Cycle lanes under London

I remember seeing a press report years ago about using old
train \ tube lines for a cycle network in and around London.
Apparently, there are a number of derelict tube tunnels
under the city that were going to be tarmaced & lit so as to
give cyclists an easier passage in and out of London.

Does anybody else remember this being reported? I think it
might have been Red Ken's idea (if not, I want copyright!!).

It is possible I dreamt it of course!

"Nick King" <fangtwang@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:ccnjf2$4k6$1@sparta.btinternet.com...

> I remember seeing a press report years ago about using
> old train \ tube lines for a cycle network in and around
> London. Apparently, there are a number of derelict tube
> tunnels under the city that were going to be tarmaced &
> lit so as to give cyclists an easier passage in and out
> of London.
>
> Does anybody else remember this being reported? I think it
> might have
been
> Red Ken's idea (if not, I want copyright!!).
>
> It is possible I dreamt it of course!
>
>

The main practical difficult with that for actual tubes
presumably would be how to get the cyclists and bikes
between tube and ground level in the central area. If that
is what was being proposed at least. Presumably using the
emergency spiral staircases would be out, so there would
need to be lifts at strategically placed intervals along the
route. However as even London Underground, with millions of
fare paying passengers and millions in subsidies can't even
manage to keep their existing fairly modern lifts in
operation.......

Another scheme facing severe practical difficulties is
OYbikes which is being trialled in Hammersmith and Fulham.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/technology/3856535.stm

Free community bike schems are nothing new, the most famous
modern attempt probably being the Dutch white bikes of the
60's , and new ones are always being trialled in the States.

http://www.arcata.com/greenbikes/sur...bikesurvey.jpg

However they all eventually peter out for all too obvious,
and less obvious reasons. i.e given enough time either one
or two bike thieves will eventually steal all the available
free bikes or new bike thieves will emerge to complete the
task. The triumph of hope over experience writ large in
other words.

In this case the bikes are locked. And are charged for at
approx £1 an hour. Quite how many bikes the schemes
proponents imagine will be left in one piece - the sight of
a yuppie trying to ride away on a bike with two flat tyres
being too hard to resist for many I'd imagine - after the
local social deviants become fully cognisant with the scheme
- is hard to imagine.

And yet the organisers were sufficiently savvy to get the
BBC interested and so generate some free publicity for their
doomed scheme. Although hopefuly only among their potential
customers and not the salivating local deviants.

Then there's the question of h*l*ets. On the TV report the
reporter was shown donning a h*lm*t in a really artistic close-
up zooming shot - at one point the h*lm*t filled the entire
screen, but without saying the actual word. And without
explaining how users of the scheme are supposed to make
provision for themselves in that respect So are they
supposed to carry one around with them on the off-chance ?
The off-chance being that there's an unvandalised bike
available exactly when and where they neeed one.

Who's to know?

Curious

in message <2l9jgjFaborkU1@uni-berlin.de>, Dr Curious
('curiosity238@hotmail.com') wrote:

> Free community bike schems are nothing new, the most
> famous modern attempt probably being the Dutch white bikes
> of the 60's , and new ones are always being trialled in
> the States.

Chris Hill (who later founded Edinburgh Bicycle Co-op) tried
this in Edinburgh in 1972. The bikes were pretty quickly all
vandalised or permanently lost.

--
simon@jasmine.org.uk (Simon Brooke)
http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/

' ' <------- this blank intentionally spaced left

"Nick King" <fangtwang@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:ccnjf2$4k6$1@sparta.btinternet.com...

> I remember seeing a press report years ago about using
> old train \ tube lines for a cycle network in and around
> London. Apparently, there are a number of derelict tube
> tunnels under the city that were going to be tarmaced &
> lit so as to give cyclists an easier passage in and out
> of London.

It sounds like it would be a muggers paradise!

