a good, strenuous 3.5 miles a day and it's been doing me a world of good. For
> example, I can now run up several flights of stairs at work without gettig winded. Trouble is,
> there's a dog on my route who thinks he's the alpha and I'm the beta. Most of the time the owner
> is around to call him off, but I did get bit once (I was wearing heavy gloves and it didn't
> break the skin) and several times, there's been nobody around. I've taken to hollering at the
> dog ("Bad dog!" and "Get away!") and I now know the dog's name ("Bocce"...is there any wonder
> why he has a chip on his shoulder?) so I can use that. But what are my other options? I've
> thought of pepper spray, but I've heard that if the animal is hurt, then I would be liable.
> Plus, I don't want to start a war of escalation that winds up with some crazy redneck poisoning
> my altogether easygoing dogs.
>
> So, what are my options? A coworker mentioned carrying dog treats, but wouldn't that just
> reinforce the animal's behavior? My Dad said to carry a soda can full of pennies, but somehow I
> don't think that would disuade this creature. Frankly, if I had my druthers, I'd pepper spray the
> owner but I don't think the State of Vermont would look too kindly on that. Does anyone else have
> any ideas? Thanks!
> --
> Governor Breck governor_breck at yahoo dot com

Oh. In that case, maybe there's no local PD to report you either if you pepper spray the dog.

I'd say, do whatever you have to do to protect yourself. I'm sure if anything comes of it, you'll be
in the clear.

Cat

"Governor Breck" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> "minerva nine" <[email protected]> wrote in news:[email protected]:
>
> > Don't they have leash laws where you are? Here in Austin all dogs are required to be on leashes
> > when outdoors. Dogs that mess with me get their owners reported to the city, and a nice stiff
> > fine. M9
> >
>
> No, this is rural Vermont. Not only is there no city to report to, there's no local PD to take
> care of it.
>
>
> --
> Governor Breck governor_breck at yahoo dot com

There are a couple of dogs like that in my neighborhood. I live in Southern Georgia...you wanna talk
about rednecks? We got the cream of the crop. I don't know what's more dangerous: their dogs or the
rusting pieces of metal strewn around their yard that sometimes finds its way into the roads.

1. Have you tried just ignoring him. Does he just bark/chase after you and only become really
agressive when you pay attention to him or try to shoo him off? If so, you might want to just
treat him as if he weren't there. I know it's a scary thought to turn your back on an aggressive
dog, but if you walk that path frequently, he may eventually get tired of you. There are a
couple of dogs on my path that no longer bother running up to me b/c I'm just a daily thing now.

2. Try carrying a little spray bottle with vinegar/water solution or lemon juice. It won't leave as
tell-tale a sign as pepper spray and so lesson the chance of redneck retribution. I definately
understand your fears in that department. I've known people who have had their cars keyed as
part of some strange redneck ***-for-tat.

3. What pace are you going when you see this dog? My chihuahua (3 lbs of fearless fury) won't try
to run after walkers, but if a jogger comes by he takes off as fast and far as his little
extending leash will allow him. It's a prey drive thing. Hard to imagine that a beast that
stands 5 inches from the ground could consider anything other than grasshoppers prey...but I
guess it's a genetic thing.

I keep my dog on a leash but I admit I wasn't always this law-abiding.
I had assumed b/c of his tiny size and mouse-like appearance that it
would be alright to walk with my dog late at night with only a couple
of fellow stragglers sharing track space. Until one night he took off
after a jogger and cornered him onto the hood of the poor guy's car
before I could catch up with him. I honestly didn't think the guy was
going to take off running like that b/c he happened to be very large
and muscular man. Shows you how wrong stereotyping can be I guess.

"Sandy" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
> It's a prey drive thing. Hard to imagine that a beast that stands 5
inches from the ground could consider anything other than grasshoppers prey...but I guess it's a
genetic thing.
>

HE doesn't think he's only 5" high! On the inside, he's a humongous ferocious monster!

I read a murder-mystery book years ago where a sweet little Peke took off after a burglar -- nipping
at his heels until he fell down the stairs, then she went after his throat! Her mom's boyfriend (Big
Tough Cop) had a whole new outlook on "silly little dogs" after that. bj

Sandy wrote:
> There are a couple of dogs like that in my neighborhood. I live in Southern Georgia...you wanna
> talk about rednecks? We got the cream of the crop. I don't know what's more dangerous: their
> dogs or the rusting pieces of metal strewn around their yard that sometimes finds its way into
> the roads.
>
> 1. Have you tried just ignoring him. Does he just bark/chase after you and only become really
> agressive when you pay attention to him or try to shoo him off? If so, you might want to just
> treat him as if he weren't there. I know it's a scary thought to turn your back on an
> aggressive dog, but if you walk that path frequently, he may eventually get tired of you.
> There are a couple of dogs on my path that no longer bother running up to me b/c I'm just a
> daily thing now.
>
> 2. Try carrying a little spray bottle with vinegar/water solution or lemon juice. It won't leave
> as tell-tale a sign as pepper spray and so lesson the chance of redneck retribution. I
> definately understand your fears in that department. I've known people who have had their cars
> keyed as part of some strange redneck ***-for-tat.
>
> 3. What pace are you going when you see this dog? My chihuahua (3 lbs of fearless fury) won't try
> to run after walkers, but if a jogger comes by he takes off as fast and far as his little
> extending leash will allow him. It's a prey drive thing. Hard to imagine that a beast that
> stands 5 inches from the ground could consider anything other than grasshoppers prey...but I
> guess it's a genetic thing.
>
> I keep my dog on a leash but I admit I wasn't always this law-abiding.
> I had assumed b/c of his tiny size and mouse-like appearance that it
> would be alright to walk with my dog late at night with only a couple
> of fellow stragglers sharing track space. Until one night he took off
> after a jogger and cornered him onto the hood of the poor guy's car
> before I could catch up with him. I honestly didn't think the guy was
> going to take off running like that b/c he happened to be very large
> and muscular man. Shows you how wrong stereotyping can be I guess.

It's important NOT to show fear when confronted by aggressive carnivores, including man's best
friend. I used to run in a neighborhood that featured several big chasers. I learned to always carry
a golf ball-sized piece of gravel. When threatened, I would pull it and raise it as though to throw
it, and even make several exaggerated faints at raising it above my ear to throw. Most dogs got the
message and took off. If not I would throw it and then look around the ground for another. If none
were available, I would pretend I found one and repeat the process with the imaginary stone.

Remember that bigger stones hurt more than little ones.

Sandy wrote:

> There are a couple of dogs like that in my neighborhood. I live in Southern Georgia...you wanna
> talk about rednecks? We got the cream of the crop. I don't know what's more dangerous: their
> dogs or the rusting pieces of metal strewn around their yard that sometimes finds its way into
> the roads.

I think upstate New York (rural Saratoga Springs area) is probably the redneck capital of the US, or
it seemed that way when I was there. I've never seen so many people flying the Confederate flag
(usually in front or trailers or from pickup trucks).