12-27: Ultegra vs DA

Discussion in 'Cycling Equipment' started by Donald Specker, Aug 15, 2003.

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  1. Looking for one of these cassettes. Any reason not to get a DA? I recall something about durability
    due to titanium cogs, but I don't know if that's a real concern or not. I'm not going to ride a
    million miles either.

    Thanks.
     
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  2. I have had two very noisy 12-27 DuraAce cassettes, but never a problem with an Ultegra. The noise
    drove me nuts; I thought it was coming from somewhere else in the drivetrain, but it was the last
    three cogs (largest ones) that had slightly-loose rivets holding them to the body.

    --Mike-- Chain Reaction Bicycles www.ChainReaction.com

    "Donald Specker" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:h%d%[email protected]...
    > Looking for one of these cassettes. Any reason not to get a DA? I recall something about
    > durability due to titanium cogs, but I don't know if
    that's
    > a real concern or not. I'm not going to ride a million miles either.
    >
    > Thanks.
     
  3. Pat

    Pat Guest

    x-no-archive:yes

    > I have had two very noisy 12-27 DuraAce cassettes, but never a problem
    with
    > an Ultegra. The noise drove me nuts; I thought it was coming from
    somewhere
    > else in the drivetrain, but it was the last three cogs (largest ones) that had slightly-loose
    > rivets holding them to the body.
    >
    > --Mike--

    Noise drives me crazy, too. I like the bike to be silent except when I come up behind someone
    walking on the bike path, and then I coast so they'll hear the bike (no bell on my road bike).
    And yet, some guys I know seem not to be bothered by creaks and rhythmic noises coming from
    their bikes....

    Pat in TX
     
  4. "Donald Specker" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:h%d%[email protected]...
    > Looking for one of these cassettes. Any reason not to get a DA? I recall something about
    > durability due to titanium cogs, but I don't know if
    that's
    > a real concern or not. I'm not going to ride a million miles either.
    >
    > Thanks.
    >
    Aside from costing more than twice as much and lasting not as long, a Dura Ace cassette is fine.
    Seriously, the only benefit to the Dura Ace is a very small savings in weight. But the penalty is a
    huge (x2) cost difference and the Ti cogs don't last as long. So the Ultegra cassette will do
    everything the Dura Ace cassette will do, for half the price and a fairly longer life.
     
  5. Chluu907

    Chluu907 Guest

    Out of curiosity, can the cogs be removed from the carrier? I woul like to separate the 16 17 cogs
    from its carrier.

    Thanks, Claude
     
  6. Kbh

    Kbh Guest

    No. Buy 105 (although there is no 105 12-27 - which is unfortunate, as I would like to build a
    13-27, but Shimano don't make it easy).

    Kyle

    "Chluu907" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
    > Out of curiosity, can the cogs be removed from the carrier? I woul like
    to
    > separate the 16 17 cogs from its carrier.
    >
    > Thanks, Claude
     
  7. Chluu907 wrote:
    >>No. Buy 105 (although there is no 105 12-27 - which is unfortunate, as=
    I
    >>would like to build a 13-27, but Shimano don't make it easy).

    > That's exactly what I'm trying to do. I have a 13-25 cassette and a 12=
    -27
    > cassette. All we need to do is free the 17-16 cluster on the 13-25 cas=
    sette
    > and we're in business. I checked several other cassettes 11-21, 12-23,=
    but all
    > have the 17-16 cogs on a carrier. Really stinks because some of us don=
    't
    > bother with the 12 at all unless we're on a descent.

    My recollection is that the 16-17 pairs are not on a carrier, but that=20 they're just plain
    sprockets rivetted together around a spacer for=20 easier installation. You can just drill or grind
    the rivets to separate =

    them, though I don't see any point in separating them, since you will=20 find it very difficult to
    find a 16.5 tooth sprocket to put in between=20 them...

    See: http://sheldonbrown.org/carapace-2.html#fractional for an expos=E9 o= f=20 the Fractional Cog
    Conspiracy.

