3000 miles in 10 months... so Why am I still fat?

[Terry Morse]

Roger Zoul wrote:

> Terry Morse wrote:
> ::
> :: Reading "you don't have to watch you(r) fat intake" doesn't scare
> :: me. It makes me laugh. If P.T. Barnum were still alive, I think he'd
> :: also find the humor in it.
>
> Where is the humor in it? I've lost 130 lbs on a low carb diet without
> worrying about fat intake other than to not eat too many calories. And I
> have improved blood lipids to show for it.

The humor is that it is a ridiculous statemet. If you eat too much
food, no matter what it's made of, you will gain weight. The
statement should correctly read "you don't have to watch your fat
intake, as long as you don't eat too much of it". Wow, there's a
revelation!
--
terry morse Palo Alto, CA http://bike.terrymorse.com/

 

[Terry Morse]

Roger Zoul wrote:

> Rick Onanian wrote:

> ::: She also suggested riding easy first thing in the morning BEFORE
> ::: breakfast so the body has to switch to fat because the glycogen
> ::: stores will be low (sound like a recipe for the BONK to me).
> ::
> :: Try it, if you can, and figure out how far you can go before
> :: bonking. Do only that much, then gradually raise it up. This will
> :: certainly get your body running well for the rest of your day, too.
>
> More nonsense. I follow a low-carb diet...that means I'm always low on
> glycogen. Yet, I always ride in the morning with only some coffee in me.
> Unless he is pushing his limits and actually exercising anaerobically, he
> won't bonk out.

FWIW, you don't have to go anaerobic to deplete your muscle
glycogen. Simply riding at a lower cadence with the same power
output will accelerate the depletion rate. Glycogen usage is tied to
muscle effort.
--
terry morse Palo Alto, CA http://bike.terrymorse.com/

 

[Roger Zoul]

Badger_South wrote:
:: On Wed, 19 May 2004 10:15:42 -0400, "Roger Zoul"
:: <[email protected]> wrote:
::
::::: But don't stop with just these suggestions. Get the bible "The
::::: Ketogenic Diet" by Lyle McDonald, and "Protein Power" by Eades and
::::: learn the facts yourself.
:::
::: Right. I recommend Lyle's book, but PP is great too (better than
::: Atkins on the science).
::
:: The thing is, you (the OP) can not just go by what ppl say. You have
:: to understand the 'science' behind it. It's all based on insulin
:: response.
::
:: It doesn't mean you have to be committed and disciplined. For me,
:: though, being on LC allows me to 'intellectually' take control of my
:: eating. Otherwise, being a carb addict, I could eat a horse made of
:: pizza twice a day. <g>

Me too. Actually, there are many who fall into the same boat. Understanding
the science of it will allow you to understand why you can pick up 10 lbs of
weight over a weekend, but then lose it quickly the following week once you
resume LC eating.

 

[Bubba@FL]

I'm sorry to upset you, but the low carb/high protein diet is just that, a
fad. Also, the 1950's were the Golden-Age of fad diets so it's no surprise
that this was spawned from that era. This is an example of our society's
ongoing search for the "quick-fix". It will continue to be popular until the
next mass marketed diet craze comes along. Carbohydrates are critical to
every day body functions. Without them the body has a hard time breaking
down complex proteins into the amino acids it needs, especially those found
in vegetables. Any vegetarian can confirm that. Their carbohydrate intake
levels are usually higher than the average meat-eater yet they stay healthy
and maintain weight. These low-carb diets tell people to avoid starchy
fruits and vegetables like carrots, potatoes, bananas, beans, and corn, all
of which are packed with vitamins, minerals, trace elements, and fiber that
are vital to good health. Perhaps the problem is that the people who
practice these diets do not understand what carbohydrates are. There are
many different types which are broken down into two basic categories,
complex and simple. The simple carbs are the refined sugars and starches. To
the body they are the equivelant of jet fuel and should be eaten in very low
levels. These are also the group of carbs that diabetics are mainly
concerned with since their bodies do not produce enough insulin to
efficiently break them down. Complex carbs are found in all plant based
foods that have not been tampered with by us. Their longer and more complex
"chains" provide the body with a steady energy supply as well as many of the
complex proteins, vitimins, and minerals required for proper cellular
function. Did you know that some complex carbohydrates actually require more
calories to break them down than they provide the body. This, in part, is
why even sedentary vegetarians can maintain their weight.

