28 mm tires too wide?

[[email protected]]

Hi,

I'm sure this has been covered before, but I can't find anything
relevant by searching.

I've got a pair of 700c x 28 Panaracer Paselas that I intended to use
on my commuter bike. I'm not exactly sure what the width of the rims
are -- subjectively I'd describe them as being standard road-racing
style rims. They're Arayas, and the previous tires were WTB Caminos
700x23.

I put the Paselas on and the intertube (@80 psi) on the rear started
bulging out the side and popped. I figured I did something wrong and
tried again. This time it worked fine, and I rode the tires a couple
hundred miles before getting a puncture. After repairing the tube, I
remounted the Pasela (again, the rear), pumped it to 80 psi, and the
tube bulged and popped yet again.

I've never had this bulging problem with any other tire, so I'm
thinking that it's just too wide for the rim - but that's surprising to
me as 28 mm seems pretty conservative for a "wide" tire.

So do you think that the tire/rim combo just aren't compatible, or am I
just incompetent when it comes to mounting tires?

Thanks..

kw tyre tyres

 

[maxo]

Just sounds like the beads weren't seated. a 28mm Pasela should fit the
vast majority of 700c rims in existence.

 

[Robert]

[email protected] wrote:
---8<----cut
700c x 28 Panaracer Paselas
---8<---
> I put the Paselas on and the intertube (@80 psi) on the rear started
> bulging out the side and popped. I figured I did something wrong and
> tried again. This time it worked fine, and I rode the tires a couple
> hundred miles before getting a puncture. After repairing the tube, I
> remounted the Pasela (again, the rear), pumped it to 80 psi, and the
> tube bulged and popped yet again.
---8<---

I have not used these tyres ever but I have an idea, for what it's worth:

You may need to be sure that the bead is seated evenly, around the whole
circumference of the rim. If it is uneven, then there may be a point on
the rim where the tube can peek through between the tyre bead and the
edge of the rim. Put a small amount of air in, then spin the wheel to
see if the tyre is even, all the way around. Adjust the bead according
to need.

This is a risk that I deal with, using my Veloflex masters (700x20C).
Wonderful tyre, easy to remove using thumb and forefinger, no tyre irons
needed, but if I were to just slap it on, I would get a blowout as you
describe, guaranteed. So I do as described above and I'm a very happy user.

HTH /Robert

 

[Fixed Gear Zombie]

That seems reasonable. I'm just perplexed that it's happened twice
with these tires and never before in the 100s of times I've mounted
tires.

thanks for the reply.

 

[Fixed Gear Zombie]

Thanks Robert, that sounds like it might do the trick. The tire does
fit rather loosely so perhaps a little less haste in mounting and
pressurizing it would be appropriate.

 

[Mark Hickey]

[email protected] wrote:

>I've got a pair of 700c x 28 Panaracer Paselas that I intended to use
>on my commuter bike. I'm not exactly sure what the width of the rims
>are -- subjectively I'd describe them as being standard road-racing
>style rims. They're Arayas, and the previous tires were WTB Caminos
>700x23.
>
>I put the Paselas on and the intertube (@80 psi) on the rear started
>bulging out the side and popped. I figured I did something wrong and
>tried again. This time it worked fine, and I rode the tires a couple
>hundred miles before getting a puncture. After repairing the tube, I
>remounted the Pasela (again, the rear), pumped it to 80 psi, and the
>tube bulged and popped yet again.
>
>I've never had this bulging problem with any other tire, so I'm
>thinking that it's just too wide for the rim - but that's surprising to
>me as 28 mm seems pretty conservative for a "wide" tire.
>
>So do you think that the tire/rim combo just aren't compatible, or am I
>just incompetent when it comes to mounting tires?

My bet is that you simply had some tube pinched between the tire and
rim. I've mounted fatter Panaracer tires on "thin rims" and never had
a blow-off, even though I tend to run 'em at well over the rated
pressure. The fact the tires stayed on fine for hundreds of miles
between incidents reinforces my guess.

