20x20; SST; FTP... %HRMax

21-12.-2007, 08:07 AM	#1
catlike Registered User Join Date: Jun 2007 Posts: 32	20x20; SST; FTP... %HRMax I know that training by Heart rate is considered old school or inefficient on this forum, but i do not have a powermeter, i doubt i will have one in next 10 or so years. So, can somebody convert the terms like 20x20 or SST, FTP to % of HRmax terminology? Or point a link to thread where the training is described based on %HRMax? Advice for a good book (with winter training plans) for person who can exercise only 5-10 hours per week needed as well. P.S. I did use search machine, but with little success

21-12.-2007, 08:36 AM	#2
wiredued Registered User Join Date: Aug 2004 Posts: 1,117	Re: 20x20; SST; FTP... %HRMax Most of the terms are defined here http://www.cyclingforums.com/t386984.html FWIW I only do about three hours a week right now and it seems to be enough to maintain fitness and improve a little too. I do 3x20s mostly thats 3 intervals 20 minutes each with a five minute break inbetween intervals. I don't go by Max heart rate(185bpm age early 40s) but I stay close to threshold (163bpm for me) In heart rate if I choose the right intensity (19.9mph lately on the KKR) it looks like this 1)153avg-162max, 2)159avg 164max, 3)161avg-166max time above zone(164 or higher) 1 to 5 minutes. That is SST aproximately (Sweet Spot Training) if I get 159bpm average during the second interval without going above 164bpm. __________________ Romans 5:10 For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life. http://www.earnharts.com/html/reala...ecific.asp?id=3

21-12.-2007, 08:44 AM	#3
Piotr Registered User Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Draper, Utah Posts: 393	Re: 20x20; SST; FTP... %HRMax You will find power as well as HR levels here: http://www.cyclingpeakssoftware.com/power411/levels.asp You still need to estimate your HR at FTP to use these levels for training. You should find all information you need by browsing the links on the left. __________________ blog

21-12.-2007, 10:51 AM	#4
Alex Simmons Registered User Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Sydney, Australia Posts: 1,561	Re: 20x20; SST; FTP... %HRMax I posted this on another forum recently: Typically intervals are best set in a power band with a given duration, rest period and number of intervals (and sometime a number of sets). For shorter efforts (20 min or less), HR is not a useful guide to intensity. Be aware of what is known as "cardiac drift", i.e. the tendenciy for HR to rise with time when performing a steady state effort. Here is an example of a 1 hour hardish tempo ride. Power line is the squiggly yellow line (avg is shown by the horizontal dotted line) and HR is the red line. See how HR drifts up over time. Same thing happens in the classic 2x20min interval sets. Indeed note how HR takes a few minutes to rise after power has already reached the targeted level. Hence if you rode to a stready HR, your power (IOW speed) would actually fall over time, making the intervals less effective. Another proxy for power is speed on a home trainer (as long as the trainer has a consistent resistence level). __________________ http://alex-cycle.blogspot.com/ http://www.cyclecoach.com/

22-12.-2007, 04:22 AM

dkrenik

Registered User

Join Date: Dec 2003

Location: Colorado

Posts: 216

Re: 20x20; SST; FTP... %HRMax

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alex Simmons

Another proxy for power is speed on a home trainer (as long as the trainer has a consistent resistence level).

I was just going to say the same thing...

Before getting a PM, I used speed/PE as a proxy for power on my rollers for years. While not ideal, it's certainly better than going by HR.

Dave

22-12.-2007, 06:54 AM	#6
wfrogge Registered User Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 5	Re: 20x20; SST; FTP... %HRMax Use HR and find out your LTHR and use that as your "FTP" number. After you use this number to base your zones. Remember what it feels like in each zone AKA PE.. percieved effort. When you start doing your 2x20 SST intervals use your HR as a guide but dont become a slave to it.... Allow it to raise and lower long as your PE stays steady. Again dont become a slave to the HR zones!!! There will be some upward drift with your HR when you do SST intervals no doubt if not..... theres a good chance youre doing sub SST work. Remember what it feels like when you ride at LTHR and confirm with your HRM. Use this PE as your guide with SST intervals.

22-12.-2007, 10:36 AM

London knight

Registered User

Join Date: Oct 2007

Posts: 8

Re: 20x20; SST; FTP... %HRMax

Quote:

Originally Posted by wfrogge

Use HR and find out your LTHR and use that as your "FTP" number. After you use this number to base your zones. Remember what it feels like in each zone AKA PE.. percieved effort. When you start doing your 2x20 SST intervals use your HR as a guide but dont become a slave to it.... Allow it to raise and lower long as your PE stays steady.

Again dont become a slave to the HR zones!!! There will be some upward drift with your HR when you do SST intervals no doubt if not..... theres a good chance youre doing sub SST work. Remember what it feels like when you ride at LTHR and confirm with your HRM. Use this PE as your guide with SST intervals.

This is what I did, On a day when I felt fairly well rested, I performed a 2x20 session and found my L4 based on heart rate, at the same time I monitored my average speed, cadence and gearing to estimate my workload. Subsequent workouts are all based on the same cadence and gearing and trying to maintain same average speed. Improvements are monitored by increases in average speed, from workout to workout. I pretty much ignore the heart rate as I have found it to be extremely variable. Although this method is not as accurate as a PM. It feels very much like the 2x20s everyone here describes where the last 5-10 minutes i tend to reach L4 in terms of HR and PE.

22-12.-2007, 03:32 PM	#8
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24-12.-2007, 04:44 AM

luban

Registered User

Join Date: Dec 2006

Posts: 5

Re: 20x20; SST; FTP... %HRMax

Please help me,I am able to paste any graph from athlete homepage to this question or in Word document,for example Mean Maximal Power Curve,but I am not able to do it with the horizontal graph of single ride as You did it in Your reply.Please,what is the right technicue for copying and pasteing of horizontal graph to the Word document or this reply?Thanks for Your answer.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alex Simmons

I posted this on another forum recently:

Typically intervals are best set in a power band with a given duration, rest period and number of intervals (and sometime a number of sets). For shorter efforts (20 min or less), HR is not a useful guide to intensity.

Be aware of what is known as "cardiac drift", i.e. the tendenciy for HR to rise with time when performing a steady state effort. Here is an example of a 1 hour hardish tempo ride. Power line is the squiggly yellow line (avg is shown by the horizontal dotted line) and HR is the red line. See how HR drifts up over time.

Same thing happens in the classic 2x20min interval sets. Indeed note how HR takes a few minutes to rise after power has already reached the targeted level.

Hence if you rode to a stready HR, your power (IOW speed) would actually fall over time, making the intervals less effective.

Another proxy for power is speed on a home trainer (as long as the trainer has a consistent resistence level).

11-01.-2008, 03:28 AM	#10
kopride Registered User Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 379	Re: 20x20; SST; FTP... %HRMax A post to overcome spam. Personally, I can get enough Hot Sell, but Tyson's practice of posting just to stay ahead might work.

11-01.-2008, 10:46 AM	#11
Sillyoldtwit Registered User Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: IN PEACE AND QUIET Posts: 1,316	Re: 20x20; SST; FTP... %HRMax Hello again! __________________

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