Simon Brooke wrote:
> in message <2l9jgjFaborkU1@uni-berlin.de>, Dr Curious
> ('curiosity238@hotmail.com') wrote:
>
>
>>Free community bike schems are nothing new, the most
>>famous modern attempt probably being the Dutch white bikes
>>of the 60's , and new ones are always being trialled in
>>the States.
>
>
> Chris Hill (who later founded Edinburgh Bicycle Co-op)
> tried this in Edinburgh in 1972. The bikes were pretty
> quickly all vandalised or permanently lost.
>

Cambridge's attempt had all the bikes gone within the first
morning. Mind you they did have a system that didn't lock up
the bikes but trusted people to not steal them.

Tony

"Nick King" <fangtwang@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:ccnjf2$4k6$1@sparta.btinternet.com...
> I remember seeing a press report years ago about using
> old train \
tube
> lines for a cycle network in and around London.

I seem to recall that Thames Water used to use bikes to ride
through their Ring Main tunnel before they filled it up with
water. I don't think it was ever in a fit state to allow
riding a bike all the way round it, though.

Would a recumbent fit in the Post Office tunnels?

Last year I was at a meeting where somebody was proposing
overhead tunnels for cyclists - a long tube (transparent) on
stilts over the Thames, to make a bike path. I suggested
putting a few fans in it, to blow people along. (an idea not
original with me)

Jeremy Parker

On Sat, 10 Jul 2004 15:47:40 +0100 someone who may be "Jeremy
Parker" <JeremyParker@compuserve.com> wrote this:-

>Last year I was at a meeting where somebody was proposing
>overhead tunnels for cyclists - a long tube (transparent)
>on stilts over the Thames, to make a bike path.

Something like 130 years ago an elevated railway surrounded
by glass was suggested as a means of linking railway
stations in London.

--
David Hansen, Edinburgh | PGP email preferred-key number
F566DA0E I will always explain revoked keys, unless the UK
government prevents me using the RIP Act 2000.

"Jeremy Parker" <JeremyParker@compuserve.com> wrote in message news:<ccrcl5$5hp$1$8300dec7@news.demon.co.uk>...

> Last year I was at a meeting where somebody was proposing
> overhead tunnels for cyclists - a long tube (transparent)
> on stilts over the Thames, to make a bike path. I
> suggested putting a few fans in it, to blow people along.
> (an idea not original with me)

That would be two tubes then. Perhaps they could be hitched
to the sides of the very big flatish tube carrying the
eight lane M25E (Equatorial) motorway and Victoria and
Albert Embankments, Millbank, Southbank etc etc could be
grassed over.

M

"Nick King" <fangtwang@hotmail.com> wrote in message news:<ccnjf2$4k6$1@sparta.btinternet.com>...
> I remember seeing a press report years ago about using old
> train \ tube lines for a cycle network in and around
> London. Apparently, there are a number of derelict tube
> tunnels under the city

there is Holborn-Aldwych, King William St-London Bridge and
Green Park to Charing Cross, hardly much of a network and
all deep underground (and even under buildings). There is a
network of tunnels used by the PO/MOD (NOT the PO railway),
but no way you would be allowed down them.

Dream on ;-)

Tony Raven <junk@raven-family.com> wrote in message news:<2la6taFa7dv9U1@uni-berlin.de>...
> Simon Brooke wrote:
> > in message <2l9jgjFaborkU1@uni-berlin.de>, Dr Curious
> > ('curiosity238@hotmail.com') wrote:
> >
> >
> >>Free community bike schems are nothing new, the most
> >>famous modern attempt probably being the Dutch white
> >>bikes of the 60's , and new ones are always being
> >>trialled in the States.
> >
> >
> > Chris Hill (who later founded Edinburgh Bicycle Co-op)
> > tried this in Edinburgh in 1972. The bikes were pretty
> > quickly all vandalised or permanently lost.
> >
>
> Cambridge's attempt had all the bikes gone within the
> first morning. Mind you they did have a system that didn't
> lock up the bikes but trusted people to not steal them.

In Copenhagen they have loads of fairly uniquely coloured
bikes on stands like shopping trollies, 20 Kroner in the
slot deposit, you can't take them outside the central area,
seems to work well.

"MartinM" <Martinm2@wcms.org.uk> wrote in message
news:3cf5c6dc.0407112339.c59a891@posting.google.com...

> Tony Raven <junk@raven-family.com> wrote in message
news:<2la6taFa7dv9U1@uni-berlin.de>...

