Phobile Moans from a Lakeland MRT



Chris Gilbert <[email protected]> writes
>
>Gordon Harris wrote:
>
>> Having said that, I would be totally embarrassed to call them for any

>
>> reason other than injury or illness. For this reason, and my

>age, I
>> tend to walk well within my physical and navigational limits

>nowadays.
>Lounge -> Kitchen -> Lounge -> Toilet -> Lounge .....
>

You missed out:
Computer; comfy chair.
--
Gordon Harris
 
Phil Cook <[email protected]> writes
>On 26 Jan 2005 06:37:09 -0800, Chris Gilbert wrote:
>
>>
>>Gordon Harris wrote:
>>
>>> Having said that, I would be totally embarrassed to call them for any

>>
>>> reason other than injury or illness. For this reason, and my

>>age, I
>>> tend to walk well within my physical and navigational limits

>>nowadays.
>>Lounge -> Kitchen

>
>You missed a bit out...
>
> -> Fridge -> Drawer (bottle opener) -> Cupboard (glass)
>-> Lounge -> Toilet -> Lounge .....


THEN DO:
bed -> Toilet -> bed
UNTIL Morning.
--
Gordon Harris
 
Mr. Hulse (team leader of LAMRT, who is the focus of the article) seems
> to have strong opinions...


Indeed Stewart does ( Stoopid Journo's cant even spell his name right ) and
he has every just cause to have them. A MR member for 40 years. MBE for, if
memory serves me right, services to MR and past Team Leader of LAMRT for a
very long time. Stewart will have seen a great change over those years from
multiday search and rescues to the very fast deployment and recovery by
today's MRT's. Stewart is a leading figurehead in English MR, if it wasn't
for him the volunteers of today wouldn't have decent insurance cover whilst
out on a rescue amongst many other things. He does have very outspoken
views, but he has very strong views on the safety of the MR person and the
way in which MR is going over the foreseeable future.

I've spent a cold wet night searching for a person who was lost, allegedly
injured and kept phoning us to find out where we were every 30 mins, his
excuse he was drunk had fallen and didn't know where he was, except in some
moorland somewhere North of Bolton. With the help of his mobile fone company
we triangulated his position and found his fone was last registered on the
Network some 40 miles !!! so we upped camp called another MRT in to help and
relocated, Police found him 3 hours later back in Bolton.

Mobile fones hate 'em but couldn't live without them, when the flash on the
camera can be used to help pin point you, when RAF Kinloss sends a txt
message through to the injured party to find out where they are and it gets
there but phoning someone cant get through.

Dave - a MRT member
 
> As for the increase in rescues, a quick google found the Keswick MRT
> callout records, as just one example
> (http://www.keswickmrt.org.uk/rescues/rescues.html) and in their case the
> number of callouts has actually declined over the last couple of years
> after a long steady increase over the last several decades.


As for all MRT's this will be a trend. 15 years ago my team had 7 calls, in
1994 we did 15 jobs in that year last year we did 15 jobs just in August
alone.

The reason why is that more 999 services use us for what we are capable for.
For example and this may not be true of all teams, the Police for searches,
Ambulance service for difficult extraction of casualties, Fire service to
compliment their high lines units. More MRT's are getting called to major
incidents Boscastle & Carlisle floods all had MRT's there doing some very
non MRT work. I have even been CBR(N) Decontamination trained by the
Ambulance service.

Just watch those figures go higher over the years to come, who knows we
might even get an employed MR Service ( I wanted to use the word full time
but of course we are that already, available 24/7 365 for free ! )

Dave
 
> He was very scathing about this particular case, but went on to say that
> the type of incident prevented them from attending people who were
> injured, which might be true on a busy Sunday, I suppose.


I wouldn't just say on a Sunday. I'll bet there is at least one MRT out on
any day, at any time.

