Best Cycling City

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your pick let me hear your thoughts!
Seattime

Don Shipp

Cambridge.
Actually London really isn't that bad either. Really.

__________________
"Boudreaux pissed me off, what should I do?"
"Nothing, just shut up and take his advice."

seattime

What does the city do to make it so? Bike lanes, attractions?
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Don Shipp

Cambridge just has lots of bikes (and people riding them.) A good cycling city is one where cyclists have a real presence on the road and don't feel like they don't belong there.
Cycle-lanes are not there to help cyclists. They are there to persuade motorists to cycle. There might just be a big debate about this.

__________________
"Boudreaux pissed me off, what should I do?"
"Nothing, just shut up and take his advice."

seattime

Interesting thought. The idea of the bike lane is advertisment. The city could make a bunch of money with that idea but seriously that means there is still way too much focus on the automobile and don't you think that the whole idea behind lanes is to give legal right to the road to the bikes?
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Don Shipp

Bikes already have legal right to use all of road with or without cycle lanes. If anything, lanes restricts freedom of cyclists.

Answers to questions asked to motorists:-
"Why don't you cycle?" "Because it isn't safe."
"Why isn't it safe?" "Too many cars."
"What can be done to make roads safe for cyclists?" "Put cycle lanes on roads."
"Then would you leave the car at home and cycle?" "Yes, of course."

This is how motorists asked for, and got, cycle lanes. Which they don't use.

__________________
"Boudreaux pissed me off, what should I do?"
"Nothing, just shut up and take his advice."

seattime

So what makes a cycling city more user friendly? If they don't put up lanes for novice cyclist should there be a licensing for riding a bike?
Question: Your 12 yearold Child wants to ride his bike to school. 3 options...
1) he can make it there in 5 minutes taking streets that have no lanes.
2) he can make it there in 15 minutes using a round about with lanes.
3) get in the car kid.
-I hate using the child for instant but it gives a since of ownership to the question.
Fantastic conversation
Seattime

Don Shipp

Having separate lanes for novice cyclists is as useful as having separate lanes for novice drivers.
One of my children walks to school, the walk takes him about 35 mins. He could do it much quicker on the bike, although he has no wish to. The route includes one road which would be very dangerous for an inexperienced cyclist and I would be worried if he wanted to ride it. I guess that I would insist that he demonstrates his competence before allowing him to ride on a road that I consider dangerous.
I do not think that any cycle lane that I have ever seen has made the road safer for cyclists, and many are so badly designed that they actually make things worse. Both motorists and cyclists tend to take less notice of each other on roads with cycle lanes, which is counter productive in terms of road safety and acceptance of the bike as a legitimate form of transport.

__________________
"Boudreaux pissed me off, what should I do?"
"Nothing, just shut up and take his advice."

seattime

I guess there is a 4th option All in all though do we allow the novice to fend for themselves -trial by error. Do we see that the laws protect all as a equal. What is the remedy? How about a town where the option is one or the other?
Seattime

Don Shipp

The laws do protect cyclists as much as motorists. But when accidents happen, it is the protection of a steel shell and airbags that we miss the most.
I see too many cyclists who ride in defiance of the law to say that more should be done to protect them. Travelling is slightly risky, but the risks can be reduced by sensible behaviour on a bike.
There are places where badly designed roads increase the chance of an accident, these places are best avoided in my opinion.
Attempts to separate bikes and motor traffic in new towns such as Stevenage and Milton Keynes, which were built on green field sites, have not improved the competence of cyclists or reduced the numbers of serious accidents.

__________________
"Boudreaux pissed me off, what should I do?"
"Nothing, just shut up and take his advice."

seattime

Is this a study for a site that had either/ or? If so where can I find info on them? We have hundreds of miles of bike lanes in our city. The reality is that we still have accidents and people still die or are hurt badly. More less I have had my run-ins with motorists which I am part time myself. The only thing I have said to a cyclist while I was driving was "wheres your helmet?" but on the other hand I have had the crap scared out of me with motorists.
Do you believe that the close calls are more frequient with motorist to motorist then motorist to bicycles (per capita).
Seattime

Don Shipp

Bike lanes and helmets. Oh dear. So much to discuss.
And I have to go now. I am about to cycle off home and I trust that I will arrive safely. By the way, I live in London and since the bombings last week I have seen a lot of new cyclists on the road on old bikes. Some would definately be safer on a bus or tube.
TTFN

__________________
"Boudreaux pissed me off, what should I do?"
"Nothing, just shut up and take his advice."

seattime

Ride safe and make it's simplicity not built upon possibility

Don Shipp

I got home OK thanks.

__________________
"Boudreaux pissed me off, what should I do?"
"Nothing, just shut up and take his advice."