    Sheldon "Custom K7" Brown +----------------------------------------+
    | The race is not always to the swift, | nor the battle to the strong | -but that's the way to bet.
    | | --Damon Runyon |
    +----------------------------------------+ Harris Cyclery, West Newton, Massachusetts Phone
    617-244-9772 FAX 617-244-1041 http://harriscyclery.com Hard-to-find parts shipped Worldwide
    http://captainbike.com http://sheldonbrown.com
     
  8. Royg

    Royg Guest

    Remove the 16/17 and purchase a loose 17 tooth cog from Branford or another vendor of loose cogs.

    "Chluu907" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
    >
    > >No. Buy 105 (although there is no 105 12-27 - which is unfortunate, as I would like to build a
    > >13-27, but Shimano don't make it easy).
    >
    > That's exactly what I'm trying to do. I have a 13-25 cassette and a 12-27 cassette. All we need to
    > do is free the 17-16 cluster on the 13-25
    cassette
    > and we're in business. I checked several other cassettes 11-21, 12-23,
    but all
    > have the 17-16 cogs on a carrier. Really stinks because some of us don't bother with the 12 at all
    > unless we're on a descent.
    >
    > Claude
     
  9. Chluu907 <[email protected]> wrote:

    > >No. Buy 105 (although there is no 105 12-27 - which is unfortunate, as I would like to build a
    > >13-27, but Shimano don't make it easy).

    > That's exactly what I'm trying to do. I have a 13-25 cassette and a 12-27 cassette. All we need to
    > do is free the 17-16 cluster on the 13-25 cassette and we're in business. I checked several other
    > cassettes 11-21, 12-23, but all have the 17-16 cogs on a carrier. Really stinks because some of us
    > don't bother with the 12 at all unless we're on a descent.

    IIRC, the 12-27 has a 12,13,14,15,17-19,21-24-27. Get a 105 or similar cassette with a 13 top cog
    and loose 16, replace the 12,13 with the 13 top, and stick the 16 in between the 15 and 17.
     
  10. Paul Kopit

    Paul Kopit Guest

    On Sat, 16 Aug 2003 16:18:55 GMT, "KBH" <[email protected]> wrote:

    >No. Buy 105 (although there is no 105 12-27 - which is unfortunate, as I would like to build a
    >13-27, but Shimano don't make it easy).
    >

    13/28 is easy to make. You buy a 13/25 Ultegra and pull out the 16 and add the 28.

    You can buy a 13/23 and a 12/27 and put together your cassette too.

    If you could also buy a 105 13/26 and buy a 27t cog. The cog is aluminum and made by Tiso. Your
    local shop can get from distributor. You'll have to want the cog lots. The retail price is $34.95
     
  11. donald-<< Looking for one of these cassettes. Any reason not to get a DA?
    >><BR><BR>

    Twice the price for the same performance...little lighter but not worth $50 or so IMHO-

    Ti in the largest cogs wears a lot like steel...no better, not really worse.

    Peter Chisholm Vecchio's Bicicletteria 1833 Pearl St. Boulder, CO, 80302
    (303)440-3535 http://www.vecchios.com "Ruote convenzionali costruite eccezionalmente bene"
     
  12. Mike J-<< I have had two very noisy 12-27 DuraAce cassettes, but never a problem with an Ultegra.
    The noise drove me nuts; I thought it was coming from somewhere else in the drivetrain, but it was
    the last three cogs >><BR><BR>

    Switch to a Campagnolo rear wheel/cogset-ya don't need that 12t anyway......

    Peter Chisholm Vecchio's Bicicletteria 1833 Pearl St. Boulder, CO, 80302
    (303)440-3535 http://www.vecchios.com "Ruote convenzionali costruite eccezionalmente bene"
     
  13. Chluu-<< Out of curiosity, can the cogs be removed from the carrier? I woul like to separate the 16
    17 cogs from its carrier. >><BR><BR>

    Nope, not on DA or ultegra..