As a bodybuilder, it is essential that you understand how your body works
and uses the food you put in it or you're wasting your time. Several weeks
before a competition, most bodybuilders will reduce their carbohydrate and
fluid levels to a bare minimum. This is to reduce body fat to a very low
level and make the skin thin and taught, allowing more muscle to be seen.
This is only done for short periods because there's a problem. Because fat
stores contain little or no proteins, vitamins, or minerals the body will
start to scavenge what in needs from muscle tissue and internal organs. This
is basicly what you are doing to your body when you deprive it of complex
carbohydrates. No one yet knows what the affect these diets may have long
term. You could be doing irreversible damage to your body by following these
fads. This is also the reason most of these diets fail. When you deprive
your body of something it needs it sends you signals in the form of powerful
cravings. For most people these cravings become too much and they binge to
satisfy them, eventually gaining all the weight back and then some. This is
the body's way of protecting itself should you decide to do something stupid
like this again. This, in a nutshell, is why these fad diets don't work and
can be dangerous.

The human body is a magnificently complex machine. How your body handles
carbohydrates and other foods was determined by your parents, your genetic
makeup. Everyone is different and must fine tune their diet and lifestyle to
themselves. Be healthy in body and spirit.

One final note - Disagree with me if you will but if you are going to insult
me, please have the decency to improve your vocabulary and spelling to at
least mask your apparent ignorance.

Take care all & keep the faith -
CHRIS

curt <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
> > Diet - Again, with your body type, a big obsticle is going to be your
slow
> > metabolic rate. Try to avoid simple carbohydrates (refined sugars, white
> > breads, etc.) DO NOT do the low-carb/high protein fad diets. They are
very
> > unhealthy and any weight loss is temporary. Forget the three big meals a
> day
> > thing and eat smaller meals more often and most importantly, learn to
> > recognize when you are satisfied, not full! Other than that just try to
> eat
> > a balanced diet and drink lots of water.
>
> I would hardly call low carbohydrate diets a fad. They have been around
> since the 50's that I know of. They are just in the news a lot because
> people have wised up. A low carb diet is much more than any fad. It
> actually works. You would need to at least read the Atkins book to have
an
> understanding of how it works, but I can tell from your post you know
> nothing about it and just call it a fad diet. You also have lots to learn
> about low carbohydrate diets. Who do you think you are calling them
> unhealthy? Do you know there are diabetics on this diet and now can go
off
> there medications? Do you know there are plenty of people that have lost
> over 100 pounds and they keep it off with their knowledge of low carb?
>
> I suggest you stick to your X armature body building status and no try and
> be a Doctor or nutrition.
>
> If I was the original poster, the first thing I would do is cut the carbs.
> What is funny, you suggested the same thing, but you just don't like the
> works low carb.
>
> Enjoy,
> Curt
>
>
>

 

[Neil Cherry]

On Wed, 19 May 2004 21:06:25 +0800, Mathias Koerber wrote:
> On Wed, 19 May 2004 02:44:51 +0000, Badger_South wrote:

>> You may be surprised just how much you're eating, how much you're eating
>> at one meal, how much sugar and starch you're eating, and may be
>> overestimating the mileage.

> One more comment (though I too am neither a dietician nor in any way
> trained or experienced in any health-related field).
>
> It seems that the body starts burning stored energy (fats) only after
> about 1hr (ymmv) orf excercise, so you will need a longer ride to burn off
> the readily available energy before you start using up the reserves.
> a 15-30 mile (short ride) daily will thus provide a generally good
> training but do nothing (much) for loss of weight.

I've also heard that but I'm not sure I beleive that. I've been doing
rides each weekend in the spring, summer and fall that average 60
miles for the last few years. I find the inches come off slowly and
stop around September. First a little background. I ride all year long
(NJ) and my weight goes from ~175 - 196 (the most I've ever weighed),
5'8", medium build, 42 years old. I ride long miles. I'm currently up
to 225-250 miles weeks. Centuries on Saturday and I am commuting twice
a week (20 each way). I've started doing some light weights for the
upper body, push ups, crunches & leg lifts for the rest. I've tried to
watch what I eat but I doubt I'm doing a very good job. I don't watch
my weight but I do measure my middle and I've only lost 2" off the
middle since January (~2000 miles total). The reason I don't watch my
wieght is that I have no scales at home and when I get to work I will
have polished off part of the contents of my Camel Back. So I could
wiegh anywhere from 1 to 6 lbs additinal in water weight. I find the
middle the one location I can't loose the weight easily. I probably
loose it by September and I'll still have a waste of 36" (I'll only
loose the handles but not the rest). I will say this much, my speed is
up, my endurance is up and my climbing has improved some (I live in
the flat lands). I can now push the big ring and still keep my cadence
at ~90 RPM. Oh, on my commute I throw on a BOB trailer and just about
throw everything in there I might possible need (I tell everyone it's
for my llunch ;-). I will be changing my diet in about a month but
first I have a double century to tackle in early June so no changes!

