2003 Giant Warp DS 1 owners...

Discussion in 'Mountain Bikes' started by MTBScottie, Jun 22, 2003.

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  1. MTBScottie

    MTBScottie Guest

    I would just like to know your over all opinions of the bike, and any front or rear suspension
    upgrades you may have made.
     
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  2. On 22 Jun 2003 19:20:40 -0700, [email protected] wrote:

    >I would just like to know your over all opinions of the bike, and any front or rear suspension
    >upgrades you may have made.

    I sell these, and consider them poster children of why one should buy a hard tail in that
    price range.

    Giant makes some excellent full suspension bikes, such as the VT, the NRS, and the AC. I LOVE my
    personal VT1. The Warp is a toy.

    Barry
     
  3. MTBScottie

    MTBScottie Guest

    B a r r y B u r k e J r . <Keep it in the [email protected]> wrote in message
    news:<[email protected]>...
    > On 22 Jun 2003 19:20:40 -0700, [email protected] wrote:
    >
    > >I would just like to know your over all opinions of the bike, and any front or rear suspension
    > >upgrades you may have made.
    >
    > I sell these, and consider them poster children of why one should buy a hard tail in that
    > price range.
    >
    > Giant makes some excellent full suspension bikes, such as the VT, the NRS, and the AC. I LOVE my
    > personal VT1. The Warp is a toy.
    >
    > Barry

    Well, here's the situation. I have a 2002 Rainier, which I love very much. I just traded my full
    suspension away over the internet, and now have a much lighter hardtail. I went on a group ride last
    Wednesday and was watching a guy on an AC2 do some drops and it made me miss my full suspension. I'm
    thinking of trading my Rainier for another Giant, and thought the Warp would be something I could
    trade for and not be paying on forever. Although it would not be used as a primary bike, I don't
    want something like a "toy" as you call it, so maybe I'll look into the AC2 then.
     
  4. M_Blood

    M_Blood New Member

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    Well, here's the situation. I have a 2002 Rainier, which I love very much. I just traded my full
    suspension away over the internet, and now have a much lighter hardtail. I went on a group ride last
    Wednesday and was watching a guy on an AC2 do some drops and it made me miss my full suspension. I'm
    thinking of trading my Rainier for another Giant, and thought the Warp would be something I could
    trade for and not be paying on forever. Although it would not be used as a primary bike, I don't
    want something like a "toy" as you call it, so maybe I'll look into the AC2 then. [/B][/QUOTE]

    I agree..don't waste good money on the Warp...my first MTB was compairable to the Warp and although at the time I thought it was great, I can now see it is a childrens bike. I own a Giant ATX 850 and a Giant AC DS 2. The AC is a real bike....I couldn't see anyone happy on the Warp with any MTB experience.
     
  5. R.White

    R.White Guest

    B a r r y B u r k e J r . <Keep it in the [email protected]> wrote in message
    news:<[email protected]>...
    > On 22 Jun 2003 19:20:40 -0700, [email protected] wrote:
    >
    > >I would just like to know your over all opinions of the bike, and any front or rear suspension
    > >upgrades you may have made.
    >
    > I sell these, and consider them poster children of why one should buy a hard tail in that
    > price range.
    >
    > Giant makes some excellent full suspension bikes, such as the VT, the NRS, and the AC. I LOVE my
    > personal VT1. The Warp is a toy.

    What makes it a *toy*?

    I sold them too. Bought a Warp DS1 2 years ago and haven't had a single problem with the exception
    of not liking the *half pipes*.
     
  6. R.White

    R.White Guest

    [email protected] wrote in message news:<112a5991.[email protected]>...
    > I would just like to know your over all opinions of the bike, and any front or rear suspension
    > upgrades you may have made.

    I've had mine (2001) 2 years now and haven't changed a thing except for the half-pipe shifters.
    Certain posters think it's a URT, but evidently haven't seen one in person. 2003 uses a Manitou Axel
    Super up front, mine has a Marzocchi Z5 coil/oil. '03 also uses Avid's disk while mine has Hayes. I
    had my choice of any bike in the shop at dealer cost + shipping and that included the AC series (VT
    wasn't made then) and Cannondale. I chose the Warp for it's simplicity and the fact that when placed
    side by side, it's rear suspension is an almost exact copy of C-dale Super V. I've ridden with
    another rider who has an AC1 and I'll go anywhere he does at the same speed, etc. The only
    difference is his wallet is a lot lighter than mine.
     
