'04 Veloce vs Centaur vs Chorus vs Record

[Dave]

Aside from price, prestige, weight, and finish, is there a
real reason (e.g., reliability, shift ease, braking, feel,
maintainability) to choose one of the above over the others?

I'm looking at am '04 parts list, and it appears the
Veloce hub is a step down. So, right now I'm thinking
Veloce with Centaur hubs. Any other components where a
change would be in order?

Thanks,

-=Dave=-

 

[Jeff & Jane]

I would just get the Centaur group, worth the extra $150-$200. I have 01
Chorus and if I was buying now I would get Centaur.
"Dave" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Aside from price, prestige, weight, and finish, is there
> a real reason (e.g., reliability, shift ease, braking,
> feel, maintainability) to choose one of the above over
> the others?
>
> I'm looking at am '04 parts list, and it appears the
> Veloce hub is a step down. So, right now I'm thinking
> Veloce with Centaur hubs. Any other components where a
> change would be in order?
>
>
> Thanks,
>
> -=Dave=-

 

[Pete Biggs]

Dave wrote:
> Aside from price, prestige, weight, and finish, is there
> a real reason (e.g., reliability, shift ease, braking,
> feel, maintainability) to choose one of the above over
> the others?
>
> I'm looking at am '04 parts list, and it appears the
> Veloce hub is a step down. So, right now I'm thinking
> Veloce with Centaur hubs.

That's a good combo.

> Any other components where a change would be in order?

Centaur chainrings theoretically last longer than Veloce,
Centaur Ergos have holes in downshift levers for a better
feel. Other than that, no good reason to have all-Centaur+
if weight is not a concern as function is the same. Many of
the designs and small parts are the same or very similar,
Mirage and Xenon included to some extent. See the Spare
Parts section of the Campagnolo website.

~PB

 

[Qui Si Parla Ca]

dave-<< Aside from price, prestige, weight, and finish, is
there a real reason (e.g., reliability, shift ease, braking,
feel, maintainability) to choose one of the above over the
others? >><BR><BR>

Nope-functionally they are all the same-

dave-<< I'm looking at am '04 parts list, and it appears the
Veloce hub is a step down. So, right now I'm thinking Veloce
with Centaur hubs. Any other components where a change would
be in order? >><BR><BR>

Good choice altho nothing really wrong with the Veloce hubs

Peter Chisholm Vecchio's Bicicletteria 1833 Pearl St.
Boulder, CO, 80302
(303)440-3535 http://www.vecchios.com "Ruote convenzionali
costruite eccezionalmente bene"

 

[Rapunzel]

Dave wrote:

*I don't think so, The rear hub has sealed bearings and work
just fine, they are not that different from Record hubs of
years past, except for the bearings.

I have a set of these built on Galli Top Pro tubular rims
with Vittoria All weather Pro tires. These are the wheels
and tires I use when the roads are rainy, wet, slippery and
cold. They work just fine for this.

IMO, the only thing you give up over the current Chorus &
Record is weight.

Bernice

> I'm looking at am '04 parts list, and it appears the
> Veloce hub is a step down.

 

[Wort]

On Sat, 03 Apr 2004 13:52:03 -0500, Dave <[email protected]> wrote:

>Aside from price, prestige, weight, and finish, is there
>a real reason (e.g., reliability, shift ease, braking,
>feel, maintainability) to choose one of the above over
>the others?
>
>I'm looking at am '04 parts list, and it appears the Veloce
>hub is a step down. So, right now I'm thinking Veloce with
>Centaur hubs. Any other components where a change would be
>in order?
>
>
>Thanks,
>
> -=Dave=-
>
Hi,

I bought Veloce with Chorus hubs. Had read some negative
reviews about the Veloce hubs and they were a lot heavier
than Chorus.

My only regret is in the quality of the finish. The crank
set for example works fine but the finish is crude. Like old
Shimano 105, you can see the mold marks on the sides of the
spider. But again it works well, and cost a lot less than
Record or Chorus or even Centaur.

Regards

 

[A Muzi]

> On Sat, 03 Apr 2004 13:52:03 -0500, Dave <[email protected]> wrote:
-snip-
>> it appears the Veloce hub is a step down. So, right now
>> I'm thinking Veloce with Centaur hubs.
-snip-
>
Wort wrote:
> I bought Veloce with Chorus hubs. Had read some negative
> reviews about the Veloce hubs and they were a lot heavier
> than Chorus.
-snip- Yes the Veloce/Mirage hubs use simple cartridge
bearings. Not a bad choice for a commuter or otherwise wet
riding bike.

The wonderful new Chorus hub is also sold as Centaur - only
the dust cover is different, which is why the price is
within $10 . Weight difference is in the skewers. Record is
the same hub, but for Ti pawls.

The new big bearing retainer and the new larger cone are the
same part front and rear , Record, Chorus, Centaur . That
hub series may be opened with only an allen or a
screwdriver. The cone slides like the Aheadset top race.
It's open, easy to clean (no pressed caps) and my be
adjusted in the bicycle. Nice design.