--
Linux Home Automation Neil Cherry [email protected]
http://home.comcast.net/~ncherry/ (Text only)
http://linuxha.sourceforge.net/ (SourceForge)
http://hcs.sourceforge.net/ (HCS II)

 

[Steve Knight]

O
>I don't diet per se, but I do eat sensibly. The days that I've tracked my
>caloric intake it's usually right between 2500 - 3000. One friend who is a
>"wellness" expert suggests I'm not eating *ENOUGH*.
I have had this problem too. when I found the right spot and ate more I started
loosing far more. Now I have to redo it and I am trying to find the sweet spot.
pretty pathetic to have to eat more to loose (G)

--
Knight-Toolworks & Custom Planes
Custom made wooden planes at reasonable prices
See http://www.knight-toolworks.com For prices and ordering instructions.

 

[Steve Knight]

>Well, for much of human history people were lean indeed on a diet of complex
>carbs, mainly in the form of grains, vegetables and very little animal
>protein. It is quite easy to have a diet like that and be quite lean.

humans only started eating grains when we learned to cultivate. we did not
evolve eating grains.

--
Knight-Toolworks & Custom Planes
Custom made wooden planes at reasonable prices
See http://www.knight-toolworks.com For prices and ordering instructions.

 

[S o r n i]

Rick Onanian wrote:

> Embrace your aerobelly.

So then, like, ride no-handed?

Bill "in a literal mood, I guess" S.

 

[Denver C. Fox]

>humans only started eating grains when we learned to cultivate. we did not
>evolve eating grains.

And life expectancy was . . . maybe 25 years?


http://members.aol.com/foxcondorsrvtns
(Colorado rental condo)

http://members.aol.com/dnvrfox
(Family Web Page)

 

[Matt O'Toole]

Doug Cook wrote:

> The story thus far....
>
> 12 years ago - single, 6'3", 180lbs., hair, and competing in citizens
> class triathlons.
>
> Fast forward to last July... Married, two kids, mortgage, no hair,
> sedentary, 279lbs.
>
> Sick of that fat man in the mirror, I bought some XXL cycling clothes,
> dusted off and tuned up my old Trek, and started riding again. Now 10
> months and close to 3000 miles later... I still weigh 274! I mean...
> come on! 3000 miles for 5 pounds?!
>
> My fitness level has increased tremendously. I use to struggle on 10
> mile rides. Now I do at least 3-4 weekday rides of 15-30 miles each
> and one weekend ride for 50-70 miles - all solo. My computer puts my
> average speed for these rides between 16-18mph depending upon the
> particular ups&downs of the ride. My HRM says my average rate is
> usually right about 75% of max (although that can vary, usually on
> the high side, when the ride has climbing). I feel lean and mean
> while I ride, but when I get home I wonder who that fat guy in the
> mirror is!
>
> I don't diet per se, but I do eat sensibly. The days that I've
> tracked my caloric intake it's usually right between 2500 - 3000.

That still may be more than you need. Plus, what about the days you're not
tracking? A 500 calorie difference a day equals a pound a week -- one way or
the other. The days you're burning more than you eat are probably being offset
by the ones when you're not paying attention. You may very well be eating more
on those days without realizing it.

> One friend who is a "wellness" expert suggests I'm not eating
> *ENOUGH*. Although she readily admits she doesn't specialize in
> athletes ("slovenly couch potato" is how she describes her typical
> client), she says that with my activity level my BMR is 5300... as
> she explained it that's the number of calories needed to just
> maintain my weight! Therefore she thinks my body thinks it's being
> starved and refuses to let go of the fat. She thinks by eating MORE
> the body will move away from this starvation reflex and start
> shedding pounds. She also suggested riding easy first thing in the
> morning BEFORE breakfast so the body has to switch to fat because the
> glycogen stores will be low (sound like a recipe for the BONK to me).