Dave
 
Well here's a heartfelt thank you for the service you and your team provide
[and I hope I never meet you in a professional capacity ;-) ]

Too many people take MRT for granted, and really don't appreciate the
training and personal sacrifice that goes into the service

Hats off to you all

> As for all MRT's this will be a trend. 15 years ago my team had 7 calls,

in
> 1994 we did 15 jobs in that year last year we did 15 jobs just in August
> alone.
> Dave
>
>
 
[email protected] said...
> Well here's a heartfelt thank you for the service you and your team provide
> [and I hope I never meet you in a professional capacity ;-) ]
>
> Too many people take MRT for granted, and really don't appreciate the
> training and personal sacrifice that goes into the service
>
> Hats off to you all
>

Wotesed.
--
If you can keep your head when all around are losing theirs...
then you've failed to grasp some important aspect of the
situation.
 
"John Gardner" <[email protected]> schreef in bericht
news:[email protected]...
> >Is there some sort of code or conduct the MRTs have that prevent this?
>>Surely all they must do is ensure a group is safe

>
> We were once called out for a 4x4 which had got itself stuck on Mastiles
> Lane.
> We invited them to make a donation to the team, but they declined so we
> gave
> them the phone number of the local breakdown garage.


I think it's oke for any MRT to act like a taxicompany but they should also
charge like a taxicompany, a very expensive one.
Lazy walkers : 500 pounds p.p.
Lost, stupid walkers : 250 pounds p.p.
Injured, stupid walkers : 100 pounds p.p.
Injured, prepared walkers : free of charge but please make a donation.

--
Theo
www.theosphotos.fotopic.net
 
> I think it's oke for any MRT to act like a taxicompany but they should
> also charge like a taxicompany, a very expensive one.
> Lazy walkers : 500 pounds p.p.
> Lost, stupid walkers : 250 pounds p.p.
> Injured, stupid walkers : 100 pounds p.p.
> Injured, prepared walkers : free of charge but please make a donation.


Theo,

The Treasurer of my team likes this idea a lot. Might help us raise more
money when we have to cancel fundraising collections and go off on a search
instead.

Dave
 
> I think it's oke for any MRT to act like a taxicompany but they should
> also charge like a taxicompany, a very expensive one.
> Lazy walkers : 500 pounds p.p.
> Lost, stupid walkers : 250 pounds p.p.
> Injured, stupid walkers : 100 pounds p.p.
> Injured, prepared walkers : free of charge but please make a donation.


I was discussing this with a colleague today. She agreed with me that anyone
who calls out
the MRT due to gross stupidity / negligence on their own part should be
charged.
Considering these people are actually putting other people's lives in danger
(theoretically)
then surely this should be classed as criminal in some way?

Like wasting police time? Or more so as they get paid. (and get free food
and coffee.... -
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/england/merseyside/4211857.stm, though i
must say this sounds extreme? Is my sister going to get the fire brigade
into trouble for making them all drinks when they come and put out her
chimney fire (again!)?)

All respects to the MRT members, may i never meet one
professionally...hopefully!

T Dave R.
 
theo wrote:

> I think it's oke for any MRT to act like a taxicompany but they should also
> charge like a taxicompany, a very expensive one.
> Lazy walkers : 500 pounds p.p.
> Lost, stupid walkers : 250 pounds p.p.
> Injured, stupid walkers : 100 pounds p.p.
> Injured, prepared walkers : free of charge but please make a donation.


And then you have injured or lost people not calling out MR and as a
result getting either permanently damaged or in even deeper trouble
because they are frightened they will be charged. The stupid people
will still phone up because they don't know better, and the people who
were trying their best and were unfortunate will suffer unnecessarily.

The same goes for insurance - a lot of the MR folks I know don't want to
see people have to take out insurance to cover their costs because is is
suspected that the MR teams would be have to become part-time insurance
assessors - "I'm sorry, you are within 100m of a main road, your
insurance doesn't cover you even though you have fallen down a cliff",
that sort of thing.

