Bike pron

Resound

I rather like the look of this:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/bike/2250039138/

No lube needed and sounds like it'd last longer than a conventional chain as
well. I wonder what it feels like to ride. Oh, and the Ti SS roadie wouldn't
go astray either.

Theo Bekkers

Resound wrote:
> I rather like the look of this:
> http://www.flickr.com/photos/bike/2250039138/
>
> No lube needed and sounds like it'd last longer than a conventional
> chain as well. I wonder what it feels like to ride. Oh, and the Ti SS
> roadie wouldn't go astray either.

How do you change the belt?

Theo

steve46au

The seatstay appears to be bolted to the chainstay, in which undo seatstay, switch belts and re-bolt seatstay.

Nick Payne

Usually the dropout would be detachable to allow the belt to be fitted,
though that doesn't seem to be the case with the frame pictured. I met a
rider on the Fitz's Challenge a couple of years ago who was riding a toothed
belt drive bike with a Rohloff hub. The drive belt was a smaller version of
what's used on some motorcycles. He was a fitter from Bathurst and had got a
local framebuilder to make him the frame with detachable dropout. The
chainring and cog he had machined himself. He gave the advantages of the
belt drive as:

Longer life than a chain
Quieter than a chain
No lubrication or cleaning needed
He could sling the bike in the back seat of the car without worrying about
getting the upholstery dirty

"Theo Bekkers" <tbekkers@bekkers.com.au> wrote in message
news:47bfa389$1@news.bekkers.com.au...
> Resound wrote:
>> I rather like the look of this:
>> http://www.flickr.com/photos/bike/2250039138/
>>
>> No lube needed and sounds like it'd last longer than a conventional
>> chain as well. I wonder what it feels like to ride. Oh, and the Ti SS
>> roadie wouldn't go astray either.
>
> How do you change the belt?
>
> Theo
>

PeteSig

"Nick Payne" wrote:
> Usually the dropout would be detachable to allow the belt to be fitted,
> though that doesn't seem to be the case with the frame pictured. I met a
> rider on the Fitz's Challenge a couple of years ago who was riding a
> toothed belt drive bike with a Rohloff hub. The drive belt was a smaller
> version of what's used on some motorcycles. He was a fitter from Bathurst
> and had got a local framebuilder to make him the frame with detachable
> dropout. The chainring and cog he had machined himself. He gave the
> advantages of the belt drive as:
>
> Longer life than a chain
> Quieter than a chain
> No lubrication or cleaning needed
> He could sling the bike in the back seat of the car without worrying about
> getting the upholstery dirty

Disadvantages:

Big $$$$. No affordable Deore derailleur gears possible, it's the expense of
Rohloff (I'd love one if I could muster the $$$$) or you go single speed.
Need a frame with a break in the seatstay or chainstay to be able to change
the belt, structurally weaker.