All this is nonsense, and probably based on the typical kind of pseudo-science
most of these pop nutritionists and "experts" buy into. First of all, the same
principles apply to athletes as everyone else. Second, there's no way you have
a BMR of 5300 -- even mountaineers who repeatedly hump 50 LB loads up 3000', 45
deg slopes don't need that much food. Tour de France riders hardly need that
much.

> Well, I tried to eat 4000 calories today and about died! I felt
> horrible, stuffed, tired, etc. I tried riding with just water (no
> sport drink), and found myself craving sugar after the ride.

This is a red flag to me -- you're a carb addict. Most Americans are. So lay
off the simple carbs! Learn what complex carbs really are, and learn to eat
them in proper moderation. Do this for a month, and the cravings will go away.
I'm not a fan of contemporary low carb diets, but there's a grain of truth in
them along with all the pseudo-science hokum. If you want to read a diet book,
look into the Zone Diet or the South Beach diet. Or eat like a diabetic is
supposed to, even if you're not one. (You may be -- get that checked.)

> Any experts lurking out there that would like to comment? Are there
> any coaching services online that could help customize my training to
> help me lose weight? I can't afford to hire a coach.

This doesn't have to be expensive or inconvenient. One of my friends is using a
coach who works online. You just plug in your eating and riding stats, plus a
few other things, and get recommendations every few days by email or phone. The
cost is less than, say, a couple of meals out a month. I can get you the info
if you're interested.

Matt O.

 

[Steve Knight]

On Wed, 19 May 2004 06:03:15 -0400, "Roger Zoul" <[email protected]> wrote:

>Nonsense on not eating enough. You need to eat less. i suggest you use
>fitday.com to track everything you eat. Limit calories to about 2200 per
>day. You may want to try low-carb if you have problems with
>hunger/appetite.


how is it nonsense? I was stuck for awhile not loosing and cycling 5 days a
week. once I started increasing my food intake I started loosing 2 pounds a
week. I had to find the sweet spot.

--
Knight-Toolworks & Custom Planes
Custom made wooden planes at reasonable prices
See http://www.knight-toolworks.com For prices and ordering instructions.

 

[David Kerber]

In article <[email protected]>, stevek@knight-
toolworks.com says...
>
>
> >Well, for much of human history people were lean indeed on a diet of complex
> >carbs, mainly in the form of grains, vegetables and very little animal
> >protein. It is quite easy to have a diet like that and be quite lean.
>
> humans only started eating grains when we learned to cultivate. we did not
> evolve eating grains.

We evolved eating most anything which nourish us, and that includes wild
grains. Why would we have started cultivating grains if we didn't
already know they were good to eat? And fruit is one of the major food
sources in forested areas. The entire primate family eats lots of both
plant and animal materials for food, and that includes humans.

--
Remove the ns_ from if replying by e-mail (but keep posts in the
newsgroups if possible).

 

[Q.]

"curt" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
<snip>
> I suggest you stick to your X armature body building status and no try and
> be a Doctor or nutrition.

Are you a doctor or nutritionist?

C.Q.C.

 

[Roger Zoul]

Bubba@FL wrote:
:: I'm sorry to upset you, but the low carb/high protein diet is just
:: that, a fad. Also, the 1950's were the Golden-Age of fad diets so
:: it's no surprise that this was spawned from that era. This is an
:: example of our society's ongoing search for the "quick-fix". It will
:: continue to be popular until the next mass marketed diet craze comes
:: along.

:: Carbohydrates are critical to every day body functions.

Nonsense...provide one credible cite....

:: Without them the body has a hard time breaking down complex proteins
:: into the amino acids it needs, especially those found in vegetables.

First of all, we're talking low carb, not no carb. Secondly, nonsense. I
eat plenty of veggies and my body has no problems breaking them down.
Provide one cite!

:: Any vegetarian can confirm that. Their carbohydrate intake levels
:: are usually higher than the average meat-eater yet they stay healthy
:: and maintain weight.

There are plenty of overweight vegetarians and most of them eat refined
carbs while claiming to be vegetarians.

:: These low-carb diets tell people to avoid
:: starchy fruits and vegetables like carrots, potatoes, bananas,
:: beans, and corn, all of which are packed with vitamins, minerals,
:: trace elements, and fiber that are vital to good health.

You do know that there are other foods that are "packed" with vitamins,
minerals, trace elements and fiber, don't you? What about broccoli,
cauliflower, spinach, cabbage, greens, breen beans, kale, lettuce,
blueberries, strawberries, etc? One can name others too.

