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post #16 of 150

Re: American Warship threatens to open fire on unarmed civilian ship....in SCOTLAND!

Quote:
Originally Posted by stevebaby
Unless the harbour has restricted space and the ferry has strayed into that space,then the warship is under an obligation to avoid a collision if its master believes one to be imminent.The obligation rests on the warship to change course.If the warship fails to change course,then the ferry master was correct to change his course.
If the warship's commander was not informed of the presence of a civilian ferry making regular scheduled crossings then something has gone wrong.
Given the relative speed capabilities of the two vessels it would appear that the ferry was unlikely to be in an overtaking situation.If the warship was overtaking the ferry then it is obliged to give way to it.
Transmitting on VHF16 is clearly not intended for a naval vessel."Enemy" vessels would definitely not be using VHF16,which would be available to be overheard by every civilian vessel within range.They would be using restricted naval channels available to the "friendlies".
If there was no risk of collision and the ferry was not in restricted waters then the warship has no right to tell the ferry to do anything and in British waters,no right to threaten to fire live ammunition at it.
Actually,on the face of it the warship commander may be technically liable for criminal charges.
That's quite a few "If" qualifiers factored into your statements.
post #17 of 150

Re: American Warship threatens to open fire on unarmed civilian ship....in SCOTLAND!

Quote:
Originally Posted by MountainPro
absolutely, no arguement here...

however, common sense should have told you that when moored in a busy shipping lane you may come across the occasional....err, ship.
According to the article you posted, the warship was not moored when it made the request for identity of the ferry.
post #18 of 150
Thread Starter 

Re: American Warship threatens to open fire on unarmed civilian ship....in SCOTLAND!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Scotty_Dog
According to the article you posted, the warship was not moored when it made the request for identity of the ferry.
okay swap the word 'moored' for 'situated'.
post #19 of 150
Thread Starter 

Re: American Warship threatens to open fire on unarmed civilian ship....in SCOTLAND!

Quote:
Originally Posted by stevebaby
If there was no risk of collision and the ferry was not in restricted waters then the warship has no right to tell the ferry to do anything and in British waters,no right to threaten to fire live ammunition at it.
Actually,on the face of it the warship commander may be technically liable for criminal charges.
there is absolutely no risk of collision...

the ferry travels across the river from the north shore to the south and back again...two ferries simultaneously serve the route.

the warship wanted to pass through the ferries path and told it to stop or it will fire a rocket (or whatever they fire on civilain craft these days) at them...

if the warship wanted past, its just a case of travelling at medium speed across the path, the ferries will adjust thier course to aviod any chance off collision.

now, hundreds of ship pass in the path these ferries...none have ever hit one. These ship include an entire naval fleet including nuclear subs, other ferry companies and ships coming to and from the ship yards dotted along the Clyde which build and refit ships from small vessels to the QE2 (twice the size of the warship in question)...

there was simply no excuse...they were being overly aggressive. The captain of the warship has apologised publically...which means he has accepted responsibility.
post #20 of 150

Re: American Warship threatens to open fire on unarmed civilian ship....in SCOTLAND!

YOu can only conclude one thing. It's those Bu****es at work again - Bush and his minions and cohorts!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Eldrack
Probably just a very lame practical joke..............
post #21 of 150

Re: American Warship threatens to open fire on unarmed civilian ship....in SCOTLAND!

Presbyterians came from Scotland???? OMG!!!! I have a little Scottish blood myself , but after being married to a Presby I can easily say that it is a very bad black mark upon the Scottish soul .....

I better google up some info on the origins of Presbyterianism........ We need to be vigilant against importing of terrorism.....
post #22 of 150

Re: American Warship threatens to open fire on unarmed civilian ship....in SCOTLAND!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Scotty_Dog
I deleted it because I decided to use some restraint, much like the warship.

And now here's a thought for you: if you're so morally high and mighty, why not pay for the stolen bike fork?
It doesn't take overweening morality to not illegally invade a sovereign nation and then murder innocent people. It only takes the good sense to follow the common law of the world.

I see 2FAST4U has been hard at work spreading his lies and slander around behind the scenes again. That's OK, because he may not be aware (yet) that I've begun steps to prosecute him for his actions here on YBSB and elsewhere. Now you can PM that back to your loser friend.

Try this on for morality, Scotty_Dog: If you're saying in a public forum that I stole something that didn't belong to me, I suggest you have hard evidence supporting the accusation you're throwing - not just hearsay and gossip. You should learn to stay out of things that don't concern you. Otherwise, you may find yourself in court for slander/libel.
post #23 of 150

Re: American Warship threatens to open fire on unarmed civilian ship....in SCOTLAND!

Quote:
Originally Posted by wolfix
Presbyterians came from Scotland???? OMG!!!! I have a little Scottish blood myself , but after being married to a Presby I can easily say that it is a very bad black mark upon the Scottish soul .....

I better google up some info on the origins of Presbyterianism........ We need to be vigilant against importing of terrorism.....
...oh, yes, just hit it on wikipedia. it's all there, the links between france, scotland, john calvin & the swiss influence, and (dare i say) john knox! i imagine that the c.i.a. has known about this cabal for a long time and the that n.s.a. has many intercepts deciphered which show conclusively how this band of religious radicals are bent on world domination. [and need i mention these four words?! scottish rite free masonry?] i'd be more than a little trigger happy if i saw a wee scottish ferry plying the same route for 90 years headed toward my highly advanced war ship in those waters... these are dangerous times. don't you watch the republicans' commercials?
post #24 of 150

Re: American Warship threatens to open fire on unarmed civilian ship....in SCOTLAND!