--
Cheers
Peter

~~~ ~ _@
~~ ~ _- \,
~~ (*)/ (*)

TimC

On 2008-02-23, PeteSig (aka Bruce)
was almost, but not quite, entirely unlike tea:
>
> "Nick Payne" wrote:
>> Usually the dropout would be detachable to allow the belt to be fitted,
>> though that doesn't seem to be the case with the frame pictured. I met a
>> rider on the Fitz's Challenge a couple of years ago who was riding a
>> toothed belt drive bike with a Rohloff hub. The drive belt was a smaller
>> version of what's used on some motorcycles. He was a fitter from Bathurst
>> and had got a local framebuilder to make him the frame with detachable
>> dropout. The chainring and cog he had machined himself. He gave the
>> advantages of the belt drive as:

I saw one of these locally (of all places), and it looked pretty good.
Reckoned the belt life was 16,000km. Apart from below, I wonder what
the energy transmission/efficiency is like.

>> Longer life than a chain
>> Quieter than a chain
>> No lubrication or cleaning needed
>> He could sling the bike in the back seat of the car without worrying about
>> getting the upholstery dirty
>
> Disadvantages:
>
> Big $$$$. No affordable Deore derailleur gears possible, it's the expense of
> Rohloff (I'd love one if I could muster the $$$$) or you go single speed.
> Need a frame with a break in the seatstay or chainstay to be able to change
> the belt, structurally weaker.

Wait a few more years, and we'll be able to cut and join them:

http://www.smh.com.au/news/science/...3467243895.html
http://news.smh.com.au/the-power-of...80221-1tga.html

--
TimC
"Mango sorbet is clearcut proof that we have progressed beyond the
bare needs of survival and have progressed to the transcendant."
- Marc Goodman in talk.bizarre

Resound

"PeteSig" <petesig@bigpond.com> wrote in message
news:MdTvj.18294$421.13658@news-server.bigpond.net.au...
>
> "Nick Payne" wrote:
>> Usually the dropout would be detachable to allow the belt to be fitted,
>> though that doesn't seem to be the case with the frame pictured. I met a
>> rider on the Fitz's Challenge a couple of years ago who was riding a
>> toothed belt drive bike with a Rohloff hub. The drive belt was a smaller
>> version of what's used on some motorcycles. He was a fitter from Bathurst
>> and had got a local framebuilder to make him the frame with detachable
>> dropout. The chainring and cog he had machined himself. He gave the
>> advantages of the belt drive as:
>>
>> Longer life than a chain
>> Quieter than a chain
>> No lubrication or cleaning needed
>> He could sling the bike in the back seat of the car without worrying
>> about getting the upholstery dirty
>
> Disadvantages:
>
> Big $$$$. No affordable Deore derailleur gears possible, it's the expense
> of Rohloff (I'd love one if I could muster the $$$$) or you go single
> speed.
> Need a frame with a break in the seatstay or chainstay to be able to
> change the belt, structurally weaker.
>

Would the seat stay being bolted to the dropout have to be appreciably
weaker? You'd certainly want some threadlock compound in there, but other
than that I personally wouldn't be worried about it breaking or otherwise
coming apart. For a commute/recreation bike I reckon 7-8 gears would do the
trick, so you could go with a Nexus hub instead. I still like the look of
that SS though. Less than 5½kg of thrashity goodness would make it an utter
joy to stomp through city traffic.

Dave Hughes

On Sun, 24 Feb 2008 13:50:48 +1100, Resound wrote:

> Would the seat stay being bolted to the dropout have to be appreciably
> weaker?

Given the number of high end dual suspension bikes with a pivot bolt
either on the seat stay or chain stay, I can't see it being a major
problem. I've had a couple bikes like that where I've had no problems from
the rear of the bike despite riding that has caused significant mechanical
problems elsewhere.

Both beams would probably need to be a touch stronger since there
could be a bit of movement, but not dramatically so. Using steel there
should even be sufficient flex for the belt to pass through without
needing a removeable section. Overall weight increase ( a few 10s of
grams at most) would be insignificant given you're talking commuter bikes
with hub gears.

--
Dave Hughes - dave@hired-goons.net
You're a classic example of that inverse
ratio between the size of the mouth and the
size of the brain - Doctor Who

Nick Payne

"PeteSig" <petesig@bigpond.com> wrote in message
news:MdTvj.18294$421.13658@news-server.bigpond.net.au...
>
> "Nick Payne" wrote:
>> Usually the dropout would be detachable to allow the belt to be fitted,
>> though that doesn't seem to be the case with the frame pictured. I met a
>> rider on the Fitz's Challenge a couple of years ago who was riding a
>> toothed belt drive bike with a Rohloff hub. The drive belt was a smaller
>> version of what's used on some motorcycles. He was a fitter from Bathurst
>> and had got a local framebuilder to make him the frame with detachable
>> dropout. The chainring and cog he had machined himself. He gave the
>> advantages of the belt drive as:
>>
>> Longer life than a chain
>> Quieter than a chain
>> No lubrication or cleaning needed
>> He could sling the bike in the back seat of the car without worrying
>> about getting the upholstery dirty
>
> Disadvantages:
>
> Big $$$$. No affordable Deore derailleur gears possible, it's the expense
> of Rohloff (I'd love one if I could muster the $$$$) or you go single
> speed.
>
That's the short-sighted view. I have three bikes with Rohloff hubs (a
single, the wife's single, and a tandem) and also four derailleur-equipped
bikes. I think that over the projected 100,000km life of the hub (that's
Rohloff's claim) I'll probably get out the other end more cheaply. Up front
you don't have to buy STI/Ergo shifters, a rear hub, a cassette, front and
rear derailleurs, or two of the three front chainrings. Running costs are
minimal - on none of the hubs have I had to do anything more than an annual
oil change. Chains seem to last about three times longer than on a
derailleur system - never getting derailed and always having a perfect
chainline. The rear cog is reversible, so when it wears out (no sign of it
yet) you reverse it so that the load is now on the unworn side of the teeth.
The shifting cables are supposed to be replaced at 40,000km. I'm probably
past that point on the oldest of the hubs, but I'm waiting for the cables to
break.

Nick

Jack Russell

Nick Payne wrote:
> "PeteSig" <petesig@bigpond.com> wrote in message
> news:MdTvj.18294$421.13658@news-server.bigpond.net.au...
>
>>
>> "Nick Payne" wrote:
>>
>>> Usually the dropout would be detachable to allow the belt to be
>>> fitted, though that doesn't seem to be the case with the frame
>>> pictured. I met a rider on the Fitz's Challenge a couple of years ago
>>> who was riding a toothed belt drive bike with a Rohloff hub. The
>>> drive belt was a smaller version of what's used on some motorcycles.
>>> He was a fitter from Bathurst and had got a local framebuilder to
>>> make him the frame with detachable dropout. The chainring and cog he
>>> had machined himself. He gave the advantages of the belt drive as:
>>>
>>> Longer life than a chain
>>> Quieter than a chain
>>> No lubrication or cleaning needed
>>> He could sling the bike in the back seat of the car without worrying
>>> about getting the upholstery dirty
>>
>>
>> Disadvantages:
>>
>> Big $$$$. No affordable Deore derailleur gears possible, it's the
>> expense of Rohloff (I'd love one if I could muster the $$$$) or you
>> go single speed.
>>
> That's the short-sighted view. I have three bikes with Rohloff hubs (a
> single, the wife's single, and a tandem) and also four
> derailleur-equipped bikes. I think that over the projected 100,000km
> life of the hub (that's Rohloff's claim) I'll probably get out the other
> end more cheaply. Up front you don't have to buy STI/Ergo shifters, a
> rear hub, a cassette, front and rear derailleurs, or two of the three
> front chainrings. Running costs are minimal - on none of the hubs have I
> had to do anything more than an annual oil change. Chains seem to last
> about three times longer than on a derailleur system - never getting
> derailed and always having a perfect chainline. The rear cog is
> reversible, so when it wears out (no sign of it yet) you reverse it so
> that the load is now on the unworn side of the teeth. The shifting
> cables are supposed to be replaced at 40,000km. I'm probably past that
> point on the oldest of the hubs, but I'm waiting for the cables to break.
>
> Nick
Can I ask where you got the bikes. I am thinking of getting a Thorn
Raven but would rather spend the money in Australia.





--
Remove norubbish to reply

PeteSig

"Nick Payne" wrote:
> "PeteSig" wrote in message
>>
>> Disadvantages:
>>
>> Big $$$$. No affordable Deore derailleur gears possible, it's the expense
>> of Rohloff (I'd love one if I could muster the $$$$) or you go single
>> speed.
>>
> That's the short-sighted view. I have three bikes with Rohloff hubs (a
> single, the wife's single, and a tandem) and also four derailleur-equipped
> bikes. I think that over the projected 100,000km life of the hub (that's
> Rohloff's claim) I'll probably get out the other end more cheaply.

<snip>

Yes, maybe short-sighted. But none of this changes the fact that a new
belt-drive bike, with special frame, Rohloff equipped, and all the other
grear that goes with it is bound to cost at least $4000. A bit hard to
persuade the Chief Finance Officer that this is "a really economical bike to
use, really saves us money!" IIRC the Rohloff on its own will set you back
$1800 - 2000. And all the price comparisons are done on the Shimano XT
ensemble. Well, one of my bikes does have some XT gear, but the others...
LX, or even Deore in the mix.

A Rohloff bike a la Thorn Raven or Baum is my dream bike for touring. But
I'll have to wait for the big inheritance, or take it of the super pay-out
when I retire
--
Cheers
Peter