Perhaps the
:: problem is that the people who practice these diets do not
:: understand what carbohydrates are.

Nonsense. You don't.

There are many different types
:: which are broken down into two basic categories, complex and simple.
:: The simple carbs are the refined sugars and starches. To the body
:: they are the equivelant of jet fuel and should be eaten in very low
:: levels. These are also the group of carbs that diabetics are mainly
:: concerned with since their bodies do not produce enough insulin to
:: efficiently break them down. Complex carbs are found in all plant
:: based foods that have not been tampered with by us. Their longer and
:: more complex "chains" provide the body with a steady energy supply
:: as well as many of the complex proteins, vitimins, and minerals
:: required for proper cellular function. Did you know that some
:: complex carbohydrates actually require more calories to break them
:: down than they provide the body. This, in part, is why even
:: sedentary vegetarians can maintain their weight.

Nonsense. Any diabetic who has learned to eat to his/her meter will tell
you the effect of eating a potato or banana on their blood glucose. The
bottom line is the number of grams of carbs consumed. Sure, refined carbs
are the worst of the lot, but starchy carbs simulate blood sugar swings in
those who are insulin resistant (most very overweight people) and hence they
want to eat more. That's why on most LC diet those foods are restricted
severely during the weight loss phase and added back in at limited
quantities for maintenance.

::
:: As a bodybuilder, it is essential that you understand how your body
:: works and uses the food you put in it or you're wasting your time.

Nonsense. All you need to do is start young, lift heavy, rest, and eat.
Then practice dieting. Being a bodybuilder doesn't make you an expert on
much other than perhaps how to execute movements.

:: Several weeks before a competition, most bodybuilders will reduce
:: their carbohydrate and fluid levels to a bare minimum. This is to
:: reduce body fat to a very low level and make the skin thin and
:: taught, allowing more muscle to be seen.

Nonsense. Reducing carbs to a bare minimum will not, in and of itself,
result in reduced bodyfat. You're going to need to restrcit calories
relative to maintenance requirements.

This is only done for short
:: periods because there's a problem. Because fat stores contain little
:: or no proteins, vitamins, or minerals the body will start to
:: scavenge what in needs from muscle tissue and internal organs.

Nonsense...What about the protein that comes from diet? Reducing carbs
doesn't mean reducing dietary protein.

This
:: is basicly what you are doing to your body when you deprive it of
:: complex carbohydrates.

Good grief.

:: No one yet knows what the affect these diets
:: may have long term. You could be doing irreversible damage to your
:: body by following these fads.

I'm in better health than I have been in years. I've been doing LC since
Oct 2001, too.

This is also the reason most of these
:: diets fail. When you deprive your body of something it needs it
:: sends you signals in the form of powerful cravings.

What a joke....

For most people
:: these cravings become too much and they binge to satisfy them,
:: eventually gaining all the weight back and then some.

A single binge won't result in gaining all the weight back. And if people
who have been LCing occasionally do eat carbys foods, it's only because they
taste good. Having them once in a while won't make much difference, as long
as they remain the exception rather than the rule.

This is the
:: body's way of protecting itself should you decide to do something
:: stupid like this again. This, in a nutshell, is why these fad diets
:: don't work and can be dangerous.

Nonsense.

::
:: The human body is a magnificently complex machine. How your body
:: handles carbohydrates and other foods was determined by your
:: parents, your genetic makeup. Everyone is different and must fine
:: tune their diet and lifestyle to themselves. Be healthy in body and
:: spirit.

Wow...

::
:: One final note - Disagree with me if you will but if you are going
:: to insult me, please have the decency to improve your vocabulary and
:: spelling to at least mask your apparent ignorance.

Well, you've made your ignorance very obvious, Bubba.

