24lb Gios vs Cervelo Carbon Soloist

[sogood]

No wonder your name is "alienator." It only takes one look at your post history to see that you have issues with people.

No, Alienator only has problems with people who make groundless statements, with no facts or science to back them. But if you can bring out objective facts, then you can get even with him.

Otherwise... Go and kill yourself first!

 

[Powerful Pete]

ROTFL.

This thread is becoming increasingly entertaining.

 

[Bob Ross]

I'm still trying to figure out exactly when DQ and the other guy agreed to race each other. It's ******' hilarious every time someone comes on a forum and brags about how they spanked a complete stranger up a climb or summat. Talk about pathetic.....

+1

You hear all kinds of anecdotes about how "I caught up to and passed this other rider who was up ahead even though he was on a more expensive bike blah blah blah..." But you never hear anyone bragging about how they stayed ahead of all those other guys who were pursuing them during their ride!

Guess what: It's not a competition unless you tell both teams the game is on.

 

[Don Quijote]

Why's the guy an asshole: because he wouldn't tell you how much he payed? You might look around and see that most people ain't so anxious to boast of how much they have in their bikes. I've never run in to anyone on the road that was all hot and bothered to talk about how much their bike cost. Of all the things I care about...well, how much some other guys spent on his bike doesn't even make the list.

It's truly dumbfounding how presumptuous people are. Someone's an asshole because they didn't speak to you on the road or had a certain look on their face? How do you even have the cojones to even assume that you know anything about such a person or what was going on in their head or their life that day?

And why the hell do you keep goin' on about how your LBS won't warranty your Cervelo because you bought through eBay? Your the one that bought it, so the responsibility for that lack of warranty falls on your shoulders, no one else's. Sucks to be you, don't it?

I'm still trying to figure out exactly when DQ and the other guy agreed to race each other. It's ******' hilarious every time someone comes on a forum and brags about how they spanked a complete stranger up a climb or summat. Talk about pathetic.....

Maybe JTE83 oughta start a thread about how much he spent on his bike. It'll be riveting, I bet!

What is pathetic is not to be able to outride someone twice your age and riding a much lighter, more fancy and more expensive bike, and not be able to reply a friendly salutation due to a **** poor attitude coupled with shortness of breath, he-he...
I will always approach my road riding as "a racer". If you are one you should understand that.\
Who knows, maybe I will be on your rear (wheel) one of these days, and maybe you too may experience the sweet sound of steel on your rear (wheel, that is).
I suggest you re-evaluate your bullying strategies and become more polite, eh?
I certainly do not appreciate or care for your arrogant profanity. I have no respect or tolerance for that. DQ

 

[alienator]

What is pathetic is not to be able to outride someone twice your age and riding a much lighter, more fancy and more expensive bike, and not be able to reply a friendly salutation due to a **** poor attitude coupled with shortness of breath, he-he...

What is pathetic is assuming that someone was even interested in any "competition with you." I mean, how presumptuous can you get? Really, with such presumptions, you'd think you'd need psychological intervention to address such "needs." Really pathetic.

I will always approach my road riding as "a racer". If you are one you should understand that.[\quote]

This is so laughable. Only a wannabe racer would say something like that. Real racers understand the difference between a race, training, and a nice day out on the road. You don't, so that speaks loudly about you. In fact, I think the forums and whatever are replete with stories about regular people encountering "racers" much greater than you and finding these racers to be anything but what you suggest racers. The group ride I do most frequently includes such folks, and they're anything but what you suggest.

I mean really, how stupid do you have to be to think that people on the road are aware that they're supposed to be racing you? You must imagine yourself to be some great figure in cycling, if not the world. I'll bet your the same sort of pooftah who, in his car, "races" another car to the next exit, turn, or stoplight. Pathetic.

What is more comparable to your racing "imaginings" is Don Quixote's tilting at windmills.

Who knows, maybe I will be on your rear (wheel) one of these days, and maybe you too may experience the sweet sound of steel on your rear (wheel, that is).

