Wish I found this site before Craigslist

What specifically was wrong with the bike?

yes, please come back to us with the supposed repair needed to be done,

i woud say that for 400 usd. you did a very good deal, that is a nice bike,

I don't want to knock bike shops but they can be pretty expensive for not such difficult or "correct work." A friend of mine had an old Paramount and wanted to get somewhat lower gearing for better hill climbing. He talked to a bike shop and they were going to just change the rear gearing in the back by changing freewheels. This originally would not have been too expensive, but once they got the bike they told him it needed a new wheel for the lower gearing. Presumably they decided to go with a newer style 8 speed cassette instead of a 7 speed freewheel for some stupid reason and didn't explain any other options to him. Maybe that is all they had.

There was nothing wrong with his old wheel and the new one they sold him was the lowest end Mavic model worth less than $100. I guess they adjusted his derailleurs and checked over the bike too. Well they put on an 8 speed cassette and he only had a 7 speed index down tube shifter, so the way they made it "work" was that it had to be pushed past the last index click or he needed to run it in friction mode. When I rode with him on hills it kept popping out of the low gear because of the lack of a click position, so I "repaired" his bike by re-adjusting the rear derailleur so the lowest gear was in a click position but he no longer had a top high gear.

The bottom line is they charged him $700 which is a complete rip-off because they saw someone with money who didn't know what he was doing.  Even an overhaul of a bike should be around $100- $200 I could have gotten him a new freewheel for about $25 and had him up and running in a few minutes.  $700 was a lot of money to spend to basically get three more teeth on a cog and now he has lost his top gear. He could have bought an entire bike for that amount.

So find out what is wrong with your bike and if you really need all of the services they are trying to sell you. Also keep in mind that scratches are probably just a cosmetic issue and won't affect the performance.  Scratches are something that you certainly should have been able to see before buying and I don't think the seller pulled the wool over your eyes in that regard.  Maybe those scratches contributed to a lower price. Did it ride OK? If not, why did you buy it?

If you have any reasonable level of mechanical aptitude, you should read up on bike maintenance on-line or get a book, and buy some basic tools. This will save you a lot of money compared with paying for the work.  There are Youtube videos that show how to adjust or repair just about anything on a bike.

Here is a very reasonable price list I saw on the net from http://amerypedal.com after doing a quick Google search on bike repair prices.  So see what your shop charges in comparison.  Of course if the frame is damaged, that could be a big deal.

At $400 bucks you still have quite a bit of leeway to come out of this with a bike that is still a fair deal if not a bona fide good deal.  A quick look on the internet is showing prices from $700-1000 for used models. I'm sorry that money is scarce (ain't it so for most of us), but unless this thing is an absolute disaster you may yet have a bike that has a future with many miles left in it.

I know what AlanG is talking about though, I race for a local bike shop and end up loitering quite a bit. The retail quotes on labor and parts that customers get can be a little offputting.  I'm very glad I can do most of the work myself. Coincidentally, I had a bike shop do exactly that - fit an 8 spd on a 7 spd shifter setup on an older mountain bike. I never knew it until I went into a shop asking why I couldn't shift into one of my gears.

Ken, I hope this ends up being a good deal for you. Keep us posted.

Hey, I own a bike shop and I would like to help you out at no cost. Tell me what is broken, If I have one here I will send it to you.

Quote:

Originally Posted by goodbyecycle 

Hey, I own a bike shop and I would like to help you out at no cost. Tell me what is broken, If I have one here I will send it to you.

your nickname is a bit intriguing for a bike shop ... ?

Quote:

Originally Posted by goodbyecycle 

Hey, I own a bike shop and I would like to help you out at no cost. Tell me what is broken, If I have one here I will send it to you.

 Great offer. Post what you need and if I have anything kicking around I'll ship it to you.

I am certainly not an expert bike mechanic but I consider myself to be competent. I'm just sitting here tonight so I'll try to thoroughly  answer your questions and others can add on or correct me if they want.

There is a tool that a bike shop uses to measure the length between several links of a chain. A chain gets a bit longer as the rollers wear and it needs to be replaced if it is too long. Otherwise the worn chain will accelerate wear on your chainrings and cassette (gears on the rear wheel.)  It could be the chain is not so worn but is rusty and not working smoothly, (A sticky link or worse.)  Replacing it is a good idea but sometimes these things can be oiled and worked out to be smooth enough if you are really cheap. You can buy a 10 speed chain on-line for about $30 but I don't know what the shop wants to charge for a specific chain.