--
Andrew Muzi www.yellowjersey.org Open every day since 1
April, 1971

 

[crystal_tears_]

Just calculated the difference in weight between Centaur 2004 and Veloce 2004. Comes to a grand total of 0.242 lbs so i wouldn't worry too much on that score.
These are the weights of the Campag 2004 groupsets :

Xenon : 6.120 lbs
Mirage : 6.085 lbs
Veloce : 5.731 lbs
Centaur : 5.489 lbs
Chorus : 5.146 lbs
Record : 4.490 lbs

For what it's worth i decided, after much pondering, to buy last years Centaur 9 speed groupset for my new bike. Picked it up for only slightly more than the new Veloce costs. The Centaur has a better finish than Veloce, is slightly lighter, has better Ergo levers and a superior chainset. Though i use a Veloce cassette to keep the cost down.

Don't like the idea of 10 speed. The cassette costs more, the chain is thinner and therefore not as strong as the 9 speed, chainrings are also thinner to accomodate the chain. Couldn't justify spending another 250 pound on the Chorus for a more polished finish either.

 

[Qui Si Parla Ca]

crystal-<< The Centaur has a better finish than Veloce, is
slightly lighter, has better Ergo levers and a superior
>><BR><BR> << chainrings are also thinner to accomodate the
chain. >><BR><BR>

Centaur levers are the same as Veloce save the hole in the
shifter and the big ring is offset towards the small rig for
10s but the same thickness as 9s....

Peter Chisholm Vecchio's Bicicletteria 1833 Pearl St.
Boulder, CO, 80302
(303)440-3535 http://www.vecchios.com "Ruote convenzionali
costruite eccezionalmente bene"

 

[crystal_tears_]

Sorry to be pedantic but according to Campag's website Centaur ergos are derived from the Record levers unlike Veloce. They also have light alloy levers the same as Chorus. The holes in the middle aren't there just for cosmetic purposes..oh no ! but are incorporated into the design to save vital grams lol
Centaur chainrings are Ultra Drive which, according to the advertising blurb, increases resistance to wear and reduces chain attrition as compared to the older Exa Drive on Veloce.
Front derailleur on Centaur has anti friction insert to make changes a little smoother.
All in all i think paying the extra for Centaur over Veloce is well worth it.

 

[John Retchford]

Originally posted by crystal_tears_
Don't like the idea of 10 speed. The cassette costs more, the chain is thinner and therefore not as strong as the 9 speed, chainrings are also thinner to accomodate the chain. Couldn't justify spending another 250 pound on the Chorus for a more polished finish either.

This statement that 10 speed chains are weaker than 9 speed chains has been made several times on rec.bicycles.tech. Is it really true? You say that the 10 speed chain is "thinner" and therefore weaker. I thought it was just narrower. Are the side plates thinner? I have never handled a 10v chain.

I assumed that the strength of a chain was set by the tensile strength of its side plates, the shear strength of the material pushed inwards from the side plates to form the bushing for the rollers or by the shear strength of the pins. Providing the strength of the plates and the pins is maintained, I find it hard to see why making the chain narrower would reduce its strength. Does Mr Tears or anyone else know?

John Retchford

 

[John Retchford]

Originally posted by crystal_tears_
Don't like the idea of 10 speed. The cassette costs more, the chain is thinner and therefore not as strong as the 9 speed, chainrings are also thinner to accomodate the chain. Couldn't justify spending another 250 pound on the Chorus for a more polished finish either.

The statement that 10 speed chains are weaker than 9 speed chains has been made several times on rec.bicycles.tech. Is it really true? You say that the 10 speed chain is “thinner” and therefore weaker. I thought it was just narrower. Are the side plates made of thinner material? I have never handled a 10v chain.

I assume that the strength of a chain is set by the tensile strength of the plates, the shear strength of the material pressed inwards to form the bushes for the rollers, or the shear strength of the pins. If the material in the plates and pins remains the same, I find it hard to see why making the chain narrower would make it weaker. Does Mr Tears or anyone else know?

John Retchford

 

[A Muzi]

crystal_tears_ wrote:

> Just calculated the difference in weight between Centaur
> 2004 and Veloce 2004. Comes to a grand total of 0.242 lbs
> so i wouldn't worry too much on that score. These are the
> weights of the Campag 2004 groupsets :
>
> Xenon : 6.120 lbs Mirage : 6.085 lbs Veloce : 5.731 lbs
> Centaur : 5.489 lbs Chorus : 5.146 lbs Record : 4.490 lbs
>
> For what it's worth i decided, after much pondering, to
> buy last years Centaur 9 speed groupset for my new bike.
> Picked it up for only slightly more than the new Veloce
> costs. The Centaur has a better finish than Veloce, is
> slightly lighter, has better Ergo levers and a superior
> chainset. Though i use a Veloce cassette to keep the
> cost down.
>
> Don't like the idea of 10 speed. The cassette costs more,
> the chain is thinner and therefore not as strong as the 9
> speed, chainrings are also thinner to accomodate the
> chain. Couldn't justify spending another 250 pound on the
> Chorus for a more polished finish either.
>
>
>
> --
>
>
Logical, mostly. Centaur does share the neat Chorus hubs.
Where did you see an Ergo difference besides the cutout?