  7. MTBScottie

    MTBScottie Guest

    M_Blood <no"trueblood"[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:<[email protected]>...
    > Well, here's the situation. I have a 2002 Rainier, which I love very much. I just traded my full
    > suspension away over the internet, and now have a much lighter hardtail. I went on a group ride
    > last Wednesday and was watching a guy on an AC2 do some drops and it made me miss my full
    > suspension. I'm thinking of trading my Rainier for another Giant, and thought the Warp would be
    > something I could trade for and not be paying on forever. Although it would not be used as a
    > primary bike, I don't want something like a "toy" as you call it, so maybe I'll look into the
    > AC2 then.
    >
    > I agree..don't waste good money on the Warp...my first MTB was compairable to the Warp and
    > although at the time I thought it was great, I can now see it is a childrens bike. I own a Giant
    > ATX 850 and a Giant AC DS 2. The AC is a real bike....I couldn't see anyone happy on the Warp with
    > any MTB experience.

    Thanks for all the input, sounds like I'd be making a step back. I think what I'll do is watch shops
    like supergo.com or others and maybe buy just a high end frame and build a bike myself.
     
  8. Jd

    Jd Guest

    [email protected] (R.White) wrote in message
    news:<[email protected]>...
    > I've had mine (2001) 2 years now and haven't changed a thing except for the half-pipe shifters.
    > Certain posters think it's a URT, but evidently haven't seen one in person.<snip neven more tripe>

    If this isn't a URT, then tell us all what it is ricky:
    http://www.giant-bicycle.com/us/catalogue_popup.asp?sPageID=popup&popuptype=zoom&zoomid=10639

    I bet you sell used cars too.

    The bottom line is that you can't polish a turd and URTs are crappy as well as outdated by about
    ten years.

    JD
     
  9. On 23 Jun 2003 19:12:13 -0700, [email protected] (R.White) wrote:

    >B a r r y B u r k e J r . <Keep it in the [email protected]> wrote in message
    >news:<[email protected]>...
    >> On 22 Jun 2003 19:20:40 -0700, [email protected] wrote:
    >>
    >> >I would just like to know your over all opinions of the bike, and any front or rear suspension
    >> >upgrades you may have made.
    >>
    >> I sell these, and consider them poster children of why one should buy a hard tail in that
    >> price range.
    >>
    >> Giant makes some excellent full suspension bikes, such as the VT, the NRS, and the AC. I LOVE my
    >> personal VT1. The Warp is a toy.
    >
    >What makes it a *toy*?
    >
    >I sold them too. Bought a Warp DS1 2 years ago and haven't had a single problem with the exception
    >of not liking the *half pipes*.

    The component spec, the fork, and the quality of the rear suspension.

    Take a technical, off-road ride on a properly set up NRS, VT, or AC, and you'll see the differences
    in each design goal, and what I mean by "toy".

    The Warp has more in common with Giant's comfort bikes than the better bred fullys Giant offers.

    I'm glad you like yours, but the guy asked for the straight up. <G>

    Barry,
     
  10. On 23 Jun 2003 19:12:13 -0700, [email protected] (R.White) wrote:

    >B a r r y B u r k e J r . <Keep it in the [email protected]> wrote in message
    >news:<2[email protected]>...
    >> On 22 Jun 2003 19:20:40 -0700, [email protected] wrote:
    >>
    >> >I would just like to know your over all opinions of the bike, and any front or rear suspension
    >> >upgrades you may have made.
    >>
    >> I sell these, and consider them poster children of why one should buy a hard tail in that
    >> price range.
    >>
    >> Giant makes some excellent full suspension bikes, such as the VT, the NRS, and the AC. I LOVE my
    >> personal VT1. The Warp is a toy.
    >
    >What makes it a *toy*?
    >
    >I sold them too. Bought a Warp DS1 2 years ago and haven't had a single problem with the exception
    >of not liking the *half pipes*.
     
  11. On 23 Jun 2003 19:12:13 -0700, [email protected] (R.White) wrote:

    >What makes it a *toy*?
    >
    >I sold them too. Bought a Warp DS1 2 years ago and haven't had a single problem with the exception
    >of not liking the *half pipes*.