::
:: Take care all & keep the faith -
:: CHRIS
::
:: curt <[email protected]> wrote in message
:: news:[email protected]...
:::
:::: Diet - Again, with your body type, a big obsticle is going to be
:::: your slow metabolic rate. Try to avoid simple carbohydrates
:::: (refined sugars, white breads, etc.) DO NOT do the low-carb/high
:::: protein fad diets. They are very unhealthy and any weight loss is
:::: temporary. Forget the three big meals a day thing and eat smaller
:::: meals more often and most importantly, learn to recognize when you
:::: are satisfied, not full! Other than that just try to eat a
:::: balanced diet and drink lots of water.
:::
::: I would hardly call low carbohydrate diets a fad. They have been
::: around since the 50's that I know of. They are just in the news a
::: lot because people have wised up. A low carb diet is much more
::: than any fad. It actually works. You would need to at least read
::: the Atkins book to have an understanding of how it works, but I can
::: tell from your post you know nothing about it and just call it a
::: fad diet. You also have lots to learn about low carbohydrate
::: diets. Who do you think you are calling them unhealthy? Do you
::: know there are diabetics on this diet and now can go off there
::: medications? Do you know there are plenty of people that have lost
::: over 100 pounds and they keep it off with their knowledge of low
::: carb?
:::
::: I suggest you stick to your X armature body building status and no
::: try and be a Doctor or nutrition.
:::
::: If I was the original poster, the first thing I would do is cut the
::: carbs. What is funny, you suggested the same thing, but you just
::: don't like the works low carb.
:::
::: Enjoy,
::: Curt

 

[David Kerber]

In article <[email protected]>, [email protected]
says...

....

> :: Without them the body has a hard time breaking down complex proteins
> :: into the amino acids it needs, especially those found in vegetables.
>
> First of all, we're talking low carb, not no carb. Secondly, nonsense. I
> eat plenty of veggies and my body has no problems breaking them down.
> Provide one cite!

Veggies typically have plenty of carbs anyway.


> :: Any vegetarian can confirm that. Their carbohydrate intake levels
> :: are usually higher than the average meat-eater yet they stay healthy
> :: and maintain weight.
>
> There are plenty of overweight vegetarians and most of them eat refined
> carbs while claiming to be vegetarians.

Refined sugar is still a vegetarian food: it comes from sugar beets or
sugar cane.


....

--
Remove the ns_ from if replying by e-mail (but keep posts in the
newsgroups if possible).

 

[H. M. Leary]

In article <[email protected]>,
David Kerber <ns_dkerber@ns_ids.net> wrote:

> In article <[email protected]>, stevek@knight-
> toolworks.com says...
> >
> >
> > >Well, for much of human history people were lean indeed on a diet of
> > >complex
> > >carbs, mainly in the form of grains, vegetables and very little animal
> > >protein. It is quite easy to have a diet like that and be quite lean.
> >
> > humans only started eating grains when we learned to cultivate. we did not
> > evolve eating grains.
>
> We evolved eating most anything which nourish us, and that includes wild
> grains. Why would we have started cultivating grains if we didn't
> already know they were good to eat? And fruit is one of the major food
> sources in forested areas. The entire primate family eats lots of both
> plant and animal materials for food, and that includes humans.


What? The entire primate family eats lots of humans?

Say it ain¹t so!

HAND
I hate T-Storms

--
³Freedom Is a Light for Which Many Have Died in Darkness³

- Tomb of the unknown - American Revolution

 

[Roger Zoul]

Terry Morse wrote:
:: Roger Zoul wrote:
::
::: Terry Morse wrote:
:::::
::::: Reading "you don't have to watch you(r) fat intake" doesn't scare
::::: me. It makes me laugh. If P.T. Barnum were still alive, I think
::::: he'd also find the humor in it.
:::
::: Where is the humor in it? I've lost 130 lbs on a low carb diet
::: without worrying about fat intake other than to not eat too many
::: calories. And I have improved blood lipids to show for it.
::
:: The humor is that it is a ridiculous statemet. If you eat too much
:: food, no matter what it's made of, you will gain weight. The
:: statement should correctly read "you don't have to watch your fat
:: intake, as long as you don't eat too much of it". Wow, there's a
:: revelation!

Well, most who follow a LC woe are trying to lose weight (fat). From a
practical POV, they limit carbs and not anything else. For the very
overweight, they get an appetite suppression effect from the removal of
carbs. That is mostly sufficient to result in reduced calorie intake.
Hence, they lose weight. At a certain point, after having lost a certain
amount of weight, it does become necessary to limit calories. However, that
doesn't imply directly limiting fat....

The reason this point needs to be made is because for some 20 to 30 years in
the US it has been claimed that eating fat make syou fat. Excessive calorie
intake makes you fat. So as long as one isn't eating too many calories,
there is no need to explicitly limit fat (assuming one is getting adequate
protein).