I have also heard some MR folks state that MR teams shouldn't ever
criticise people's actions, again because accidents and silly mistakes
can happen to anyone. If people feel they are going to be lectured or
held up to ridicule they won't call for help when they should.

--
Alan Burlison
--
 
Ysgrifennodd "Alan Burlison" <[email protected]> mewn neges
newyddion:[email protected]...
> theo wrote:
>
>> I think it's oke for any MRT to act like a taxicompany but they should
>> also charge like a taxicompany, a very expensive one.
>> Lazy walkers : 500 pounds p.p.
>> Lost, stupid walkers : 250 pounds p.p.
>> Injured, stupid walkers : 100 pounds p.p.
>> Injured, prepared walkers : free of charge but please make a donation.

>
> And then you have injured or lost people not calling out MR and as a
> result getting either permanently damaged or in even deeper trouble
> because they are frightened they will be charged. The stupid people will
> still phone up because they don't know better, and the people who were
> trying their best and were unfortunate will suffer unnecessarily.
>
> The same goes for insurance - a lot of the MR folks I know don't want to
> see people have to take out insurance to cover their costs because is is
> suspected that the MR teams would be have to become part-time insurance
> assessors - "I'm sorry, you are within 100m of a main road, your insurance
> doesn't cover you even though you have fallen down a cliff", that sort of
> thing.
>
> I have also heard some MR folks state that MR teams shouldn't ever
> criticise people's actions, again because accidents and silly mistakes can
> happen to anyone. If people feel they are going to be lectured or held up
> to ridicule they won't call for help when they should.
>
> --
> Alan Burlison
> --


Ultimately, the decision is down to the MRT teams. Afterall, they are the
ones
putting the risk in, not us putting opinions on a keyboard in a nice warm
rooom.

Personally, i have little sympathy for those in *any* situation that bring
it all upon
themselves theough carelessness/arrogance/etc.
But lack of sympathy, doesn't mean i wouldn't help someone if i were able to
off a hill. But i'd definately let them know where they went wrong, in that
way they might learn something (but i doubt it). But i'm not part of an MRT.

About the people being afraid to call MRT, that was a drawback i was
discussing this afternoon. Same with insurance. I can see the hassle it'd
make.

Problem is, people just aren't willing to take *responsibility*.
People bang on about their rights, human rights. etc, but what they don't
realise
is that fundemental to having rights is the principle of obligations to
match those.
(you cant have rights without obligations, as those obligations ensure that
others
will get their rights, or something alopng those lines).

Still, this is a walking forum, not philosophy, so i'll stop before i get
carried away...

T Dave Roberts.
 

> About the people being afraid to call MRT, that was a drawback i was
> discussing this afternoon. Same with insurance. I can see the hassle it'd
> make.


Sorry, didnt make it clear.
I meant i was discussing this at work with a colleague as i mentioned in a
previous post.

T Dave Roberts
 
"Alan Burlison" <[email protected]> schreef in bericht
news:[email protected]...
> theo wrote:
>
>> I think it's oke for any MRT to act like a taxicompany but they should
>> also charge like a taxicompany, a very expensive one.
>> Lazy walkers : 500 pounds p.p.
>> Lost, stupid walkers : 250 pounds p.p.
>> Injured, stupid walkers : 100 pounds p.p.
>> Injured, prepared walkers : free of charge but please make a donation.

>
> And then you have injured or lost people not calling out MR and as a
> result getting either permanently damaged or in even deeper trouble
> because they are frightened they will be charged. The stupid people will
> still phone up because they don't know better, and the people who were
> trying their best and were unfortunate will suffer unnecessarily.
>
> The same goes for insurance - a lot of the MR folks I know don't want to
> see people have to take out insurance to cover their costs because is is
> suspected that the MR teams would be have to become part-time insurance
> assessors - "I'm sorry, you are within 100m of a main road, your insurance
> doesn't cover you even though you have fallen down a cliff", that sort of
> thing.
>
> I have also heard some MR folks state that MR teams shouldn't ever
> criticise people's actions, again because accidents and silly mistakes can
> happen to anyone. If people feel they are going to be lectured or held up
> to ridicule they won't call for help when they should.