    Take a technical, off-road ride on a properly set up NRS, VT, or AC, and you'll see the
    differences in each design goal, and what I mean by "toy". If you actually do this, I'd be shocked
    if you don't see a major difference. If you can't tell a difference, you have definitely purchased
    the right bike.

    The Warp has more in common with Giant's comfort bikes than the better bred fullys Giant offers. The
    high-end Warp simply has a few higher quality parts on a low-end frame.

    I'm glad you like yours, but the guy asked for the straight up. <G> All we can do is offer our
    unique perspectives.

    Barry
     
  12. R.White

    R.White Guest

    [email protected] (JD) wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
    > [email protected] (R.White) wrote in message
    > news:<[email protected]>...
    > > I've had mine (2001) 2 years now and haven't changed a thing except for the half-pipe shifters.
    > > Certain posters think it's a URT, but evidently haven't seen one in person.<snip neven more
    > > tripe>
    >
    > If this isn't a URT, then tell us all what it is ricky:
    > http://www.giant-bicycle.com/us/catalogue_popup.asp?sPageID=popup&popuptype=zoom&zoomid=10639

    It's a bike you haven't seen in person let alone ridden therefore it's a bike you haven't a clue
    about. As usual.

    If the BB/crank were located on the rear traingle, isolating the entire drivetrainlike your old
    Trek, then yes, it would be a URT.

    <http://www.math.chalmers.se/~olahe/Bike/Rear/urt.html>

    The Warp's BB/crank is located on the main triangle. Had you seen it in person instead of just
    looking at pictures, you wouldn't spout off while being so un-informed. Of course that no surprise
    to some of us.

    Here's a close-up to make it clear for you.

    <http://photos.yahoo.com/bc/ricknjoelle/lst?.dir=/Giant+Drivetrain&.src=ph&.order=&.view=t&.done=ht-
    tp%3a//photos.yahoo.com/bc/ricknjoelle/lst%3f%26.dir=/Giant%2bDrivetrain%26.src=ph%26.view=t>

    > I bet you sell used cars too.

    If I did, I'd be better informed than you.

    > The bottom line is that you can't polish a turd and URTs are crappy as well as outdated by about
    > ten years.

    The bottom line is the Warp isn't a URT. Seems the only thing outdated is you.
     
  13. R.White

    R.White Guest

    B a r r y B u r k e J r . <Keep it in the [email protected]> wrote in message
    news:<[email protected]>...
    > On 23 Jun 2003 19:12:13 -0700, [email protected] (R.White) wrote:
    >
    > >What makes it a *toy*?
    > >
    > >I sold them too. Bought a Warp DS1 2 years ago and haven't had a single problem with the
    > >exception of not liking the *half pipes*.
    >
    >
    > Take a technical, off-road ride on a properly set up NRS, VT, or AC, and you'll see the
    > differences in each design goal, and what I mean by "toy". If you actually do this, I'd be shocked
    > if you don't see a major difference. If you can't tell a difference, you have definitely purchased
    > the right bike.

    I understand what your point is, but I'm riding the same trails as I rode on my Park Pre, C-Dale
    M700, C-Dale M900, Bianchi BASS SS, and my junky old Schwinn Mesa. The Warp is far above my previous
    rides in terms of comfort and performance. I wanted a single pivot design and the Warp was the only
    Giant to fit the bill among the 2 brands in the shop. I spent extensive time riding a C-Dale Super V
    w/ the Moto fork and, to me, the Warp had the same ride as the Super V at a much lower cost. My cost
    for the Warp DS1 $680 vs the C-dale @ $1100. The price difference left me with a nice bike and
    enough money to get my first recumbent.

    The Warp suspension is an almost exact copy of the Super V. I just don't see it as a toy. While I'm
    sure the other offerings by Giant have different rides/goals, the Warp is a perfectly capable bike.

    >
    > The Warp has more in common with Giant's comfort bikes than the better bred fullys Giant offers.
    > The high-end Warp simply has a few higher quality parts on a low-end frame.

    I don't consider the Warp fame "low-end" by any means. Granted it's not ALUXX SL like the AC, VT and
    NRS,it's just plain old butted ALUXX. What makes the "SL" tubing so top shelf that is makes the Warp
    so low end?

    > I'm glad you like yours, but the guy asked for the straight up. <G> All we can do is offer our
    > unique perspectives.