If the chain rubs against the front derailleur when the shifter is set for either the smaller or larger chainring, this is solved with a very quick and easy adjustment of the cable tension or the derailleur itself. Front derailleurs almost never wear out. If this was rubbing when you checked out the bike, you should have brought it up with the owner. (But you probably didn't notice or understand there was a problem.) In any case this should be no big deal.

Truvative is just the brand name of the crank. The crank comprises the two chain rings and the arms that hold them and connect to the pedals. I'm not sure what could be wrong with this. Is it bent somehow? A couple of worn or slightly damaged teeth on the chain ring may be no big deal but could possibly affect shifting if severe. If the chain rings are worn, the chain won't fit evenly over it or work as smoothly as it should and it will cause more wear too.

Chainrings can be replaced without the need for a new crank. They are usually held in place by 5 torx bolts and are very easy to replace without disassembling the crank. The part that goes through the bottom of the frame that each crank arm connects to is called the bottom bracket and it contains ball bearings that can wear out. If you take the chain off of the crank and then spin the crank it should be smooth, quiet, and free of play. 

The shop should be able to show and explain to you why the chainrings or the entire crank needs to be replaced.

Brake pads are just the rubber pieces that attach to the brake calipers and press against the rim to slow down the bike. It is normal for them to wear from use but I can't say at exactly what point they need replacement. They are attached by a single bolt and are also very easy to change and are not very expensive. There are some brake shoes where the pads just slide into them without needing to be removed from the calipers. There are various brands and types and most road bike brakes use similar pads. They need to be adjusted so that they close evenly on the rim and don't touch the tire. The front of pads should be angled in toward the rim very slightly to prevent squeal. This is called "toe in."

Since you are new at this I really suggest you go to Sheldon Brown's site and read this beginner section and eventually read some of the other sections if you want to learn more.

http://sheldonbrown.com/beginners/index.html

Quote:

Originally Posted by simplyserving 

As I went to the shop to hear exactly what needed to be replaced / corrected I was a bit overwhelmed. I had spent the week trying to educate myself so that I was prepared but I guess I concentrated on the wrong areas. I was so taken back by the scratches I had found later, that I was assuming it would be something structural with the frame. As many if you had commented, the frame is fine despite the scratches. I cannot remember the exact terminology or exactly everything mentioned, but the major parts needing to be replaced (at least cost wise) were the Truvitav (i think he said) double crankset, the chain, and the brake pads. The wheels had some minor denying but he said they would be good for a while. I did not realize it, but there were 2 different tires on the bike. I take it the front tire must have worn out because that was the newer of the two. He said as part of the tune-up, he would swap the two tires and put the better of the two in the back. He too felt it was a nice bike, but it needed some work to be good.

My questions are this. One, how do you know when you need a new chain? I could see where it was hitting against the front derailler and it appeared to be a bit rusty (or extremely dirty). Two, in regards to the crankset, what do I look for there? It too appeared rusty or dirty (the sprocket parts) and some of the teeth appeared slightly bent or worn. Could this and not the chain be causing the rub? Lastly, brakepads. How do I know which ones to order? Are they specific or sized?

My last question is should I take the bike for a "second opinion" or are these relatively normal components to go on a bike? I have the bike and took some pictures if that helps. If you can tell by looking at a photo (or can give an opinion) email me at ccpd206@yahoo.com and I will send you the photos. One last one, will the tires be an issue?
 

The easiest and most reliable way to measure chain wear is to use a ruler to measure the length of 12 links, and if that length is greater than 12 1/8", the chain is shot.  Also note that a "link" is actually two pieces:  a piece whose side plate is the most external and is the plate against which the link pin is pressed; a piece that follows the previously link and whose side plate sits just inside the previous link's side plate. Also, it's best to a machinist's rule, but you can get buy on a regular ruler.   