 

[Roger Zoul]

Terry Morse wrote:
:: Roger Zoul wrote:
::
::: Rick Onanian wrote:
::
:::::: She also suggested riding easy first thing in the morning BEFORE
:::::: breakfast so the body has to switch to fat because the glycogen
:::::: stores will be low (sound like a recipe for the BONK to me).
:::::
::::: Try it, if you can, and figure out how far you can go before
::::: bonking. Do only that much, then gradually raise it up. This will
::::: certainly get your body running well for the rest of your day,
::::: too.
:::
::: More nonsense. I follow a low-carb diet...that means I'm always
::: low on glycogen. Yet, I always ride in the morning with only some
::: coffee in me. Unless he is pushing his limits and actually
::: exercising anaerobically, he won't bonk out.
::
:: FWIW, you don't have to go anaerobic to deplete your muscle
:: glycogen. Simply riding at a lower cadence with the same power
:: output will accelerate the depletion rate. Glycogen usage is tied to
:: muscle effort.

Er, riding at a lower cadence with high power output (like going uphill in a
high gear or going very fast on a flat in high gear) is the same thing as
going anaerobic. Anaerobic activity is what uses sugar for fuel.

 

[Badger_South]

On Wed, 19 May 2004 11:31:28 -0400, "Roger Zoul" <[email protected]>
wrote:

>Badger_South wrote:
>:: On Wed, 19 May 2004 10:15:42 -0400, "Roger Zoul"
>:: <[email protected]> wrote:
>::
>::::: But don't stop with just these suggestions. Get the bible "The
>::::: Ketogenic Diet" by Lyle McDonald, and "Protein Power" by Eades and
>::::: learn the facts yourself.
>:::
>::: Right. I recommend Lyle's book, but PP is great too (better than
>::: Atkins on the science).
>::
>:: The thing is, you (the OP) can not just go by what ppl say. You have
>:: to understand the 'science' behind it. It's all based on insulin
>:: response.
>::
>:: It doesn't mean you have to be committed and disciplined. For me,
>:: though, being on LC allows me to 'intellectually' take control of my
>:: eating. Otherwise, being a carb addict, I could eat a horse made of
>:: pizza twice a day. <g>
>
>Me too. Actually, there are many who fall into the same boat. Understanding
>the science of it will allow you to understand why you can pick up 10 lbs of
>weight over a weekend, but then lose it quickly the following week once you
>resume LC eating.

This is, as you know, the TKD diet, in which you allow carbing up (within
reason) on weekends, presumably to reset your system and metabolism.

If you can do this, very good. I on the other hand have to keep a much
tighter reign on my carb intake. One slice of pizza and I know I risk
'falling off the wagon'. It's more a mental thing, and I know that's
atypical. It does allow me to foist a smug and superior attitude upon all
the weak and slovenly ppl around me though. (LOL, sarcasm meter pegging out
to the max).

-B

 

[curt]

This isn't a quick fix. Many people are on low carb for life. You need to
read about this and not just talk.

Good heavens, you really have not read anything about this. The more I read
what you are writing the more I realize you have not done any reading on
this subject. You are just labeling low carb diets and not learning about
them.

I really can't summarize the whole process to you, but I do recommend you
read Dr. Atkins book. I don't care if you don't believe in what he states
or not....I do care that you have an understanding of what he believed
before you say it is just a fad.

I think you are going to see the fad around for many many years. It will
out live us, because it is right for many people.


> I'm sorry to upset you, but the low carb/high protein diet is just that, a
> fad.

First of all, your first sentence show your ignorance. The popular diets
are low carbohydrates. That doesn't mean high protein.

> Also, the 1950's were the Golden-Age of fad diets so it's no surprise
> that this was spawned from that era. This is an example of our society's
> ongoing search for the "quick-fix". It will continue to be popular until
the
> next mass marketed diet craze comes along.

That is unlikely. As you are seeing or in your case choosing not to see,
many doctors (something you are not) are starting to realize that low carb
diets improve a host of things for people. Peoples blood work comes back
much better in most cases when on low carb. People are losing weight and
improving their health. You need to read, not bury your head in the sand.


> Carbohydrates are critical to
> every day body functions. Without them the body has a hard time breaking
> down complex proteins into the amino acids it needs, especially those
found
> in vegetables.

Interesting. I eat tons of vegetables on my low carb diet. I don't know
where you got the idea you can't eat vegetables?

I can see your mind is made up and you ran out of steam. Usually when
someone attacks someone's spelling, they have run out of ammunition.