Oh, am I supposed to race you if I "find you on my rear wheel?" Sorry, Poofers, I have my own riding agenda and unfortunately for you, it has nothing to do with you. Nope. Ride on, fella, in your imaginary little race.

Your sort is seen a lot of places. I remember little Walter Mitty's like you getting all excited because they thought that they'd won "practice" when I was racing motorcycles. Little did those underachievers know, winning practice--or in your case, "beating" someone that wasn't racing you--is about as meaninful as.....well....nothing. It has no meaning at all.

I suggest you re-evaluate your bullying strategies and become more polite, eh?
I certainly do not appreciate or care for your arrogant profanity. I have no respect or tolerance for that. DQ

Bullying? Boy, you've got it wrong. I just call "BS" when I see it, and in that light, Poofers, you're spouting a lot of BS. You're posing in the extreme.

I assume or pretend no arrogance. Sorry. No, arrogance is, in reality, making the limp assumption that a complete stranger will know that he's supposed to be competing with you.

As for your respect, well, no loss there. Having the respect of a poser is about as valueless as something can get. I mean really. What value is your respect? Eh? I prefer to respect people and earn the respect of people that aren't so full of themselves as to make the ill-informed assumptions that you make. Nah, I consider it a good day when I discover that I've not earned the respect of someone like you. That's like finding out that Michael Jackson won't be my friend or that some child molester doesn't want to hang out with me: again, that's a good thing.

Toodles, Walter M.

 

[AmpedCycle]

What is pathetic is not to be able to outride someone twice your age and riding a much lighter, more fancy and more expensive bike, and not be able to reply a friendly salutation due to a **** poor attitude coupled with shortness of breath, he-he...
I will always approach my road riding as "a racer". If you are one you should understand that.\
Who knows, maybe I will be on your rear (wheel) one of these days, and maybe you too may experience the sweet sound of steel on your rear (wheel, that is).
I suggest you re-evaluate your bullying strategies and become more polite, eh?
I certainly do not appreciate or care for your arrogant profanity. I have no respect or tolerance for that. DQ

I like how you put "arrogant profanity" in there, DQ. That's about the conclusion I came to after reading this guys' posts. I'd throw a little "disruptive hostility" in there for good measure, too. Nobody likes alienator.

 

[sideshow_bob]

I will always approach my road riding as "a racer". If you are one you should understand that.

My last years log showed 70+ races for the 2006 year. I'd consider that I'm someone who races a lot. I still fail to get the attitude of people having imaginary races out on the road against people who don't know they are supposed to be racing. In fact I think if you are a racer then you know the difference between being out on the road training and being under actual race conditions, which seem to fail to do. Do you actually race other than those imaginary numbers out on the road?

If you ever caught my wheel and 'whooshed' past me on the road, my care factor would be about zero as you became a spec in the distance, regardless of the bike I'm on, or the one you're on. Conversely if I rode over the top of you it would indicate exactly nothing about either of our abilities.

Recently I saw a couple of guys in the distance on a training ride, who I caught up to over a period of time and went past. One of them was a Rabobank rider who placed in at least one (and maybe two stages) of The Tour of California. Given that I've seen him race a number of times (and we are not even in the same universe of ability), it's stupid to think that me rolling over him in a training run indicates anything other than we were both out riding bikes on the same day (even if he did have a sweet Colnago!)

--brett

 

[alienator]

To put the cherry on top of Don Quijote's idiocy......I doubt that many 20 year olds on the best equipment possible could outride Ned Overend, even if he was on a loaded touring bike....and he's about 51 or so now. Tinker Juarez is 'bout 45 and could easily stomp, if he chose to do so, just about any 22 year old comers.

Your ideas about age and performance are so far out of touch as to be laughable. Really. Please, educate yourself, because your arguments are doing your cause more harm than good. Is it your goal to make yourself look like such a fool?

Look, over there......I see a defenseless windmill..............

 

[Don Quijote]

What is pathetic is assuming that someone was even interested in any "competition with you." I mean, how presumptuous can you get? Really, with such presumptions, you'd think you'd need psychological intervention to address such "needs." Really pathetic.