> > Simon Brooke wrote:

> > > in message <2l9jgjFaborkU1@uni-berlin.de>, Dr Curious
> > > ('curiosity238@hotmail.com') wrote:
> > >
> > >
> > >>Free community bike schems are nothing new, the most
> > >>famous modern attempt probably being the Dutch white
> > >>bikes of the 60's , and new ones are always being
> > >>trialled in the States.
> > >
> > >
> > > Chris Hill (who later founded Edinburgh Bicycle Co-op)
> > > tried this in Edinburgh in 1972. The bikes were pretty
> > > quickly all vandalised or permanently lost.
> > >
> >
> > Cambridge's attempt had all the bikes gone within the
> > first morning. Mind you they did have a system that
> > didn't lock up the bikes but trusted people to not
> > steal them.
>
> In Copenhagen they have loads of fairly uniquely coloured
> bikes on stands like shopping trollies, 20 Kroner in the
> slot deposit, you can't take them outside the central
> area, seems to work well.

Yup, and there are details including pictures on here.

http://www.members.aol.com/humorme81/citybike.htm

And in case there was any suspicion that its success is due
to solely to the rigid social conformity of Danish Goody-Two-
Shoes types

<quote>

As mentioned earlier, bicycle theft is a big problem in
Denmark. In the 1981-1991 period alone, an average of about
90,000 bikes a year were reported stolen.

</quote>

Curious

"Jeremy Parker" <JeremyParker@compuserve.com> wrote in message news:<ccrcl5$5hp$1$8300dec7@news.demon.co.uk>...

> Last year I was at a meeting where somebody was proposing
> overhead tunnels for cyclists - a long tube (transparent)
> on stilts over the Thames, to make a bike path. I
> suggested putting a few fans in it, to blow people along.
> (an idea not original with me)

<http://www.biketrans.com>

--
Dave...

I was thrown out of there during my freshman year, for
cheating on my metaphysics final. You know, I looked within
the soul of the boy sitting next to me. — Woody Allen

"Dave Kahn" <dkahn400@yahoo.co.uk> wrote in message
news:57db8bde.0407120057.4b3d4c6c@posting.google.com...
>
> > Last year I was at a meeting where somebody was
> > proposing overhead tunnels for cyclists - a long tube
> > (transparent) on stilts over the Thames, to make a bike
> > path. I suggested putting a few fans in it, to blow
> > people along. (an idea not original with me)
>
> <http://www.biketrans.com>

How does it handle hills?

"Tony W" <remove@chapmore.co.uk> wrote in message news:<2lf56vFbu7bsU1@uni-berlin.de>...
> "Dave Kahn" <dkahn400@yahoo.co.uk> wrote in message
> news:57db8bde.0407120057.4b3d4c6c@posting.google.com...
> >
> > > Last year I was at a meeting where somebody was
> > > proposing overhead tunnels for cyclists - a long tube
> > > (transparent) on stilts over the Thames, to make a
> > > bike path. I suggested putting a few fans in it, to
> > > blow people along. (an idea not original with me)
> >
> > <http://www.biketrans.com>
>
> How does it handle hills?

Doesn't say, does it? I imagine it simply goes up and down
them. However, it's still easier to cycle uphill with a
tailwind than without one. Having said that though, riding
with a following wind can occasionally produce a complete
absence of apparent wind. Toiling uphill you can get very
sweaty very quickly this way as you lose any cooling effect
of the breeze.

--
Dave...

I was thrown out of there during my freshman year, for
cheating on my metaphysics final. You know, I looked within
the soul of the boy sitting next to me. — Woody Allen

"Dr Curious" <curiosity238@hotmail.com> wrote in message

> And in case there was any suspicion that its success is
> due to solely to the rigid social conformity of Danish Goody-Two-
> Shoes types
>
> <quote>
>
> As mentioned earlier, bicycle theft is a big problem in
> Denmark. In the 1981-1991 period alone, an average of
> about 90,000 bikes a year were reported stolen.

They are also the only other EU member who have not embraced
the EU number plates (but so far have not gone around
covering them up with free Danish flag stickers provided by
their extreme right wing press)