All I can say, is read the book to better understand how the body works. If
you don't read the book and have an understanding of what the view is, how
can you have an opinion?

Curt

PS: your misspelled words BTW, I have none.

equivalent, vitamins, basically, obstacle


>Any vegetarian can confirm that. Their carbohydrate intake
> levels are usually higher than the average meat-eater yet they stay
healthy
> and maintain weight. These low-carb diets tell people to avoid starchy
> fruits and vegetables like carrots, potatoes, bananas, beans, and corn,
all
> of which are packed with vitamins, minerals, trace elements, and fiber
that
> are vital to good health. Perhaps the problem is that the people who
> practice these diets do not understand what carbohydrates are. There are
> many different types which are broken down into two basic categories,
> complex and simple. The simple carbs are the refined sugars and starches.
To
> the body they are the equivelant of jet fuel and should be eaten in very
low
> levels. These are also the group of carbs that diabetics are mainly
> concerned with since their bodies do not produce enough insulin to
> efficiently break them down. Complex carbs are found in all plant based
> foods that have not been tampered with by us. Their longer and more
complex
> "chains" provide the body with a steady energy supply as well as many of
the
> complex proteins, vitimins, and minerals required for proper cellular
> function. Did you know that some complex carbohydrates actually require
more
> calories to break them down than they provide the body. This, in part, is
> why even sedentary vegetarians can maintain their weight.
>
> As a bodybuilder, it is essential that you understand how your body works
> and uses the food you put in it or you're wasting your time. Several weeks
> before a competition, most bodybuilders will reduce their carbohydrate and
> fluid levels to a bare minimum. This is to reduce body fat to a very low
> level and make the skin thin and taught, allowing more muscle to be seen.
> This is only done for short periods because there's a problem. Because fat
> stores contain little or no proteins, vitamins, or minerals the body will
> start to scavenge what in needs from muscle tissue and internal organs.
This
> is basicly what you are doing to your body when you deprive it of complex
> carbohydrates. No one yet knows what the affect these diets may have long
> term. You could be doing irreversible damage to your body by following
these
> fads. This is also the reason most of these diets fail. When you deprive
> your body of something it needs it sends you signals in the form of
powerful
> cravings. For most people these cravings become too much and they binge to
> satisfy them, eventually gaining all the weight back and then some. This
is
> the body's way of protecting itself should you decide to do something
stupid
> like this again. This, in a nutshell, is why these fad diets don't work
and
> can be dangerous.
>
> The human body is a magnificently complex machine. How your body handles
> carbohydrates and other foods was determined by your parents, your genetic
> makeup. Everyone is different and must fine tune their diet and lifestyle
to
> themselves. Be healthy in body and spirit.
>
> One final note - Disagree with me if you will but if you are going to
insult
> me, please have the decency to improve your vocabulary and spelling to at
> least mask your apparent ignorance.
>
> Take care all & keep the faith -
> CHRIS
>
> curt <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
> >
> > > Diet - Again, with your body type, a big obsticle is going to be your
> slow
> > > metabolic rate. Try to avoid simple carbohydrates (refined sugars,
white
> > > breads, etc.) DO NOT do the low-carb/high protein fad diets. They are
> very
> > > unhealthy and any weight loss is temporary. Forget the three big meals
a
> > day
> > > thing and eat smaller meals more often and most importantly, learn to
> > > recognize when you are satisfied, not full! Other than that just try
to
> > eat
> > > a balanced diet and drink lots of water.
> >
> > I would hardly call low carbohydrate diets a fad. They have been around
> > since the 50's that I know of. They are just in the news a lot because
> > people have wised up. A low carb diet is much more than any fad. It
> > actually works. You would need to at least read the Atkins book to have
> an
> > understanding of how it works, but I can tell from your post you know
> > nothing about it and just call it a fad diet. You also have lots to
learn
> > about low carbohydrate diets. Who do you think you are calling them
> > unhealthy? Do you know there are diabetics on this diet and now can go
> off
> > there medications? Do you know there are plenty of people that have
lost
> > over 100 pounds and they keep it off with their knowledge of low carb?
> >
> > I suggest you stick to your X armature body building status and no try
and
> > be a Doctor or nutrition.
> >
> > If I was the original poster, the first thing I would do is cut the
carbs.
> > What is funny, you suggested the same thing, but you just don't like the
> > works low carb.
> >
> > Enjoy,
> > Curt
> >
> >
> >
>
>