    Peter Chisholm Vecchio's Bicicletteria 1833 Pearl St. Boulder, CO, 80302
    (303)440-3535 http://www.vecchios.com "Ruote convenzionali costruite eccezionalmente bene"
     
  14. Mike Krueger

    Mike Krueger Guest

    << Out of curiosity, can the cogs be removed from the carrier? I would like to separate the 16 17
    cogs from its carrier. >>

    The cogs are riveted together, but can be separated with some effort and a few tools. I ground the
    heads off the rivets with a dremel tool,
     
  15. Paul Kopit wrote:
    > On Sat, 16 Aug 2003 16:18:55 GMT, "KBH" <[email protected]> wrote:
    >
    >> No. Buy 105 (although there is no 105 12-27 - which is unfortunate, as I would like to build a
    >> 13-27, but Shimano don't make it easy).
    >>
    >
    > 13/28 is easy to make. You buy a 13/25 Ultegra and pull out the 16 and add the 28.
    >

    Will Ultegra or DA really handle a 28 cog? I thought 27 was maximum without exchanging the rear
    derailleur for a MBT component like XT or similar.

    --
    Perre

    You have to be smarter than a robot to reply.
     
  16. Paul Kopit

    Paul Kopit Guest

    On Sun, 17 Aug 2003 19:00:23 GMT, "Per Elmsäter" <[email protected]> wrote:

    >Will Ultegra or DA really handle a 28 cog? I thought 27 was maximum

    No problem, even for DA 7402.
     
  17. Per Elmsäter wrote:
    > Will Ultegra or DA really handle a 28 cog? I thought 27 was maximum without exchanging the rear
    > derailleur for a MBT component like XT or similar.

    Most deraileur ratings are a little on the conservative side. You can usually get away with a few
    teeth more than rated. I wouldn't be suprised if you could get away with 30T.

    --Bill Davidson
    --
    Please remove ".nospam" from my address for email replies.

    I'm a 17 year veteran of usenet -- you'd think I'd be over it by now
     
  18. Tom Kunich

    Tom Kunich Guest

    "Paul Kopit" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]...
    > On Sun, 17 Aug 2003 19:00:23 GMT, "Per Elmsäter" <[email protected]> wrote:
    >
    > >Will Ultegra or DA really handle a 28 cog? I thought 27 was maximum
    >
    > No problem, even for DA 7402.

    But the DA is at it's extreme limit. They claim it will only shift a 26 then fudged it to 27 but it
    will shift a 28 but the chain length has to be spot on.
     
  19. Paul Kopit wrote:
    > The current 3x10 long cage rear derailleurs are longer than XT long cage and can handle a 34t cog.
    > The Centaur works fine on my tandem with a 32.

    Interesting. It was my understanding though that to do a "Shimagnolo" setup, you need to use the 9
    speed stuff and as near as I can tell, you have to go all the way down to Veloce to get a long cage
    9 speed rear deraileur. Would it work with 9 speed ergos and a 10 speed Record, Chorus or Centaur
    rear deraileur? What's the difference in cable throw between the 9sp and 10sp Campy rear deraileurs?

    --Bill Davidson
    --
    Please remove ".nospam" from my address for email replies.

    I'm a 17 year veteran of usenet -- you'd think I'd be over it by now
     
  20. Paul Kopit

    Paul Kopit Guest

    On Mon, 18 Aug 2003 15:27:02 -0700, Bill Davidson <[email protected]> wrote:

    >Would it work with 9 speed ergos and a 10 speed Record, Chorus or Centaur rear deraileur?

    The 3x10 triple rear derailleurs are 10 sp. The current long cage Veloce is a medium cage in Record
    and Centaur. In 2004 I believe that the Veloce will also have a 3x10 option. Either 9sp or 10sp Ergo
    will shift the 9sp Shimano cassette fine.
     
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