If Hillary gets the nod.....

desert_RAT

Would you vote for Hillary Clinton? Assuming she wins the Democratic primary.

Yes or no. Explain.

My answer. No. Hell no. Never...............Of course I would never vote for a liberal, man or woman.

wolfix

Hillary is the King Kong of the Democratic Party. She helped shape the 2004 election. She did not want a 2004 victory by the Democratic Party. And her behavior showed that. If Kerry was elected, her political goals would be over. She knew America was not ready for a woman in 2004. She knows that the stars must be alighned correctly for a victory for her in 2008.
Hillary is attempting right now to move to the middle of the road politically and yet not lose too many of the liberal votes. She needs the middle.
Right now she is the only Democrat that is considered remotely qualified to be elected. The liberals are jumping onto the Feingold bandwagon, but that in itself shows how out of touch they are with American politics.
Hillary would never be a vice president either. She has already had power in the Whitehouse, more then Gore did when Bill was President.
Hillary knows politics. She is a survivor. She has been part of winning Presidential election twice. On the inside. Her lack of support for Gore in 2000 showed how much contempt the Clintons had for Gore.
A more intersting question would be a McCain/Rice GOP ticket...... The most obvious response would be that America is not ready for a black or a women ticket.... But the GOP would be in line for a massive turnout of the black voting block and the female voting block..... The few votes they lose would be made up in those other 2 catagories.....

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rule62

Why not...she's already been the President anyway.

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lumpy

Yes. And I'd never vote for a conservative/Republican.

wolfix

As a Californian, your vote matters little anyway. I'm not saying that your opinion does not matter, because every opinion matters. But elections are won by the swing vote, and by the time the swing vote in California starts showing in the polls on election day, the election is over.
Parties win elections by identifing their voters. This is why the Dems have lost in recent times. The Democratic Party has a different agenda for each voting block. The Republicans registered in America have a smaller number, but they vote. Republicans know who they are and what they stand for. The Democratic Party has factions inside it that are not on the same wave lenght.
An example .... The Dems cater to the gay voters, but blue collor workers who are the Democratic voting base have a different opinion in that issue. The blue collor workers also hate to see part of their take home pay go to social service programs that do not have agood success record. And blue collor workers have shifted their votes more to the right in recent elections. The dems in power cater to the left and that is why they lose election after election.

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limerickman

Question for you - apart from Hillary Clinton (and we don't know if she is going to run for election or not), who else do the Democrats have as a possible
contender?

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.."But finally the last thing I’ll say to the people who don’t believe in cycling, the cynics and the sceptics. I'm sorry for you. I’m sorry that you can’t dream big. [I]I'm sorry you don't believe in miracles. You should believe in these athletes, and you should believe in these people. I'll be a fan of the Tour de France for as long as I live. And there are no secrets" - this is a hard sporting event and hard work wins it - Armstrong 2005 TDF
morelike hypocrisy.

wolfix

The Democrats historically don't get a real solid feel until the primarys, but right now Kerry looks to be putting himself into position. Edwards who was Kerry's running mate in the last election is a forerunner.. But Hillary is the one most everyone feels is the choice. But she has problems too.... She has backed Bush on many Iraq issues and that has alienated the Muslim vote. The gays are not fond of her because of the same sex marriage situation.
There are others .....both the govs from N Mexico and Arizona are being talked about....
The issues that will be important are
* Illegal immagration .....
* Iraq war [depending on what happens in the next 2 years}
* Family values .... Canidates need to distance themselves from the
Hollywood set.
Hillary is strong in these areas.. She has moved towards labor , a big voting base that is a 2 headed monster.....Organized labor wants illegal immagration shut down , and the Hispanics are opposed to it....
Hillary stands a better chance of winning then most people give her credit for.... Again, Hillary is a politician that has been on a winning ticket before....

__________________
"I rule my world with a cellphone."

wolfix

Clinton would never be a VP. That position does not interest her at all. Her present situation has more prestige then a VP... Edwards may be the one nominated, but Clinton will not be his running mate.
McCain seems to have the inside track to the GOP nomination. Depending on who runs for the Dems, McCain is liked by all Repubs and many Dems.... He would have a very good chance to secure the Presidency with the undecided Democratic votes.
Interesting thing about Hillary. She holds her own with the male vote, but surprisingly many women feel betrayed by her because of the Bill Clinton scandal. Many women feel she should have dumped him instead of acting like a victimized wife. That will not be a issue though when 2008 rolls around.
And some people feel Kerry would have done much better if he would have acknowledged his Catholic faith...
But if the Dems could not pull it off in 2004 they are going to have a real problem in 2008 if the Iraq war gets turned around. As unpopular as Bush is right now, the polls show he still would probably win if an election were held today. That's the state of the Democratic Party. Even though I tend to vote Republican,I still feel this country is better off if both parties are strong.
The Repubs faced a unhappy country in the 1976 election .... But Carter was so bad that he handed the Repubs 12 straight years. Elections with landslide victories... The Democrats need someone that is not in the public view now to do that for them....

