Please sign the bus lane petition.

spindrift

http://www.lcc.org.uk/index.asp?PageID=1145

The evidence seems clear to me, motorbikes are faster moving, heavier,
and pose a greater risk to cyclists.

Nick

spindrift wrote:
> http://www.lcc.org.uk/index.asp?PageID=1145
>
> The evidence seems clear to me, motorbikes are faster moving, heavier,
> and pose a greater risk to cyclists.
>
I'd sign one to ban buses from bus lanes but I don't have a problem with
motorbikes.

spindrift

Nick wrote:
> spindrift wrote:
> > http://www.lcc.org.uk/index.asp?PageID=1145
> >
> > The evidence seems clear to me, motorbikes are faster moving, heavier,
> > and pose a greater risk to cyclists.
> >
> I'd sign one to ban buses from bus lanes but I don't have a problem with
> motorbikes.

LCC:


Concerns are mounting as motorcyclists are disproportionately
hazardous to cyclists and pedestrians: according to CTC, PTWs are
about 1.5 times as likely as cars to be involved in collisions which
cause serious injury to cyclists, twice as likely to be involved in
causing them serious injury and about three times as likely to be
involved in killing them, per mile travelled.

Data already collected shows an increase in the number of casualties
to motorcyclists and other road users as a result of the experiment.
Transport for London should be planning to remove the concession to
motorcyclists: they need to ensure that there is effective enforcement
of bus lane restrictions.

Paul Boyd

spindrift said the following on 28/05/2008 09:48:
> http://www.lcc.org.uk/index.asp?PageID=1145

The vast majority of the country probably don't really much care about
what happens in one city.

--
Paul Boyd
http://www.paul-boyd.co.uk/

Nick

spindrift wrote:
>
> Nick wrote:
>> spindrift wrote:
>>> http://www.lcc.org.uk/index.asp?PageID=1145
>>>
>>> The evidence seems clear to me, motorbikes are faster moving, heavier,
>>> and pose a greater risk to cyclists.
>>>
>> I'd sign one to ban buses from bus lanes but I don't have a problem with
>> motorbikes.
>
> LCC:
>
>
> Concerns are mounting as motorcyclists are disproportionately
> hazardous to cyclists and pedestrians: according to CTC, PTWs are
> about 1.5 times as likely as cars to be involved in collisions which
> cause serious injury to cyclists, twice as likely to be involved in
> causing them serious injury and about three times as likely to be
> involved in killing them, per mile travelled.
>
> Data already collected shows an increase in the number of casualties
> to motorcyclists and other road users as a result of the experiment.
> Transport for London should be planning to remove the concession to
> motorcyclists: they need to ensure that there is effective enforcement
> of bus lane restrictions.
>
>
Better to enforce sensible speed limits. How about Motorbikes are
allowed in bus lanes but only allowed to go 20 mph. Seems a bit mean to
make them wait in the queues.

spindrift

Nick wrote:
> spindrift wrote:
> >
> > Nick wrote:
> >> spindrift wrote:
> >>> http://www.lcc.org.uk/index.asp?PageID=1145
> >>>
> >>> The evidence seems clear to me, motorbikes are faster moving, heavier,
> >>> and pose a greater risk to cyclists.
> >>>
> >> I'd sign one to ban buses from bus lanes but I don't have a problem with
> >> motorbikes.
> >
> > LCC:
> >
> >
> > Concerns are mounting as motorcyclists are disproportionately
> > hazardous to cyclists and pedestrians: according to CTC, PTWs are
> > about 1.5 times as likely as cars to be involved in collisions which
> > cause serious injury to cyclists, twice as likely to be involved in
> > causing them serious injury and about three times as likely to be
> > involved in killing them, per mile travelled.
> >
> > Data already collected shows an increase in the number of casualties
> > to motorcyclists and other road users as a result of the experiment.
> > Transport for London should be planning to remove the concession to
> > motorcyclists: they need to ensure that there is effective enforcement
> > of bus lane restrictions.
> >
> >
> Better to enforce sensible speed limits. How about Motorbikes are
> allowed in bus lanes but only allowed to go 20 mph. Seems a bit mean to
> make them wait in the queues.


Possible. hard to enforce?

Plus, say there's a cycle lane feeder to an ASL. The motorbikes have
nowhere to go- I honestly can't see the buggers waiting behind the
cyclists at the lights, so this move brings faster, heavier vehicles
into conflict with cyclists.

Mark

On Wed, 28 May 2008 09:59:03 +0100, Nick <Nick.Spam@yahoo.co.uk>
wrote:

>spindrift wrote:
>> http://www.lcc.org.uk/index.asp?PageID=1145
>>
>> The evidence seems clear to me, motorbikes are faster moving, heavier,
>> and pose a greater risk to cyclists.
>>
>I'd sign one to ban buses from bus lanes but I don't have a problem with
>motorbikes.

Me too.

To the OP: Since when have motorbikes been heavier than busses?

--
(\__/) M.
(='.'=) Owing to the amount of spam posted via googlegroups and
(")_(") their inaction to the problem. I am blocking most articles
posted from there. If you wish your postings to be seen by
everyone you will need use a different method of posting.
See http://improve-usenet.org

Fr Jack

spindrift <newtyres@hotmail.com> wrote:

>http://www.lcc.org.uk/index.asp?PageID=1145
>
>The evidence seems clear to me, motorbikes are faster moving,

So are buses.

>heavier,

So are buses.

>and pose a greater risk to cyclists.

Rubbish!
--

Fr. Jack

The ex(un)civil servant

Colin McKenzie

Nick wrote:
> spindrift wrote:
>> http://www.lcc.org.uk/index.asp?PageID=1145
>> The evidence seems clear to me, motorbikes are faster moving, heavier,
>> and pose a greater risk to cyclists.