Oh, am I supposed to race you if I "find you on my rear wheel?" Sorry, Poofers, I have my own riding agenda and unfortunately for you, it has nothing to do with you. Nope. Ride on, fella, in your imaginary little race.

Your sort is seen a lot of places. I remember little Walter Mitty's like you getting all excited because they thought that they'd won "practice" when I was racing motorcycles. Little did those underachievers know, winning practice--or in your case, "beating" someone that wasn't racing you--is about as meaninful as.....well....nothing. It has no meaning at all.



Bullying? Boy, you've got it wrong. I just call "BS" when I see it, and in that light, Poofers, you're spouting a lot of BS. You're posing in the extreme.

I assume or pretend no arrogance. Sorry. No, arrogance is, in reality, making the limp assumption that a complete stranger will know that he's supposed to be competing with you.

As for your respect, well, no loss there. Having the respect of a poser is about as valueless as something can get. I mean really. What value is your respect? Eh? I prefer to respect people and earn the respect of people that aren't so full of themselves as to make the ill-informed assumptions that you make. Nah, I consider it a good day when I discover that I've not earned the respect of someone like you. That's like finding out that Michael Jackson won't be my friend or that some child molester doesn't want to hang out with me: again, that's a good thing.

Toodles, Walter M.

Toatlly out of touch with your concept of "self". I would not pick you as a friend either, the feeling is totally mutual. Noodles, I mean Toodles, grow up! DQ

 

[alienator]

I like how you put "arrogant profanity" in there, DQ. That's about the conclusion I came to after reading this guys' posts. I'd throw a little "disruptive hostility" in there for good measure, too. Nobody likes alienator.

Waahhhhhhhh! Oh, golly!

Oh, wait, I'm supposed to take this seriously? More BS for the chud chewing internet bovines...that' what you're chuckin' out there. Again, you make some conclusions that you can't back up.

I'd hate to live in your tiny little world.

 

[alienator]

Toatlly out of touch with your concept of "self". I would not pick you as a friend either, the feeling is totally mutual. Noodles, I mean Toodles, grow up! DQ

Yeah, I see you can't respond on point. I guess that shows just how rice paper thin your racing "supposition", as well as the rest of your "arguments", are. See, I prefer to hang out with people that aren't posing and fantasizing all ride long about racing people that ain't racing them. See, I prefer to ride with folks that ain't so infantile as you suggest you are.

You're one to talk about growing up? You should re-read your "racing" comments: they're great examples of pre-pubescent chortling.

 

[Don Quijote]

Yeah, I see you can't respond on point. I guess that shows just how rice paper thin your racing "supposition", as well as the rest of your "arguments", are. See, I prefer to hang out with people that aren't posing and fantasizing all ride long about racing people that ain't racing them. See, I prefer to ride with folks that ain't so infantile as you suggest you are.

You're one to talk about growing up? You should re-read your "racing" comments: they're great examples of pre-pubescent chortling.

You may also benefit from a sound course on ANGER MANAGEMENT.
You seem quite hostile and perhaps this forum is not the best place for you to ventilate. Try professional help, man. I believe we will all appreciate it not hearing from your obnoxious comments with such poor taste.
I would not like to be you...DQ

 

[alienator]

My last years log showed 70+ races for the 2006 year. I'd consider that I'm someone who races a lot. I still fail to get the attitude of people having imaginary races out on the road against people who don't know they are supposed to be racing. In fact I think if you are a racer then you know the difference between being out on the road training and being under actual race conditions, which seem to fail to do. Do you actually race other than those imaginary numbers out on the road?

If you ever caught my wheel and 'whooshed' past me on the road, my care factor would be about zero as you became a spec in the distance, regardless of the bike I'm on, or the one you're on. Conversely if I rode over the top of you it would indicate exactly nothing about either of our abilities.