Mark Hickey
Habanero Cycles
http://www.habcycles.com
Home of the $795 ti frame

 

[Art Harris]

Make sure the bead is seated and that the tube isn't pinched under the
bead. Pump it up to about 20 psi and check again that the bead is
seated evenly all around the rim. If yes, pump to full pressure.

Art Harris

 

[Michael Press]

In article
<[email protected]>,
"Art Harris" <[email protected]> wrote:

> Make sure the bead is seated and that the tube isn't pinched under the
> bead. Pump it up to about 20 psi and check again that the bead is
> seated evenly all around the rim. If yes, pump to full pressure.

I take one more step that I never saw anyone else do or
suggest. After checking with partial pressure, I deflate
the tire, inflate to 40 psi, check, and deflate. Then I
fully inflate.

--
Michael Press

 

[araby]

"Mark Hickey" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> [email protected] wrote:
>
>>I've got a pair of 700c x 28 Panaracer Paselas that I intended to use
>>on my commuter bike. I'm not exactly sure what the width of the rims
>>are -- subjectively I'd describe them as being standard road-racing
>>style rims. They're Arayas, and the previous tires were WTB Caminos
>>700x23.
>>
>>I put the Paselas on and the intertube (@80 psi) on the rear started
>>bulging out the side and popped. I figured I did something wrong and
>>tried again. This time it worked fine, and I rode the tires a couple
>>hundred miles before getting a puncture. After repairing the tube, I
>>remounted the Pasela (again, the rear), pumped it to 80 psi, and the
>>tube bulged and popped yet again.
>>
>>I've never had this bulging problem with any other tire, so I'm
>>thinking that it's just too wide for the rim - but that's surprising to
>>me as 28 mm seems pretty conservative for a "wide" tire.
>>
>>So do you think that the tire/rim combo just aren't compatible, or am I
>>just incompetent when it comes to mounting tires?
>
> My bet is that you simply had some tube pinched between the tire and
> rim. I've mounted fatter Panaracer tires on "thin rims" and never had
> a blow-off, even though I tend to run 'em at well over the rated
> pressure. The fact the tires stayed on fine for hundreds of miles
> between incidents reinforces my guess.

That's also been my experience. I have a couple of Pasela 32mm (actually
28mm) fitted to a comparatively thin rim and have had no problems.

Cheers,

R.

 

[Fixed Gear Zombie]

Thanks for the replies, everyone.

I did as many of you recommended, and inflated the tire partially to
check if the bead was seated. That's when I noticed that there was a
tiny cut in the sidewall. I think that I would have assumed this was
the problems from the getgo, except that the first time I had the
bulging problem (ahem) was when the tire was brand spanking new. So I
think there was either a quality control problem with this particular
tire, or I or my LBS somehow damaged it.. But then, I probably
wouldn't have been able to ride on it for a couple hundred miles in
between the two pops. So I'm a bit confused.

Anyhow, your advice is appreciated, and I'm going to use the partial
inflaton method from now on.

PS it seems that at least one other person on this group has had a
similar problem with the Pasela:

http://groups.google.com/group/rec....aracer+pasela+problem&rnum=2#8bc0dfe7579deafc

Kevin
(original poster, trying out a different handle)

 

[A Muzi]

[email protected] wrote:
> I've got a pair of 700c x 28 Panaracer Paselas that I
intended to use
> on my commuter bike. I'm not exactly sure what the width of the rims
> are -- subjectively I'd describe them as being standard road-racing
> style rims. They're Arayas, and the previous tires were WTB Caminos
> 700x23.
>
> I put the Paselas on and the intertube (@80 psi) on the rear started
> bulging out the side and popped. I figured I did something wrong and
> tried again. This time it worked fine, and I rode the tires a couple
> hundred miles before getting a puncture. After repairing the tube, I
> remounted the Pasela (again, the rear), pumped it to 80 psi, and the
> tube bulged and popped yet again.
>
> I've never had this bulging problem with any other tire, so I'm
> thinking that it's just too wide for the rim - but that's surprising to
> me as 28 mm seems pretty conservative for a "wide" tire.
>
> So do you think that the tire/rim combo just aren't compatible, or am I
> just incompetent when it comes to mounting tires?