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"I rule my world with a cellphone."

limerickman

Wolf,

Thanks for the summary - I remember Edwards in the last election - he cut a pertty good image and he seemed to be articulate at least.
Would John Kerry run again?

Regarding Hillary - she's a smart lady, I'm not sure that she's presidential material, although with that current clown in office, an amoeba would be considered presidential material.

It always intrigued me why the likes of Mario Cuomo never ran for President.
(I'm not putting him for for 2008 - I was wondering why he never ran in 1988/1992).
From what I read about him - he seemed to be very accomplished.

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.."But finally the last thing I’ll say to the people who don’t believe in cycling, the cynics and the sceptics. I'm sorry for you. I’m sorry that you can’t dream big. [I]I'm sorry you don't believe in miracles. You should believe in these athletes, and you should believe in these people. I'll be a fan of the Tour de France for as long as I live. And there are no secrets" - this is a hard sporting event and hard work wins it - Armstrong 2005 TDF
morelike hypocrisy.

Chance3290

I hate to sound sinister, but I think she would take the VP slot, and then take over as president, when someone happened to the elected president.
After the '04 elections I thought Barack Obama would get the nod in '08, with hillary as his running mate. If that's the case, he needs to make sure he has a good bulletproof vest and, against current policy, make sure he is always in very close proximity to hillary.

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Please, don't MOO at the cows. It only confuses them.

wolfix

Hillary would never take the VP job..... She was a more powerful figure when she was wife of the President then Gore was. The VP is a step down. The VP job is a job taken to be next in line as President if your 2 terms were successful. So we would be talking about the election of 2016 and she would be too old.....
She carries more political weight now then the VP ever did.

__________________
"I rule my world with a cellphone."

Chance3290

...or in case something happens to the president. Accidents happen...presidents fall down...people get depressed....Is that right Vince? Vince?

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Please, don't MOO at the cows. It only confuses them.

wolfix

I think Kerry would love to run, but the party knows the results of having a man run that lost once. Kerry is tied to closely to the liberals.....
Here in America, we have about 4 main political agendas...

We have the right wing .... Not to be confused with Republicans. This is the group that is the anti-abortion, I want a gun to protect my family, and let's eliminate anybody that does not go to my church ..... They think government is evil.

Then we have Republicans which consist of individuals that operate small and large business's, farmers, individuals who want smaller government, and individuals who do not want money spent on failed social programs.They want personal and government responsability.

Then you have the liberals....They are the ones who want failed government programs because " It's the right thing to do," individuals who want government intrusion into all aspects of everyones lives except for their hedonistic lifestyles such as abortion on demand, NAMBLA [National Asociation of Man/Boy Love], individuals who think they are progressive because they have a theory that might work better then something that does work , and their solution to everything is throwing money away. Oh yeah ... They think society is to blame for everything and basically they think personal responsibility is just a Republican thing.

Then you have Democrats which consist of the working man that has family values and labor issues as their agenda.

Both the liberals and right wingers have torn apart 2 good parties.... And if a liberal/right winger ever tell you that they a Dem/Repub don't believe them.

His accomplishments in New York City have been witnessed. But the rest of the country has a view of New York politicians that might not lead to a Presidential nomination. New Yorker's have a view of themselves that is not consistent with the rest of the country. And I would think a politician in a city like New York/Chicago might not hold up to an image a President must have while running. The average American does not identify with New York. Plus, his nomination would be the same voting block as Kerry's and Hillary's..... That would be too much fighting in the same house over the same votes.
I also think many politicians see the shape of the National Democratic Party and do not want on a sinking ship. Giving the Party leadership to Howard Dean is a prime example. He is not popular with anyone in the Party nor with voters. But why did they do it?

__________________
"I rule my world with a cellphone."

wolfix

And it was over 30 hours until Hillary went public with the death announcement....

__________________
"I rule my world with a cellphone."