    No problem there.
     
  14. In article <[email protected]>, [email protected] says...
    > B a r r y B u r k e J r . <Keep it in the [email protected]> wrote in message
    > news:<[email protected]>...
    > > On 22 Jun 2003 19:20:40 -0700, [email protected] wrote:
    > >
    > > >I would just like to know your over all opinions of the bike, and any front or rear suspension
    > > >upgrades you may have made.
    > >
    > > I sell these, and consider them poster children of why one should buy a hard tail in that price
    > > range.
    > >
    > > Giant makes some excellent full suspension bikes, such as the VT, the NRS, and the AC. I LOVE my
    > > personal VT1. The Warp is a toy.
    >
    > What makes it a *toy*?
    >
    > I sold them too. Bought a Warp DS1 2 years ago and haven't had a single problem with the exception
    > of not liking the *half pipes*.
    >

    URT is what you get on finer bikes at Walmart these days, there's really no excuse for a so called
    top brand name bike to have it. There was an embarrassing episode where Specialized used a copy of
    these bikes at a full suspension Hardrock offering, fortunately it disappeared from the catalogue
    after one year.
    --
    _________________________
    Chris Phillipo - Cape Breton, Nova Scotia http://www.ramsays-online.com
     
  15. In article <[email protected]>, [email protected] says...
    > Stephen Baker wrote:
    >
    > >>If the BB/crank were located on the rear traingle, isolating the entire drivetrainlike your old
    > >>Trek, then yes, it would be a URT.
    > >
    > >
    > > URT = Unified Rear Triangle. If the rear triangle is "all-of-a-piece", and does not change
    > > geometry when the sus compresses, then it is a URT. The position of the BB has nothing to do
    > > with the unity of the rear triangle.
    >
    > Bzzt. Rick's right on this - for it to be a URT the BB has to be in the suspended rear triangle
    > (you should have read the link that Rick provided). Otherwise all single-pivot machines would be
    > URT, and they're not.
    >
    > I had my suspicions about the Warp not being URT, but not enough to have a fight about it. Having
    > seen the photos, it's clear that the Warp is non-URT.
    >
    >

    Maybe the current model isn't but it doens't change the fact that it is just another popgo stick
    with the rear axle traveling in an arc. If the bike had an engine instead of pedals it might be a
    good design.
    --
    _________________________
    Chris Phillipo - Cape Breton, Nova Scotia http://www.ramsays-online.com
     
  16. > I understand what your point is, but I'm riding the same trails as I rode on my Park Pre, C-Dale
    > M700, C-Dale M900, Bianchi BASS SS, and my junky old Schwinn Mesa. The Warp is far above my
    > previous rides in terms of comfort and performance. I wanted a single pivot design and the Warp
    > was the only Giant to fit the bill among the 2 brands in the shop. I spent extensive time riding a
    > C-Dale Super V w/ the Moto fork and, to me, the Warp had the same ride as the Super V at a much
    > lower cost. My cost for the Warp DS1 $680 vs the C-dale @ $1100. The price difference left me with
    > a nice bike and enough money to get my first recumbent.
    >
    > The Warp suspension is an almost exact copy of the Super V. I just don't see it as a toy. While
    > I'm sure the other offerings by Giant have different rides/goals, the Warp is a perfectly
    > capable bike.
    >

    The model that came with an RST 281 "double triple clamp" fork with
    1.5" of travel was a toy, trust me :) It's still better than a suspension seatpost...I guess.
    --
    _________________________
    Chris Phillipo - Cape Breton, Nova Scotia http://www.ramsays-online.com
     
  17. Rich

    Rich Guest

    Chris Phillipo wrote:
    >>I understand what your point is, but I'm riding the same trails as I rode on my Park Pre, C-Dale
    >>M700, C-Dale M900, Bianchi BASS SS, and my junky old Schwinn Mesa. The Warp is far above my
    >>previous rides in terms of comfort and performance. I wanted a single pivot design and the Warp
    >>was the only Giant to fit the bill among the 2 brands in the shop. I spent extensive time riding a
    >>C-Dale Super V w/ the Moto fork and, to me, the Warp had the same ride as the Super V at a much
    >>lower cost. My cost for the Warp DS1 $680 vs the C-dale @ $1100. The price difference left me with
    >>a nice bike and enough money to get my first recumbent.
    >>
    >>The Warp suspension is an almost exact copy of the Super V. I just don't see it as a toy. While
    >>I'm sure the other offerings by Giant have different rides/goals, the Warp is a perfectly
    >>capable bike.
    >>
    >
    >
    > The model that came with an RST 281 "double triple clamp" fork with
    > 1.5" of travel was a toy, trust me :) It's still better than a suspension seatpost...I guess.