~~~ ~ _@
~~ ~ _- \,
~~ (*)/ (*)

tim

On Feb 24, 1:57 pm, Dave Hughes <spamb...@hired-goons.net> wrote:
> Both beams would probably need to be a touch stronger since there
> could be a bit of movement, but not dramatically so.

You also have to consider that a belt drive need some tension to keep
the belt engaged so the chain^Wbelt-stay would need to be built strong
enough to support the belt tension load as well as the usual drive and
load-bearing forces.

tim
who isn't a fan of belt drives where a well guarded chain could be used

TimC

On 2008-02-24, tim (aka Bruce)
was almost, but not quite, entirely unlike tea:
> On Feb 24, 1:57 pm, Dave Hughes <spamb...@hired-goons.net> wrote:
>> Both beams would probably need to be a touch stronger since there
>> could be a bit of movement, but not dramatically so.
>
> You also have to consider that a belt drive need some tension to keep
> the belt engaged so the chain^Wbelt-stay would need to be built strong
> enough to support the belt tension load as well as the usual drive and
> load-bearing forces.

Not that much tension - there's still "teeth" in the belt and cogs.

--
TimC
"I'm gonna show you a hill that would choke a mule."
-- President G.W. Bush on his MTB, moments before losing his
front-wheel traction and flying over his bars down a steep dropoff.

Theo Bekkers

Dave Hughes wrote:
> Resound wrote:
>
>> Would the seat stay being bolted to the dropout have to be
>> appreciably weaker?
>
> Given the number of high end dual suspension bikes with a pivot bolt
> either on the seat stay or chain stay, I can't see it being a major
> problem. I've had a couple bikes like that where I've had no problems
> from the rear of the bike despite riding that has caused significant
> mechanical problems elsewhere.

That brings up another point. Can you have suspension with belt drive? I
know motorcycles do, but to do it without affecting belt tension, would not
the pivot point need to be at the centre of the bottom bracket?

Theo