Rujano and Giro Mountain Classification

DiabloScott

Just gotta say, he's a lot more fun to watch than Virenque in his last years. Rujano actually influences the whole race whereas Virenque (in le Tour) was more of a sideshow.

Still it would be more interesting if there was someone challenging him for every point.

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gntlmn

I realize Parra is in a support position to Rujano, but I cannot help but be more impressed with Ivan Parra, with his back to back stage wins on awesome mountain stages. He's the only one to do that in the Giro since Pantani, and Pantani had to abandon that year because he was found after that second stage win to have excessive hematocrit. In other words, Parra is in a league of his own.

DiabloScott

True - Parra's two victories were glorious and exciting.

If he could be awarded them, he'd have 6 ProTour points... but he's not on a ProTour team.

If they could be ranked, Selle Italia - Columbia would be ranked higher than Euskaltel-Euskadi on the Team Classification of the Pro Tour... but they can't.

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El Loto

Selle Italia are one of my favourite teams. I remember watching them on TV at the 2004 Tour de Langkawi. Fredy Gonzalez won the race and Marlon Perez provided a lot of character. In the 2005 Langkawi race I was amazed by Rujano's ability to fire away so much going up the Genting climb and also his ability as a handy time-triallist. Rujano has awesome ability and I wouldn't be surprised if he one the Giro one day. The reason Selle Italia are so prominent in the race is their wildcard status. This means they just attack and attack and provide far more entertainment than the other teams.

limerickman

I agree with you.
And I think your comparison to Virenque is salient.

I am very impressed with Rujano and indeed Parra (he's the younger brother of 1980's TDF Columbian cyclist, Fabio Parra).

The point system for the Pro-Tour needs tweaking : Parra deserves more points for his back to back victories in the Giro.

ilpirata

Yes Parra is certainly spectacular, and Rujano is no slouch either. The Italians do not have the luxury of letting Rujano go again. He has legittimate possibilities for the gc. Savoldelli and DiLuca will be in defensive mode for as long as possible on Thursday. Simoni, and Rujano are certain to attack.
As for Pantani, I can assure you that the hematocrit reading was not genuine. But race fixing at the highest level, to promote betting profits (see my topic on 1999 tour). Then nor now as you know, was high hematocrit of it's own a proof of doping. Parra can be placed in league of his own if you wish, but certainly not yet in the league of the mythical one.

DiabloScott

I think he's Fabio's nephew actually... don't quote me. He reminds me a little of Chiapucci.

The point system does need tweaking, but Parra gets NO ProTour points and SI-C gets NO ProTour team points. The points for first place are simply not awarded for his two victories, similarly for Rujano's third. In fact, if Parra had somehow won Paris-Nice (the first PT race of the year) he would have been the virtual PT leader, but they would have given the ugly white jersey to the second place guy (assuming HE was on a PT team).

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limerickman

I thought that he was Parra's nephew as well, when I heard Columbian climber
named Parra.
I thought there is no way that they could be brothers.........
But Sean Kelly said on Eurosport that he was speaking with Parra (1980's Parra) and he (Fabio) said that Ivan was his younger brother, to SK !
They're 20 odd years apart in age, it seems.
Maybe Sean got it wrong but that's what he said on ES.

They also had the points debate on Eurosport and about how a one day classic win gets Protour points but a stage win (that can be as tough as a classic race) get nowt.
Parras exploits - apart from winning those two stages - don't contribute to Selle Italia pointswise in the Protour competition (are Selle Italia in the Protour, anyhow ?).
I think that this is just one weakness with the Protour concept.

DiabloScott

No, Selle Italia aren't in the Pro Tour, that's why any points earned by anyone on the team aren't awarded. But since PT points have eliminated UCI ratings, PT riders and Continental Team riders aren't even ranked in the same system. I see why they don't rank the teams, but if a guy earns PT points he ought to be able to put them in his palmares and his name ought to appear on the same list with everybody else.

In Grand Tours, stage wins get 3, 2, and 1 point (for first, second, and third). For smaller stage races, the winner of a stage gets 1 point only. TTs get no points in any stage race.

Compare that to 50 points for a Monument win, 40 points for a Classic win. I think one of the reasons they limit the points on GT stage wins is the same as the 3km time rule - for safety's sake you don't want people sprinting for 25th place. But still, there has to be some parity. And if you gave too many points for a stage win in a GT the sprinters would dominate the ProTour competition and the GT specialists would get short changed.

Lots of kinks to work out.

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limerickman

You're right - I am not going to argue with you on these points.
I think that it is crazy that a guy can go out and win back to back hard mountain stages in the Giro and get no Protour points regardless of whether his team is in the Protour or not.
In fairness SK said that he thought that it was unfair - he made the point that Stage 14 win was the equivalent of a Tour of Flanders win !

mareblu

Rujano was a great surprise and a joy to watch him too (I'm from Venezuela myself!)

DiabloScott

I love his "incredible hulk" nickname. Anyone remember the last time a mountains jersey wearer won a GT mountain stage??? I have to go way back to Hinault off the top of my head.

AND... by rights he should have 53 ProTour points which would put him in the top 20... but by rule he has NONE.

I hope he gets a great contract for next year.

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limerickman

He had a great Giro - a superb performance and I am personally delighted for
Selle Italia. Rujano had a great win today.
I agree with Diablo it is a terrible shame that Parra, Rujano and the team get no acknowledgement in respect of Protour points.

El Loto

Savio, Selle-Italia's team boss, wants to build the team around Rujano as he believes he can win the Giro in the next two years. I share that belief. And the Incredible Hunk nickname is awesome.