    Watch it buddy, suspension seatposts have their place. For those who have bad backs but like
    hardtails they are just what the doctor ordered.
     
  18. MTBScottie

    MTBScottie Guest

    B a r r y B u r k e J r . <Keep it in the [email protected]> wrote in message
    news:<[email protected]>...
    > On 23 Jun 2003 19:12:13 -0700, [email protected] (R.White) wrote:
    >
    > >What makes it a *toy*?
    > >
    > >I sold them too. Bought a Warp DS1 2 years ago and haven't had a single problem with the
    > >exception of not liking the *half pipes*.
    >
    >
    > Take a technical, off-road ride on a properly set up NRS, VT, or AC, and you'll see the
    > differences in each design goal, and what I mean by "toy". If you actually do this, I'd be shocked
    > if you don't see a major difference. If you can't tell a difference, you have definitely purchased
    > the right bike.
    >
    > The Warp has more in common with Giant's comfort bikes than the better bred fullys Giant offers.
    > The high-end Warp simply has a few higher quality parts on a low-end frame.
    >

    I guess the bottom line is that I have grown as a rider, and have a great lighter hardtail now, and
    am used to better frame quality and components, and settling for less would be stupid. Although I
    will sing the praise of Giant forever, I am dissapointed that they don't offer something in the VT
    or AC line in the $1500 range. I know the NRS is right around that, but, it's not really what I'm
    looking for in a full suspension bike. I want something that has 4-5 inches of travel. I just looked
    at the Jamis XL and the base Specialzed Enduro models, all around my price range.
    > I'm glad you like yours, but the guy asked for the straight up. <G> All we can do is offer our
    > unique perspectives.
    >
    > Barry
     
  19. Dave Stocker

    Dave Stocker Guest

    "bomba" <[email protected]> schrieb im Newsbeitrag news:[email protected]...
    > Stephen Baker wrote:
    >
    > >>If the BB/crank were located on the rear traingle, isolating the entire drivetrainlike your old
    > >>Trek, then yes, it would be a URT.
    > >
    > >
    > > URT = Unified Rear Triangle. If the rear triangle is "all-of-a-piece", and does not change
    > > geometry
    when the
    > > sus compresses, then it is a URT. The position of the BB has nothing to
    do
    > > with the unity of the rear triangle.
    >
    > Bzzt. Rick's right on this - for it to be a URT the BB has to be in the suspended rear triangle
    > (you should have read the link that Rick provided). Otherwise all single-pivot machines would be
    > URT, and they're not.
    >

    Bomba and Rick are right. URT is single pivot with the BB on the rear triangle.
    http://www.math.chalmers.se/~olahe/Bike/Rear/urt.html

    > I had my suspicions about the Warp not being URT, but not enough to have a fight about it. Having
    > seen the photos, it's clear that the Warp is non-URT.
    >

    It is impossible to say with 100% certainty when the pivot is hidden by the chainring, but if
    you look carefully at the seatstay and chainstay in the original picture, they look as if they
    should intersect at the BB. This would be unusual (but I have seen it) though and stays (esp
    chainstays) are in the habit of changing direction as they get close to the BB (e.g.on the Blur,
    FSR and this Giant).

    BTW- If the piviot is AT the BB, is it URT or single pivot.

    -Dave
     
  20. Dave Stocker

    Dave Stocker Guest

    "Chris Phillipo" <[email protected]> schrieb im Newsbeitrag
    news:[email protected]...
    >
    >
    > The model that came with an RST 281 "double triple clamp" fork with
    > 1.5" of travel was a toy, trust me :) It's still better than a suspension seatpost...I guess.
    > --

    I have an RST 381DH with double bridges and about as much travel as an RS Indy out in my garage. I
    never really understood the purpose of triple clamps on short travel forks. I am starting to see
    them on huffygoose type bikes, so I guess I can answer my own question.

    -Dave
     
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