Tires bulge and blow off when they are not installed evenly
on the rim.
Ensure the rim liner is not covering the bead ( tire seat
area) of the rim .
When you mount the tire, inflate the tube so it is round in
cross section, i.e., just enough air so it cannot fold over
itself. Ensure the tube is not caught under the edge of the
tire.
After mounting the tire, inflate to 30-50 psi and spin the
wheel in midair. See the raised molded line just above the
braking surface? It has to be visible all around on both
sides.

Are your TourGuard tires the folding model? not all rims can
use folding tires.
Araya 16A for example has no lip and needs a tire with a
steel wire bead.







--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

 

[[email protected]]

Fixed Gear Zombie wrote:

> I did as many of you recommended, and inflated the tire partially to
> check if the bead was seated. That's when I noticed that there was a
> tiny cut in the sidewall. I think that I would have assumed this was
> the problems from the getgo, except that the first time I had the
> bulging problem (ahem) was when the tire was brand spanking new. So I
> think there was either a quality control problem with this particular
> tire, or I or my LBS somehow damaged it.. But then, I probably
> wouldn't have been able to ride on it for a couple hundred miles in
> between the two pops. So I'm a bit confused.

More likely you incurred the slice yourself, in use/transport. Lots of
junk on the roads out there...

The tire either seats or it doesn't. You can look at the last area
where the tire went over the edge of the rim; with no air in the tube
it's pretty easy to see if there's any tube visible, or the bead isn't
sitting right, if you can't quite see the piece of tube that's holding
it up. On a tight tire, it's good to make sure the tube doesn't get
caught between the rim and tire bead as the last part of the tire goes
over the top edge of the rim. A tire lever, upside down, makes a good
poker to get the tube up into the tire. With loose tires, sometimes
putting just enough air to hold the tube in place will keep it out from
between bead and rim. You might have to let the air out to get the last
bit of tire over the rim

The last one I mis-intstalled (pow), I was in a hurry... Well, there's
always time to do it over, plus the "tube fine" <g>. --D-y

 

[Fixed Gear Zombie]

They are not the folding model (kevlar belt but steel bead, I believe),
but that's an interesting issue that you bring up. I never heard of
that before - I always assumed clinchers were clinchers were clinchers.
Good to be aware of that.

The rear tire was damaged and is now in the trash; I mounted the other
one on the rear wheel, inflated it to about 30 psi, and checked the
tire. It seems fine now, so I'll see how it goes.

Thanks,
Kevin

 

[Fixed Gear Zombie]

> More likely you incurred the slice yourself, in use/transport. Lots of
> junk on the roads out there...

Maybe, but the cut is right on the seam above the bead; it looks like
it just came apart. "Cut" probably isn't the right word - it's more of
a tear.

> The last one I mis-intstalled (pow), I was in a hurry... Well, there's
> always time to do it over, plus the "tube fine"

Haste, I believe, was the main culprit for me. Even if the tire was
damaged from the beginning, I would have realized it if I had been more
careful, and should have been able to get an exchange. Now, I've got
some miles on the tires so I'm stuck with them - and have a "tire fine"
as well.

Thanks,
Kevin

 

[Hank Wirtz]

"Fixed Gear Zombie" <[email protected]> wrote in
news:[email protected]:


>
> PS it seems that at least one other person on this group has had a
> similar problem with the Pasela:
>
Two, if you read the whole thread (I should know, I was the second...) But
I've about 700-800 miles on them now (since, what? August?) and haven't had
any problems. The ride really nicely.