What is wrong with the crank?  It would be a surprise if the crank arms themselves were bad.  It's not of the question, but there other things used with the crank that go bad first (excepting in the case of an accident, I guess)

1. Chainrings:  these will wear more quickly if the chain has worn too much.  Also, some of the big chainring's teeth can look different.  Special tooth shapes are used on some chainrings to speed pick-up of the chain when shifting to the large chainring.  Of course, chainring teeth can get bent.
2. Bottom bracket:  this is the bearing assembly, and depending on the type of crank set, the bottom bracket axle (upon which the cranks rotate).  Some crank--newer cranks--have an integral axle, so in that case, the bottom bracket assembly is just made up of bearings and bearing cups.  No matter the case, bottom bracket bearings do need to be replaced from time to time, as is the case with all bearings.

Tires:  there's no functional reason that the front tire has to match the back tire.  I have at times had on the rear a different brand and/or color tire than on the front.  There are a very small number of tires which are different and are "supposed" to be paired together.  The only ones I can think of are the Continental Attack & Force tires.  The Attack is supposed to be used on the front in combination with the Force on the back, but the reality is that you can use 'em however you like, including separately.

Brake pads:  it's a good idea when buying a used bike to replace the brake pads anyway. Over time, brake pads can grow hard, especially if they're not used for an extended period of time. Brake pads also wear quickly, a bit less fast than tires (unless you do a lot of fast descents of mountains, through tight corners).  There are generally two types of replaceable brake pads for road bikes with cantilever brakes:  Shimano compatible and Campagnolo compatible.  A bike shop can tell you which you need, or you can just tell us what brand brake calipers you have so that we can let you know what type you need.  Generally, when the grooves are gone on the brake pads, it's time to replace them.  Some brake pads have wear indicators on the sides.

Derailleurs:  if the chain is rubbing the front derailleur cage, almost every time that can be fixed just by proper adjustment of that derailleur.

The wheels: it's not uncommon for wheels to get dents from rocks on the road. It's difficult to say much more without seeing your wheels.

The frame: you saw, and you likely saw some of the scratches.  That's not too much of a concern.  It's mostly an aesthetic issue.  A dented (depending on the location and size of any dents) or cracked frame would be a concern.

Things that wear and have to be replaced are the following:

1. Chain
2. Tires 
3. Inner tubes
4. Handlebar tape
5. Cables and cable housing
6. Brake pads
7. Bearings (the least frequent of all of these)

Of course eventually everything breaks down, but the six things I listed are the ones that go most quickly.  How quickly they go depends on how well you care for your bike and clean it, how you ride and how heavy you are, the area in which you ride (road conditions, road detritus that can puncture tires and inner tubes), and the weather where you ride (rain, heat, ...).  Obviously, the person riding their bike 10,000 miles per year is going to have things wear out more quickly than someone who rides their bike 500 miles per year.

You can post your pictures on this forum by using the "insert image" icon in the "reply" toolbar.

Quote:

Originally Posted by AlanG 

Truvative is just the brand name of the crank. The crank comprises the two chain rings and the arms that hold them and connect to the pedals. I'm not sure what could be wrong with this. Is it bent somehow? A couple of worn or slightly damaged teeth on the chain ring may be no big deal but could possibly affect shifting if severe. If the chain rings are worn, the chain won't fit evenly over it or work as smoothly as it should and it will cause more wear too.

 

Chainrings can be replaced without the need for a new crank. They are usually held in place by 5 torx bolts and are very easy to replace without disassembling the crank. The part that goes through the bottom of the frame that each crank arm connects to is called the bottom bracket and it contains ball bearings that can wear out. If you take the chain off of the crank and then spin the crank it should be smooth, quiet, and free of play. 

 

The shop should be able to show and explain to you why the chainrings or the entire crank needs to be replaced.

 

i suspect that the shop advised him to change the crankset out of some problem with the crank itself or the bottom bracket. I have personally never needed new chainrigs because of them being worn out by use. Do install a new a chain, give a tune up to your shifting and see how that works, if you get some jumping of the chain in the back, then you need to change the rear sprockets or cassette too, (remember to match the chain to the brand and the number of rear sprockets, i.e. 7, or 8, or 9 or 10)

you can still throw in another 100 or 200 and still be into the good deal zone, unfortunately cycling is an expensive sport, at least in the begginning. Having a good bike simplify riding a lot and you will be only paying for new tires and small maintenance costs most of the time.  

It really doesn't matter all that much the year when the bike was built (2007 or 2008). Cycling markets are not like cars, sure a car looses another 10% of market value every year when they are sold second hand, a bike doesnt. It is good for you to know the year just as an estimate of all the miles ridden on it, but that is highly subjective on a bike, it really depends on the former owner.