Quote:
Originally Posted by stevebaby
Unless the harbour has restricted space and the ferry has strayed into that space,then the warship is under an obligation to avoid a collision if its master believes one to be imminent.The obligation rests on the warship to change course.If the warship fails to change course,then the ferry master was correct to change his course.
If the warship's commander was not informed of the presence of a civilian ferry making regular scheduled crossings then something has gone wrong.
Given the relative speed capabilities of the two vessels it would appear that the ferry was unlikely to be in an overtaking situation.If the warship was overtaking the ferry then it is obliged to give way to it.
Transmitting on VHF16 is clearly not intended for a naval vessel."Enemy" vessels would definitely not be using VHF16,which would be available to be overheard by every civilian vessel within range.They would be using restricted naval channels available to the "friendlies".
If there was no risk of collision and the ferry was not in restricted waters then the warship has no right to tell the ferry to do anything and in British waters,no right to threaten to fire live ammunition at it.
Actually,on the face of it the warship commander may be technically liable for criminal charges.
The smaller vessel is responsible to change course.
post #25 of 150

Re: American Warship threatens to open fire on unarmed civilian ship....in SCOTLAND!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wurm
It doesn't take overweening morality to not illegally invade a sovereign nation and then murder innocent people. It only takes the good sense to follow the common law of the world.

I see 2FAST4U has been hard at work spreading his lies and slander around behind the scenes again. That's OK, because he may not be aware (yet) that I've begun steps to prosecute him for his actions here on YBSB and elsewhere. Now you can PM that back to your loser friend.

Try this on for morality, Scotty_Dog: If you're saying in a public forum that I stole something that didn't belong to me, I suggest you have hard evidence supporting the accusation you're throwing - not just hearsay and gossip. You should learn to stay out of things that don't concern you. Otherwise, you may find yourself in court for slander/libel.
This might be the most pathetic thing I have yet to see you post. You sir are an imbecile. Court? Give me a break....moron.
post #26 of 150

Re: American Warship threatens to open fire on unarmed civilian ship....in SCOTLAND!

Quote:
Originally Posted by BillM
The smaller vessel is responsible to change course.
And which Part of the International Regulations For Preventing Collisions At Sea (1972) mentions anything about the size of the vessel being a determining factor?
post #27 of 150

Re: American Warship threatens to open fire on unarmed civilian ship....in SCOTLAND!

Quote:
Originally Posted by MountainPro
there is absolutely no risk of collision...

the ferry travels across the river from the north shore to the south and back again...two ferries simultaneously serve the route.

the warship wanted to pass through the ferries path and told it to stop or it will fire a rocket (or whatever they fire on civilain craft these days) at them...

if the warship wanted past, its just a case of travelling at medium speed across the path, the ferries will adjust thier course to aviod any chance off collision.

now, hundreds of ship pass in the path these ferries...none have ever hit one. These ship include an entire naval fleet including nuclear subs, other ferry companies and ships coming to and from the ship yards dotted along the Clyde which build and refit ships from small vessels to the QE2 (twice the size of the warship in question)...

there was simply no excuse...they were being overly aggressive. The captain of the warship has apologised publically...which means he has accepted responsibility.
I don't know what the Local Regs.are for the Clyde,but in Sydney Harbour,everything bar a couple of named cargo vessels on regular runs gives way to ferries,including foreign warships.I would be surprised if the Local Regs. on the Clyde were significantly different.
As you say,Pro,the public apology by the warship's commander is an admission of liability.Regardless of his liability,a threat to use lethal force against a friendly vessel is unbelievable.
Anyone planning an attack against a warship isn't going to use a 90 year old ferry to do it.The ferry is much slower than a modern warship and the warship could easily take evasive action if it believed itself under threat. If I remember correctly the attack on USS Cole was carried out by a small,fast power boat,not a 90 year old ferry.The commander of the warship is obliged to make himself aware of local working conditions and if he failed to do so he is clearly at fault.
post #28 of 150

Re: American Warship threatens to open fire on unarmed civilian ship....in SCOTLAND!

Once bitten twice shy... The US ship is worried about a USS Cole repeat. Haha! Many sleepless nights for US naval ships.
post #29 of 150

Re: American Warship threatens to open fire on unarmed civilian ship....in SCOTLAND!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Scotty_Dog
That's quite a few "If" qualifiers factored into your statements.
Maritime Regulations contain quite a few "ifs" too.
post #30 of 150

Re: American Warship threatens to open fire on unarmed civilian ship....in SCOTLAND!

Quote:
Originally Posted by wolfix
Presbyterians came from Scotland???? OMG!!!! I have a little Scottish blood myself , but after being married to a Presby I can easily say that it is a very bad black mark upon the Scottish soul .....

I better google up some info on the origins of Presbyterianism........ We need to be vigilant against importing of terrorism.....
I have "Presbyterian" on my Birth Certificate.Presbyterians make most muslims look like wanton libertines.
The basic tenet of Presbyterianism is that if you get any enjoyment out of life at all...you're going straight to hell to burn forever while demons push sharpened spokes under your fingernails with "Achy Breaky Heart" playing in an endless loop in the background.
I lapsed at a very early age.
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