> I'd sign one to ban buses from bus lanes but I don't have a problem with
> motorbikes.

The issues are:
- Do you want to promote motorcycling?
Allowing them in bus lanes will increase their numbers throughout London.
- What are bus lanes for?
Buses.
- Why were cycles allowed in them?
Because of the effect of forcing them into the other lane (petrified
cyclists and delayed motorists). These effects do not happen with
motorbikes.
- How much space do you want when overtaken?
In a typical 3-metre bus lane, a cyclist riding far enough out to
prevent a taxi from squeezing past within the lane will leave about
1.6m gap on their right. A motorcyclist would aim at the middle of
this gap, passing within half a metre of the cyclist. At present they
try to encroach as litle as possible on the bus lane.

The recommended width for a bus lane is 4.5m. Allowing motorbikes only
in bus lanes this wide would have less direct impact on cyclists'
safety, but would still promote motorcycling.

Colin McKenzie

--
No-one has ever proved that cycle helmets make cycling any safer at
the population level, and anyway cycling is about as safe per mile as
walking.
Make an informed choice - visit www.cyclehelmets.org.

Sir Jeremy

On 28 May, 19:20, Colin McKenzie <n...@proof-read.co.uk> wrote:
> Nick wrote:
> > spindrift wrote:
> >>http://www.lcc.org.uk/index.asp?PageID=1145
> >> The evidence seems clear to me, motorbikes are faster moving, heavier,
> >> and pose a greater risk to cyclists.
> > I'd sign one to ban buses from bus lanes but I don't have a problem with
> > motorbikes.
>
> The issues are:
> - Do you want to promote motorcycling?
> Allowing them in bus lanes will increase their numbers throughout London.
> - What are bus lanes for?
> Buses.
> - Why were cycles allowed in them?
> Because of the effect of forcing them into the other lane (petrified
> cyclists and delayed motorists). These effects do not happen with
> motorbikes.
> - How much space do you want when overtaken?
> In a typical 3-metre bus lane, a cyclist riding far enough out to
> prevent a taxi from squeezing past within the lane will leave about
> 1.6m gap on their right. A motorcyclist would aim at the middle of
> this gap, passing within half a metre of the cyclist. At present they
> try to encroach as litle as possible on the bus lane.
>
> The recommended width for a bus lane is 4.5m. Allowing motorbikes only
> in bus lanes this wide would have less direct impact on cyclists'
> safety, but would still promote motorcycling.
>
> Colin McKenzie
>
> --
> No-one has ever proved that cycle helmets make cycling any safer at
> the population level, and anyway cycling is about as safe per mile as
> walking.
> Make an informed choice - visitwww.cyclehelmets.org.


What's wrong with promoting motor bikes? They certainly reduce
congestion

Nick

Colin McKenzie wrote:
> Nick wrote:
>> spindrift wrote:
>>> http://www.lcc.org.uk/index.asp?PageID=1145
>>> The evidence seems clear to me, motorbikes are faster moving, heavier,
>>> and pose a greater risk to cyclists.
>
>> I'd sign one to ban buses from bus lanes but I don't have a problem
>> with motorbikes.
>
> The issues are:
> - Do you want to promote motorcycling?
> Allowing them in bus lanes will increase their numbers throughout London.
> - What are bus lanes for?
> Buses.
> - Why were cycles allowed in them?
> Because of the effect of forcing them into the other lane (petrified
> cyclists and delayed motorists). These effects do not happen with
> motorbikes.
> - How much space do you want when overtaken?
> In a typical 3-metre bus lane, a cyclist riding far enough out to
> prevent a taxi from squeezing past within the lane will leave about 1.6m
> gap on their right. A motorcyclist would aim at the middle of this gap,
> passing within half a metre of the cyclist. At present they try to
> encroach as litle as possible on the bus lane.
>
> The recommended width for a bus lane is 4.5m. Allowing motorbikes only
> in bus lanes this wide would have less direct impact on cyclists'
> safety, but would still promote motorcycling.
>


What's wrong with promoting motorcycling. Less pollution and congestion
than cars.

I thought cyclists were allowed to use bus lanes as a reward for being a
more favourable form of transport than cars and hence to be
encouraged. Much the same reason as buses are allowed to use them.



> Colin McKenzie
>

burtthebike

"Sir Jeremy" <pete.aron@virgin.net> wrote in message
news:bd07abeb-eb90-4e49-a79b-75d2a94ca3a3@l42g2000hsc.googlegroups.com...
>>
>
>
> What's wrong with promoting motor bikes? They certainly reduce
> congestion

No. If you ride a motorcycle according to all the advice about riding
safely, you take up as much room as a car, so there is no reduction in
congestion. The picture used to promote the governments motorcycling policy
summed it up very effectively: three motorcycles taking up the space of
about six cars.

burtthebike

"Nick" <Nick.Spam@yahoo.co.uk> wrote in message
news:6a5p2oF35to1aU1@mid.individual.net...
>>
>
>
> What's wrong with promoting motorcycling. Less pollution and congestion
> than cars.

No. Motorcycles may, and only may, produce less CO2 than a car, but they
produce much more of other pollutants. This has been looked at by a Royal
Commission for transport and pollution, and they could find "no
environmental reasons for promoting motorcycling."

burtthebike

"Paul Boyd" <me@privacy.net> wrote in message
news:g1j7rc$s0m$1$8300dec7@news.demon.co.uk...
> spindrift said the following on 28/05/2008 09:48:
>> http://www.lcc.org.uk/index.asp?PageID=1145
>
> The vast majority of the country probably don't really much care about
> what happens in one city.

London today, every other bus lane in the country tomorrow.