Recently I saw a couple of guys in the distance on a training ride, who I caught up to over a period of time and went past. One of them was a Rabobank rider who placed in at least one (and maybe two stages) of The Tour of California. Given that I've seen him race a number of times (and we are not even in the same universe of ability), it's stupid to think that me rolling over him in a training run indicates anything other than we were both out riding bikes on the same day (even if he did have a sweet Colnago!)

--brett

+1.

One day in the fall, while riding to school with my bookbag on my back full of books and a laptop, I happened to pass Gord Fraser. I didn't suddenly think that I had kicked his butt. I waved and said, "hi," and that was it.

Likewise, I doubt that when, a few weeks ago, Tom Danieleson and Phil Zajicek stood up and sprinted away from the local ride, the Saturday Morning Shoot Out, well...I doubt they thought, "Man,we kicked their butts! We rock!"

 

[Don Quijote]

I like how you put "arrogant profanity" in there, DQ. That's about the conclusion I came to after reading this guys' posts. I'd throw a little "disruptive hostility" in there for good measure, too. Nobody likes alienator.

Thanks, man. I just can not believe this guy is still allow to roam this forum with those serious personality and character flaws! A bully like that would not last in my neighborhood.

 

[alienator]

You may also benefit from a sound course on ANGER MANAGEMENT.
You seem quite hostile and perhaps this forum is not the best place for you to ventilate. Try professional help, man. I believe we will all appreciate it not hearing from your obnoxious comments with such poor taste.
I would not like to be you...DQ

Anger management? Man, you assume a lot? Are you able to get through a single day without making such erroneous assumptions? Can you get through a single day without committing such egregious boners of thought?

Poor taste? Really? As measured by what, your standards? Wow, you really get defensive when people call "BS" on your imaginary racing, eh? Must be a sensitive spot.

 

[alienator]

Thanks, man. I just can not believe this guy is still allow to roam this forum with those serious personality and character flaws! A bully like that would not last in my neighborhood.

Bully, eh? Because I called BS on your "racing?" Heh. Laughable. Now, I guess I should call BS on your holier than thou attitude.

That's not bullying, BTW, that's calling something what it is.

Oh, please tell us about your rough and tumble neighborhood, a place that must be so pure, chaste, and over-flowing with barely constrained, testosterone charged power. Gee, it's no wonder that you "beat" so many cyclists on your little "races."

 

[Don Quijote]

My last years log showed 70+ races for the 2006 year. I'd consider that I'm someone who races a lot. I still fail to get the attitude of people having imaginary races out on the road against people who don't know they are supposed to be racing. In fact I think if you are a racer then you know the difference between being out on the road training and being under actual race conditions, which seem to fail to do. Do you actually race other than those imaginary numbers out on the road?

If you ever caught my wheel and 'whooshed' past me on the road, my care factor would be about zero as you became a spec in the distance, regardless of the bike I'm on, or the one you're on. Conversely if I rode over the top of you it would indicate exactly nothing about either of our abilities.

Recently I saw a couple of guys in the distance on a training ride, who I caught up to over a period of time and went past. One of them was a Rabobank rider who placed in at least one (and maybe two stages) of The Tour of California. Given that I've seen him race a number of times (and we are not even in the same universe of ability), it's stupid to think that me rolling over him in a training run indicates anything other than we were both out riding bikes on the same day (even if he did have a sweet Colnago!)

--brett

I am not you, nor do I want to be. DQ

 

[sogood]

Nobody likes alienator.

Not true! Alienator has knowledge and has an objective angle on things.

As for his sharp flames, then either suckers have volunteered as flame baits or walked in unknowingly. Either way, it's a feature and entertainment if you know how not to get personal in an online world. It's all just a bit of fun...

 

[Walrus]

I stopped making assumptions about other rider's abilities once I realised that people ride for different purposes all the time. eg. I was riding in the hills recently on my carbon fibre LOOK. I heard someone on my tail, didn't think anything of it. I sensed the guy pulling around to pass me, and as he passed I turned to see that it was a late 40's bigger guy on an old custom steel frame (local builder called Hillman). He looked at me and said "Try to keep up" ...looking down at my bike, then he bolted. I didn't say a word, just kept riding.