--
Andrew Muzi www.yellowjersey.org Open every day since 1
April, 1971

 

[rmartin]

One other point regarding Veloce/Centaur. I have had 3 Veloce bottom brackets and all of them started making a noise like a bag of spanners in a washing machine after about 1500 miles. Worth upgrading the bracket to Chorus if you can - the design of that is basically Record without the carbon bits.

Anyone else had problems with the Veloce/Centaur bottom bracket?

 

[Bfd]

crystal_tears_ <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<%[email protected]>...
> Sorry to be pedantic but according to Campag's website
> Centaur ergos are derived from the Record levers unlike
> Veloce. They also have light alloy levers the same as
> Chorus. The holes in the middle aren't there just for
> cosmetic purposes..oh no ! but are incorporated into the
> design to save vital grams lol Centaur chainrings are
> Ultra Drive which, according to the advertising blurb,
> increases resistance to wear and reduces chain attrition
> as compared to the older Exa Drive on Veloce. Front
> derailleur on Centaur has anti friction insert to make
> changes a little smoother. All in all i think paying the
> extra for Centaur over Veloce is well worth it.
>
>
This is interesting. It was my understanding that the
difference between Chorus and Centaur Ergo levers is that
the Chorus has the Ball Bearing System (pivots on a BB),
while the Centaur pivoted on a bushing. Performance-wise,
there doesn't appear to be any difference. If the Veloce
shifters use the same bushing pivots that the Centaur has,
and not the "ball bearing" used in the Chorus, wouldn't the
Veloce shifter be closer to Centaur?

 

[crystal_tears_]

Originally posted by A Muzi
crystal_tears_ wrote:

> Just calculated the difference in weight between Centaur
> 2004 and Veloce 2004. Comes to a grand total of 0.242 lbs
> so i wouldn't worry too much on that score. These are the
> weights of the Campag 2004 groupsets :
>
> Xenon : 6.120 lbs Mirage : 6.085 lbs Veloce : 5.731 lbs
> Centaur : 5.489 lbs Chorus : 5.146 lbs Record : 4.490 lbs
>
> For what it's worth i decided, after much pondering, to
> buy last years Centaur 9 speed groupset for my new bike.
> Picked it up for only slightly more than the new Veloce
> costs. The Centaur has a better finish than Veloce, is
> slightly lighter, has better Ergo levers and a superior
> chainset. Though i use a Veloce cassette to keep the
> cost down.
>
> Don't like the idea of 10 speed. The cassette costs more,
> the chain is thinner and therefore not as strong as the 9
> speed, chainrings are also thinner to accomodate the
> chain. Couldn't justify spending another 250 pound on the
> Chorus for a more polished finish either.
>
>
>
> --
>
>
Logical, mostly. Centaur does share the neat Chorus hubs.
Where did you see an Ergo difference besides the cutout?

--
Andrew Muzi www.yellowjersey.org Open every day since 1
April, 1971

Well i'm only quoting info from the official Campagnolo website. Very interesting it is too.

 

[Qui Si Parla Ca]

rmartin-<< One other point regarding Veloce/Centaur. I have
had 3 Veloce bottom brackets and all of them started making
a noise like a bag of spanners in a washing machine after
about 1500 miles. Worth upgrading the bracket to Chorus if
you can >><BR><BR>

Record/Chrous are 102mm spindle, Centaur and below are
111mm.

If installed correctly the Ac-H work fine for years..

Peter Chisholm Vecchio's Bicicletteria 1833 Pearl St.
Boulder, CO, 80302
(303)440-3535 http://www.vecchios.com "Ruote convenzionali
costruite eccezionalmente bene"

 

[Qui Si Parla Ca]

crystal-<< Well i'm only quoting info from the official
Campagnolo website. Very interesting it is too. >><BR><BR>

Replace the shift lever with the one with a hole in it-
Centaur. innards are the same as are the innards, like the
disc, springs, etc in Chorus and record.

Peter Chisholm Vecchio's Bicicletteria 1833 Pearl St.
Boulder, CO, 80302
(303)440-3535 http://www.vecchios.com "Ruote convenzionali
costruite eccezionalmente bene"

 

[Paul Kopit]

On Tue, 06 Apr 2004 17:02:20 GMT, rmartin
<[email protected]> wrote:

>Anyone else had problems with the Veloce/Centaur
>bottom bracket?

Zero problem with an AC-H/Daytona/Centaur bb in single or
tandem for over 20,000 miles.