If someone calls out the firebrigade just for fun they can get charged for
the costs that are made. Still people call the firebrigade for chimney
fires. If someone kidnaps a friend for fun he can be charged for the costs
the police have made to rescue this friend. Still people call the police if
they need them.
In Holland if you need transport to a hospital but there's no emergency the
ambulance will not come. They will tell you to call for a taxi.
People will also call a MRT if they really need them. A hundred pounds isn't
that much. A jacket or tent costs more.
Calling a MRT for the wrong reason is a bit like exceeding the speedlimit :
you'll have to pay if you're caught.


--
Theo
www.theosphotos.fotopic.net
 
"Dave H" <[email protected]> wrote:

Firstly, I'll sincerely okay Bryan H's "thank you".

> Just watch those figures go higher over the years to come,
> who knows we might even get an employed MR Service ( I wanted
> to use the word full time but of course we are that already,
> available 24/7 365 for free ! )


Is there a consensus of opinion in the MRT community of whether "going pro"
would be a good thing or a bad thing?
 
[email protected] said...
> Like wasting police time? Or more so as they get paid. (and get free food
> and coffee.... -
> http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/england/merseyside/4211857.stm, though i
> must say this sounds extreme?
>

Absolutely flippin' barking; totally hatstand. Why shouldn't
the people who help us when we're in trouble be allowed to
accept a cuppa? Honestly, the world's getting more bizarre
every day.
--
If you can keep your head when all around are losing theirs...
then you've failed to grasp some important aspect of the
situation.
 
[email protected] said...
> Problem is, people just aren't willing to take *responsibility*.
> People bang on about their rights, human rights. etc, but what they don't
> realise is that fundemental to having rights is the principle of obligations to
> match those.
>

Well said that man.
--
If you can keep your head when all around are losing theirs...
then you've failed to grasp some important aspect of the
situation.
 
Fran wrote
> [email protected] said...
> > http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/england/merseyside/4211857.stm,


> Absolutely flippin' barking; totally hatstand. Honestly, the world's

getting more bizarre
> every day.


This is completely off topic and probably not one for the squeamish, or for
those of us with a y chromosome. However, Fran's comments and the
'Merseyside' link above reminded me of it. All I'm going to say is,
ouch!...
http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk_news/story/0,3604,1388123,00.html

T.
 
In article <[email protected]>, Fran
<[email protected]> writes
>[email protected] said...
>> Like wasting police time? Or more so as they get paid. (and get free food
>> and coffee.... -
>> http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/england/merseyside/4211857.stm, though i
>> must say this sounds extreme?
>>

>Absolutely flippin' barking; totally hatstand. Why shouldn't
>the people who help us when we're in trouble be allowed to
>accept a cuppa? Honestly, the world's getting more bizarre
>every day.

Some years ago - about 12, a neighbour topped himself and after the dust
had settled, a young PC was posted at the gate to guard the site. My
wife gave him a cup of coffee. Was this giving a free hand out? I think
not,!

I considered it a means of alleviating the possible hypothermia the
young chap was developing standing in one place for hours on end in
early Frebruary.
--
Bill Grey
http://www.billboy.co.uk
 
In article <[email protected]>, Alan Burlison
<[email protected]> writes
> The stupid people will still phone up because they don't know better,
>and the people who were trying their best and were unfortunate will
>suffer unnecessarily.


Unfortunately I consider the stupid ones as those who DO know better but
still phone.

It's the uninformed naive types who maybe wouldn't realise that MRT even
exist.
--
Bill Grey
http://www.billboy.co.uk