What this guy didn't know, was that I was on a recovery ride ! 2 days prior I'd taken part in the Alpine Classic, a 200km ride with 3750m climbing. If I was fresh, the guy wouldn't have caught me in the first place!

From that point forth, I vowed not to make assumptions when I passed people or got passed myself. The fact is, you just don't know what sort of ride someone is on, how hard they're trying or what riding they've done that day or earlier.

 

[geoinmillbrook]

Not true! Alienator has knowledge and has an objective angle on things.

As for his sharp flames, then either suckers have volunteered as flame baits or walked in unknowingly. Either way, it's a feature and entertainment if you know how not to get personal in an online world. It's all just a bit of fun...

Hmmm very interesting (and entertaining) study in human behavior, I agree Tests social mores on both counts. The passive aggressive "older racer", notably proud to have won his perceived race against a younger and "better equipped" opponent, and his rival, who points out the possible falacies of the event. I think a neutral, objective observer would say that the Alienator truly lives up to his name in being pretty callous in the delivery of these possible truths, and hence draws out a defensive response. I also think he enjoys doing this, in order to facilitate the verbal sparring that seems to entertain him (and us) . No epiphany here, just fun.
Leave the old guy alone with his fantasy, one day you too will be proud to just pass someone in the hallway in your wheelchair is my vote. Since we are in a public forum , we all get to have a say ha ! I say you go guy - if it makes you feel good to have imaginary races against unbeatable odds, go for it. Who are you hurting ? I won't pass judgement on your judgement of the other rider either -- the lack of salutation and acknowledgement of your "friendly overtures" was either a self fullfilled prophecy,a real sign of disdain and exhaustion from a beaten foe, or simply as others say - he was just thinking about something else and didn't even notice you. We weren't there and can't judge the body language and other modes of communicative signals that bring us to your perception.

To get back to what might have been a possibly interesting facet of this post, and why I started to read it, is -- how much can equipment really buy you in your own "performance" ? I just built a bike that weighs about 18 lbs for my wife, to replace the 24 lb steelie she bought in 1988. Both bikes have pretty similar geometry. I did some research on it and found a pretty good article. I wish I could find it again so I could post a link. The bottom line for the author (who seemed to be a very knowledgeable owner of a good bike shop) was buy a bike (or two) that best fits your riding style, body fit, habits and pocket book - in terms of geometry, components and materials. The lightest racing bike is only allowed to be 15 lbs. Most modern "good" bikes are within 3-9 lbs of this. That is a lot if you are a racer or more than a casual rider, but add into context our own body weight and it's fluctuations and things come into perspective. A 20-60% difference in bike weight becomes only a less than 1 to 5 % difference overall when you add a 160lb rider to the equation. Add mindset (I don't feel like pedaling that hard right now) and these variables become even less important. I found a lot of humor in some of the discussions about "weight weenies".. And really light bikes with aero wheels and spokes can sometimes become unstable at high speeds on a downhill, so it can even be a bit of a compromise on the lighter side. It makes sense if you understand that the centripital force of a turning wheel combined with weight is what provides stability. I think one thing is for sure from everything I read - the form and "sustainable horsepower to weight ratio" of the rider is probably the single most determinant factor for almost all but the most competitive racers - where the differences between racers and bikes performances are sometimes measured in pieces of seconds. So if you are riding similarly geometried road bikes, that weigh within a few pounds of each other, whether you have DA or Sora components, an all carbon or modern steel frame, in a single day (or in this case, a single hill), it probably makes very little difference for most riders that aren't elite competitors.
Since it's been snowing and below freezing since I built my wifes new bike, we haven't been able to test it out. I am hoping she will be able to climb easier with a lighter bike. It sure is easier to pick up and move around the garage ! It has an aluminum frame but carbon seat stays and fork, so I am hoping it has some of the comfort of her old steelie. Should be interesting to see.
I just built an aluminum cyclocross with a carbon fork bike to replace my old 1984 Univega touring steelie bike too, I'm interested in seeing the difference.. can't wait till this snow melts !

Geo